# Foreign-Born Monarchs **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 4, 2010, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654 "2010-02-04T06:50:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2010, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/41 "2010-02-05T16:54:13Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > But in portions of France that were considered under English rule, IIRC. You get a “Yahbut” on this one. They were held by the persons who were Kings of England, yes, but in their capacity as vassals of the King of France. Hence they were parts of “France” from an anachronistic nationalistic frame of reference. (Your guess is as good as mine as to how people of the time would have viewed lands whose suzerain-lord and vassal-lord were at odds.) ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2010, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/42 "2010-02-06T03:11:36Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > [QUOTE=Cunctator] > His son William II, his grandson Stephen and his great-grandson Henry II were also born in France. But in portions of France that were considered under English rule, IIRC. [/QUOTE] I don’t think it’s accurate to say that those regions were under English rule. That concept is based on the idea of a nation-state, which was not the dominant political theory at that time. Rather, those regions were under the personal rule of their feudal lord, the Duke of Normandy and Anjou, who also happened to be the King of England. Similarly, even though the idea of the nation-state had evolved by the early 17th century, Scotland did pass under English rule when James VI/I succeeded to the English throne. The two nations happened to have the same monarch. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2010, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/43 "2010-02-06T03:26:57Z")
> [@psychonaut](#): > > Most co-princes of Andorra have probably never even _been_ to Andorra. At least half of them have: Seo d’Urgel is the last Spanish town on the road to Andorra, it would be pretty uncouth of the Bishop not to visit. Even more so once you take into account that his [Diocese](http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obispado_de_Urgel) includes Andorra. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2010, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/44 "2010-02-06T04:24:23Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > At least half of them have: Seo d’Urgel is the last Spanish town on the road to Andorra, it would be pretty uncouth of the Bishop not to visit. Even more so once you take into account that his [Diocese](http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obispado_de_Urgel) includes Andorra. With 84.5% of Andorra’s population 15 or older and 97% Catholic, it’s likely he’s the Head of State who has confirmed the most people of the country he is head of state of. (The Pope, also Head of State, presumably confirms few if any Vatican City residents. AFAIK, there are no other prelate heads of state.) ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2010, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/45 "2010-02-06T04:48:01Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > …AFAIK, there are no other prelate heads of state… How about this guy (yes, I know he’s exiled): [14th Dalai Lama - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/14th_Dalai_Lama) Also, Queen Elizabeth II is Supreme Governor of the Church of England: [Supreme Governor of the Church of England - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_Governor_of_the_Church_of_England) ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2010, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/46 "2010-02-06T04:56:41Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > How about this guy (yes, I know he’s exiled): [14th Dalai Lama - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/14th_Dalai_Lama) > > Also, Queen Elizabeth II is Supreme Governor of the Church of England: [Supreme Governor of the Church of England - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_Governor_of_the_Church_of_England) AFAIK the Dalai Lama doesn’t conduct a ‘sacramental’ action equivalent to confirmation for his faithful, though I could well be in error on that. And while Elizabeth’s Supreme Governorship imposes a certain duty on her with regard to the CofE, she remains a laywoman, empowered only to baptize and to marry. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2010, 10:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/47 "2010-02-06T10:40:16Z")
I shouldn’t post when I’m tired. I lost a “not” here: > [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Similarly, even though the idea of the nation-state had evolved by the early 17th century, Scotland did not pass under English rule when James VI/I succeeded to the English throne. The two nations happened to have the same monarch. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2010, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654/48 "2010-02-06T16:22:57Z")
> [@](#): > > AFAIK, there are no other prelate heads of state. Not now. But there used to be a bunch in Germany. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/foreign-born-monarchs/527654.md?page=2)