# Former Russian spy, and two others, poisoned with nerve agent in UK
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [March 8, 2018, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219 "2018-03-08T03:41:16Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@Uniqueorn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uniqueorn)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/21 "2018-03-09T10:02:36Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#):
>
> It doesn’t seem to be cricket, swapping a guy and then whacking him years later.
Alive and in your custody, the guy can be a valuable asset (as he was, in the spy exchange). Alive and not in your custody, he is a potential problem.
One scary thought I had was that the daughter might have been the perpetrator and screwed it up somehow. I hope not. Hope they all recover quickly.
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### Author:  [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/22 "2018-03-09T11:29:47Z")
> [@JoseB](#):
>
> I do not interpret **dalej42** as saying that Theresa May is a weak Prime Minister because she is a woman, but because of the difficult and precarious circumstances she (as a Prime Minister) finds herself in: a hung parliament…
lol. (yeah, sue me, sometimes I have a 12 year old’s sense of humor, although it’s usually closer to a Russian’s.)
Anyway, I can’t see how this is anything other than “snitches get stitches” writ large. America did after all execute people for spying for the Soviet Union, in living memory…an execution that they deserved, in my opinion. They knew what the deal was going in. All spies do. It’s a risk they accept.
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### Author:  [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/23 "2018-03-09T13:26:34Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#):
>
> lol. (yeah, sue me, sometimes I have a 12 year old’s sense of humor, although it’s usually closer to a Russian’s.)
>
> Anyway, I can’t see how this is anything other than “snitches get stitches” writ large. America did after all execute people for spying for the Soviet Union, in living memory…an execution that they deserved, in my opinion. They knew what the deal was going in. All spies do. It’s a risk they accept.
A judicial execution in the homeland is one thing; a government-sponsored murder committed on foreign soil is something else altogether.
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### Author:  [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/24 "2018-03-09T14:06:27Z")
okay :::shrugs::: “A government-sponsored murder committed on foreign soil is something else”.
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### Author:  [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/25 "2018-03-09T14:17:57Z")
“A government-sponsored murder committed on foreign soil is something else.”
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/26 "2018-03-09T14:28:20Z")
Also, it seems to me that, in addition to making it clear that it was the Russian state that was doing a punitive killing, the use of things like polonium and nerve agents as killing methods was chosen in order to inflict maximum cruelty. Litvinenko took three weeks to die as his body shut down.
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### Author:  [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/27 "2018-03-09T14:34:09Z")
> [@Spiderman](#):
>
> His brother & son have also died under somewhat mysterious circumstances in the past few years.
In 2012, his wife also died under mysterious circumstances.
> [@Jacquernagy](#):
>
> Anyway, I can’t see how this is anything other than “snitches get stitches” writ large.
That, and watching your loved ones die off. And also knowing that your turn will likely come one day, some day. Whether it’s by polonium-210, or something else. Every day is fear.
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/28 "2018-03-09T14:41:12Z")
> [@Uniqueorn](#):
>
> One scary thought I had was that the daughter might have been the perpetrator and screwed it up somehow. I hope not. Hope they all recover quickly.
That thought occurred to me yesterday. I was going to post it as wild speculation, but I didn’t have enough information to speculate what leverage the Russian government might have that would induce her to assassinate her father.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/29 "2018-03-09T14:47:12Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#):
>
> That thought occurred to me yesterday. I was going to post it as wild speculation, but I didn’t have enough information to speculate what leverage the Russian government might have that would induce her to assassinate her father.
Since she is also afflicted and is quite likely to die a horrible death, I think it unlikely that she would have done it deliberately. It’s possible that maybe she brought something over, like a gift or something for her father, that was laced with nerve agent without her knowledge.
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/30 "2018-03-09T15:05:35Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#):
>
> Since she is also afflicted and is quite likely to die a horrible death, I think it unlikely that she would have done it deliberately.
She could be a ‘suicide bomber’. Leverage might be ‘You will kill your father and yourself, or your children will be executed.’ But there is no evidence for that, and I agree it is quite unlikely she was the perpetrator. But a thought must be thought before it can be rejected. 😉
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### Author:  [@Filbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Filbert)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/31 "2018-03-09T15:06:50Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#):
>
> lol. (yeah, sue me, sometimes I have a 12 year old’s sense of humor, although it’s usually closer to a Russian’s.)
>
> Anyway, I can’t see how this is anything other than “snitches get stitches” writ large. America did after all execute people for spying for the Soviet Union, in living memory…an execution that they deserved, in my opinion. They knew what the deal was going in. All spies do. It’s a risk they accept.
