# Fork Hillary 3: The Final Forking **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 18, 2008, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726 "2008-03-18T00:01:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 74
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1461 "2008-05-09T16:57:42Z")
[QUOTE=Biggirl] I don’t think saying white people and hard working people don’t like Obama will help Hill with that. [/QUOTE] To put the most charitable interpretation on it – it’s possible that she meant that Hard Working People were in one set, and White People were in another, and that there’s an overlap between the 2 that support her. Or she meant that the two sets completely coincide. White People are hard-working, and others aren’t. Hoo boy. Either way…she’s going out with a bang, isn’t she? Auguring into the deck with guns blazing, bursting into flames, billowing smoke & leaking oil. It’d be spectacular as long as she doesn’t take the USS Democratic Party down with her when she crashes. ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1462 "2008-05-09T16:58:22Z")
[QUOTE=Biggirl] Didja notice how very carefully this article does not mention Hillary speaking of an exit strategy? In fact it states she is still talking about winning. Ah well. Only a few more contests to go. . .. [/QUOTE] But it does note how she is no longer attacking Obama, not even mentioning him. That’s the most important thing I see, as it indicates even she, somewhere beneath her delusions, knows it’s over. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1463 "2008-05-09T17:02:34Z")
[QUOTE=jsc1953] Either way…she’s going out with a bang, isn’t she? Auguring into the deck with guns blazing, bursting into flames, billowing smoke & leaking oil. It’d be spectacular as long as she doesn’t take the USS Democratic Party down with her when she crashes. [/QUOTE] I think in this society of up to the nano-second information; Most dems will vote if not for Obama, then to simply get a Dem back into the white house. I’ve got no problem with that really. As long as people get out and vote, and if there is one thing we all know Obama is good at, it’s getting people out to the stalls. Also, hats off to David Plouffe! ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1464 "2008-05-09T17:05:13Z")
[Rasmussen](http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/5/9/95859/11289/73/512505) agrees it’s over. (Apologies if this has already been posted.) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1465 "2008-05-09T17:08:56Z")
DemConWatch reports one more super: Edward Espinoza, the California DNC member who’d been writing under the alias “Mr. Super,” declared for Obama. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1466 "2008-05-09T17:22:48Z")
[QUOTE=jsc1953] Either way…she’s going out with a bang, isn’t she? Auguring into the deck with guns blazing, bursting into flames, billowing smoke & leaking oil. It’d be spectacular as long as she doesn’t take the USS Democratic Party down with her when she crashes. [/QUOTE] The Clinton [Deathwatch](http://www.slate.com/id/2190986/) is at 2.3% (she was still in the low double-digits a week ago). ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1467 "2008-05-09T17:48:19Z")
Rep. Rahm Emmanuel declares that Obama is “the presumptive nominee”. [http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24538157/](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24538157/) ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1468 "2008-05-09T17:54:13Z")
[QUOTE=garygnu] But it does note how she is no longer attacking Obama, not even mentioning him. That’s the most important thing I see, as it indicates even she, somewhere beneath her delusions, knows it’s over. [/QUOTE] Before or after the white people will vote for me remark? You know, maybe it was that remark that turned things around in the Hillary camp. It went over like a lead balloon and they have absolutely nothing left. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1469 "2008-05-09T17:56:31Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] Rep. Rahm Emmanuel declares that Obama is “the presumptive nominee”. [http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24538157/](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24538157/) [/QUOTE] Hoo boy. Another former Clinton White House staffer sure to go on their shit list. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1470 "2008-05-09T18:02:12Z")
Anybody notice how calm Obama looks as of the last 48 hours? He’s probably VERY relieved - and causiously optimistic. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1471 "2008-05-09T18:03:45Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] Hoo boy. Another former Clinton White House staffer sure to go on their shit list. [/QUOTE] Not only a former Clinton staffer, a fellow New Democrat/DLCer and **chair of the House Democratic Caucus**. That last one is BIG…he’s the fourth-ranking Democrat in the House, after Pelosi, Hoyer and Clyburn. The DLC connection is big, too. If Emmanuel is basically conceding Obama’s nomination, the DLC has given up overtly trying to control the election cycle. They may still bring pressure behind the scenes, but the big plan to put a Clinton in the White House again and outright control the party is kaput. Note that the “Clyburn” above is Jim Clyburn, House Majority Whip, and the previous chair of the House Democratic Caucus. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1472 "2008-05-09T18:05:04Z")
[QUOTE=Phlosphr] Anybody notice how calm Obama looks as of the last 48 hours? He’s probably VERY relieved - and causiously optimistic. [/QUOTE] I can well understand – it’s been grueling, and he’s been campaigning like a champ, and doing so with dignity. I’m sure they’re both exhausted, but the looks of relief vs. desperation from his opponent are quite apparent. Obama '08! ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1473 "2008-05-09T18:15:01Z")