Plus his daughter? And a passing policeman?
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### Author:  [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/32 "2018-03-09T15:31:12Z")
> [@Filbert](#):
>
> Plus his daughter? And a passing policeman?
Collateral damage, as the saying goes. Unfortunately.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/33 "2018-03-09T15:56:22Z")
> [@Bullitt](#):
>
> Collateral damage, as the saying goes. Unfortunately.
Totally avoidable collateral damage, though, if they’d chosen a more precise method of killing.
The Litvinenko killers were apparently very careless in their handling of the polonium, leaving a trail of contamination at various locations, and they were themselves both treated for mild radiation poisoning.
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### Author:  [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)
#### Post date: [March 9, 2018, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/34 "2018-03-09T21:43:22Z")
Error in the title: “Former … spy”.
No one is ever a former spy. Ask Number Six.
The current Number Two decided to take action.
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### Author:  [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2018, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/35 "2018-03-10T03:39:43Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#):
>
> “A government-sponsored murder committed on foreign soil is something else.”
I really wish I could understand what point you, and the previous guy who quoted that, are trying to make?
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### Author:  [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2018, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/36 "2018-03-10T03:47:02Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#):
>
> I really wish I could understand what point you, and the previous guy who quoted that, are trying to make?
[“It’s an entirely different kind of flying, altogether.”](https://youtu.be/0wxp-NxJny8?t=80)
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2018, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/37 "2018-03-10T04:08:12Z")
A [strange new development](https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/09/russian-spy-attack-focus-falls-on-salisbury-cemetery) - experts in hazmat suits set up tents over the graves of the Russian spy’s wife and son at at the city’s cemetery. Police have denied that any exhumations have taken place, so perhaps they detected nerve agent contamination there - it seems a place that the Russian spy and his daughter might have visited that afternoon.
Two hundred members of the armed forces now in Salisbury to assist police with investigations.
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### Author:  [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2018, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/38 "2018-03-10T04:32:13Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#):
>
> [“It’s an entirely different kind of flying, altogether.”](https://youtu.be/0wxp-NxJny8?t=80)
Are you guys stoned or just busting chops? I still don’t understand what the hell you mean. It’s ok, I don’t mean any ill intent towards anyone, I’m not trying to justify Russia’s obviously-negligent, sloppy, barbaric attempt at the poisoning, it’s clearly not the most diplomatic way to execute a spy. It’s fucked up that other people in the area got poisoned. That should never be a part of it. But spies deserve to fucking die, no matter who you are, no matter who your group is, if you have any sense of allegiance or honor, you’ll want to see spies punished. I guess killing them is actually maybe not as good as letting them live, in captivity, for the purposes of gathering information - and not that they should be tortured or treated inhumanely - but it’s in any country’s best interest to eliminate spies.
There is no way in hell that the British government is not doing EXACTLY the same thing right now in countries all over the world. They’re just more discreet about it…way more discreet. James Bond is a parody of the ideal, the reality is more like Keyser Soze…the proverbial “gray man” revered by military special operators and intelligence officials.
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### Author:  [@Tatterdemalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tatterdemalion)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2018, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/39 "2018-03-10T04:41:49Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#):
>
> Are you guys stoned or just busting chops? I still don’t understand what the hell you mean. It’s ok, I don’t mean any ill intent towards anyone, I’m not trying to justify Russia’s obviously-negligent, sloppy, barbaric attempt at the poisoning, it’s clearly not the most diplomatic way to execute a spy. It’s fucked up that other people in the area got poisoned. That should never be a part of it. But spies deserve to fucking die, no matter who you are, no matter who your group is, if you have any sense of allegiance or honor, you’ll want to see spies punished. I guess killing them is actually maybe not as good as letting them live, in captivity, for the purposes of gathering information - and not that they should be tortured or treated inhumanely - but it’s in any country’s best interest to eliminate spies.
>
> There is no way in hell that the British government is not doing EXACTLY the same thing right now in countries all over the world. They’re just more discreet about it…way more discreet. James Bond is a parody of the ideal, the reality is more like Keyser Soze…the proverbial “gray man” revered by military special operators and intelligence officials.
You do realize that Ian Fleming wrote fiction right?
Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk
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### Author:  [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)
#### Post date: [March 10, 2018, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/former-russian-spy-and-two-others-poisoned-with-nerve-agent-in-uk/810219/40 "2018-03-10T04:47:35Z")
I think you seriously need to read more about the real life history of Ian Fleming and what he achieved. He was writing from actual experience. Exaggerated and played mostly for comedy, and with fanciful settings and plot contrivances, but still.
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