[QUOTE=Biggirl] Before or after the white people will vote for me remark? You know, maybe it was that remark that turned things around in the Hillary camp. It went over like a lead balloon and they have absolutely nothing left. [/QUOTE] I’m not sure. [This story](http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/08/us/politics/08clinton.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&adxnnlx=1210356194-XE0z4DmBgLIucCeehxsHxA), from yesterday, is where I first heard that she didn’t mention Obama at a campaign stop, and it was reiterated in **Cervaise** ’s article today. The white people remark came yesterday but the two timestamps are unclear. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1474 "2008-05-09T18:27:27Z")
Rahm Emmanuel is much more than all that … he’s [Rahmbo The Terminator!](http://www.newsweek.com/id/130605) This from Newsweek 4/14. > [@](#): > > Rahm Emanuel has been described as a street fighter with a killer instinct—as explosive, profane, wired and ruthless—sometimes as a compliment, sometimes not. But no one has ever cast him in the role of elder statesman, at least up until now. … Who will tell Hillary Clinton that the time has come to fold her tent? … the most obvious candidate is Emanuel. He is an old friend of Barack Obama’s campaign strategist, David Axelrod (so close that Axelrod signed the ketuba, a Jewish marriage contract, at Emanuel’s wedding, an honor that usually goes to a best friend). At the same time, Emanuel worked on Bill Clinton’s '92 campaign and was an effective operative in the Clinton White House, and he is tight with various Clinton advisers like James Carville and former campaign manager Patti Solis Doyle (whom he calls his “little sister” from the Chicago political wars). He has the loyalty of many Democratic congressmen, whom he recruited and for whom he prodigiously fund-raised, helping to secure the Democratic majority in the 2006 election. … “I may, but there’s as good a chance I may not have to,” he says. With perhaps more hope than the realism for which he is generally known, Emanuel continued: “I have confidence in both of my friends that they will be good Democrats. Both candidates will do what’s necessary to help the party. Neither wants to be seen as a spoiler … They [the Clintons] are dear friends, and they have been selfless in their commitment to Democratic Party ideals.” … “I have a sneaking suspicion it’s over after North Carolina and Indiana [May 6],” says Emanuel. “It will be clear by then who the presumptive nominee is.” ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1475 "2008-05-09T18:58:51Z")
Regardless of the “street fighter with a killer instinct” BS, Rahm wields a lot of power in Dem party politics, and his power base is definitely the DLC wing of the party. His calling Obama the presumptive nominee is on a par with the announcers at a football game running through the names of their cameramen, statisticians, etc. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1476 "2008-05-09T19:01:26Z")
I see Hillary coming out onto the balcony, breaking into song… _“Don’t cry for me, Argentina…”_ Now, excuse me, I’ve got to check and make sure my dancing shoes are in good repair… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1477 "2008-05-09T19:03:18Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] I see Hillary coming out onto the balcony, breaking into song… _“Don’t cry for me, Argentina…”_ Now, excuse me, I’ve got to check and make sure my dancing shoes are in good repair… [/QUOTE] A more appropriate song would be “Another Suitcase in Another Hall”… Whereas Obama’s big song would be “Star Quality”, of course… Sorry…my inner Theater Geek slipped out there… ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1478 "2008-05-09T19:13:47Z")
And this just in…(or is it just in, hard to keep up when the shit starts to fly…) [http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080509/ap\_on\_el\_pr/obama\_endorsement](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080509/ap_on_el_pr/obama_endorsement) \*\*Obama picks up 5 superdelegates, union endorsement \*\* > [@](#): > > Barack Obama all but erased Hillary Rodham Clinton’s once-imposing lead among national convention superdelegates on Friday and won fresh labor backing as elements of the Democratic Party began coalescing around the Illinois senator for the fall campaign… > > …The developments left the former first lady with 271.5 superdelegates, to 268 for Obama. Little more than four months ago, on the eve of the primary season, she held a lead of 169-63… They call her La Tostada, “She Who Is Toast”. Got a hunch it’ll be over before the weekend is up. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1479 "2008-05-09T19:22:50Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] Whereas Obama’s big song would be “Star Quality”, of course. [/QUOTE] I’ve been thinking about updated campaign theme songs. For Obama, Squeeze’s _I Think I’m Go-Go_: _I’m shaking lots of hands Saying lots of things That no one understands You can shake my tree But you won’t get me Where am I I think I’m go go, go go, go go_ The Billy Squier song _Whadda Ya Want From Me_ fits Hillary: \*Down in the dungeon I’m having a hard time I get my love on condition and my Dewar’s without lime… Long distance warfare from over the phone lines Terminal airfare–I’m crossin’ the red line Can’t tell the diff’rence 'tween a “wait” and a “walk” sign But you know who I am—whadda you want from me \* ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2008, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726/1480 "2008-05-09T19:38:58Z")
Didn’t the Munchkins sing a song something like, _"HI-HO the Witch is Dead, the Witch is Dead…HI-HO the Witch is Deeeeaaad!!!_ That may be appropriate soon. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726.md?page=73) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fork-hillary-3-the-final-forking/441726.md?page=75)