# Found "The Man in the High Castle" wanting -- still hope for me re Philip K. Dick? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 12, 2014, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119 "2014-10-12T17:20:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2014, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/41 "2014-10-19T21:05:45Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > The nice thing about Dick is that he wrote so much, there’s probably something you would like. I agree that a short story collection might be better. Other novels of his that I’ve read and liked that haven’t been mentioned so far include Solar Lottery, The Game Players of Titan, Clans of the Alphane Moon, The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch, and The Zap Gun. I’ve also read the other novels mentioned so far and the only one I don’t really like is The Man in the High Castle. I was about to recommend some of those. Basically, some of the stuff from before he went all weird due to (a drug trip/a stroke, I forget). ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2014, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/42 "2014-10-19T21:36:34Z")
Count me strongly with those who think Dick sucks, as it were. No talent hack who appeals to people who value style over message or story. And his style reeks too. ---
**Author:** ![erysichthon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d07c76/32.png) [@erysichthon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erysichthon)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2014, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/43 "2014-10-19T21:56:02Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > No, it’s not really. They’re thematically related, somewhat, and even that is only insofar as they relate together parts of the biography of Dick himself. Dick did refer to the three books as a trilogy in an [interview](http://www.philipkdickfans.com/literary-criticism/frank-views-archive/philip-k-dicks-final-interview/). ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2014, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/44 "2014-10-19T22:07:41Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > …think that I’ll go for a stand-alone: probably _Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?_ – the title is intriguing. Better title than the movie, _Blade Runner._ Dick was like Ellison, all the thinking went into the title. Most Dick novels I didn’t bother finishing. I didn’t care if the protagonists lived or died. No empathy; no identification. > [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > The real question, to my mind, is how Dick ever found a PUBLISHER. God, his books were awful. One of the great, unanswered questions of the universe. God, his books were awful. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2014, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/45 "2014-10-20T00:03:52Z")
Well, **Androids** has been recognized as a classic of the genre, and **Man in the High Castle** won a Hugo, so that’s why he found a publisher: some whose job it was to pick out good novels for publication thought they were. His earlier novels were more conventional that his later works; the first of his novels I read was **The Penultimate Truth** , which has a more conventional plot, but does touch on Dick’s usual themes of conspiracies. He also wrote some great short stories. “I Can Remember It For You Wholesale” and “Second Variety” were excellent work (though their movies were nowhere close; “Second Variety” was the second scariest SF story I read as a kid\*). Dick was never my favorite, but I certainly respect his output, and clearly, he’s one SF writer who got a ton of notice from literary sources after his death. \*The scariest was Jack Williamson’s “With Folded Hands.” ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2014, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/46 "2014-10-20T00:15:16Z")
> [@erysichthon](#): > > Dick did refer to the three books as a trilogy in an [interview](http://www.philipkdickfans.com/literary-criticism/frank-views-archive/philip-k-dicks-final-interview/). I know, I’m just saying you don’t need to think of them that way. No shared characters no continuing plot, etc. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2014, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/47 "2014-10-20T15:48:05Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > His short stories show that he could tie up all the loose ends, at least in the short story format. Possibly the novel format presented problems for him in this regard, but to be honest I had the impression he just wasn’t _concerned_ to tie up all the loose ends. Well, yes, it is a lot easier in a short story, in which there are, inevitably, a lot fewer ends to be tied As for the novels, saying he _couldn’t_ and opposed to _couldn’t be bothered to_ was merely a figure of speech. The point, however, is that the endings of his novels are typically an unsatisfying let-down, even though the journey to get there is often highly involving. Possibly this was some sort of intentional literary effect, although I am pretty sure I am far from the only person who dislikes it; more likely however, it was just laziness and lack of control on Dick’s part. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2014, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/48 "2014-10-20T17:03:47Z")
\*\* Minority Report Spoilers \*\* (and continuing a minor hijack) > [@Baal\_Houtham](#): > > Tom Cruise is accused of a pre-murder, but makes a skin-of-his-teeth amazing escape. Apparently he’s in the clear, and I’m thinking that he can hide out for 24 hours, until the supposed date of the crime passes and his innocence will be proved. > > Instead he decides to have his eyeballs cut out by an hostile surgeon in a shabby room, and break into an ultra-high security facility and risk immediate and permanent imprisonment. This left me yelling at the TV screen, and frowning at the screen for the next 90 minutes. > > Was there a reasonable explanation that I missed? FWIW I have not read the story the film is based on. He believes in the pre-cogs and pre-crime fully and without question. When his name comes up, he can’t just let it go. The pre-cogs can’t be wrong, which means one way or another he is going to kill that man. So hiding out isn’t an option; he has to find out why. ---
**Author:** ![emarkp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3be4f8/32.png) [@emarkp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emarkp)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2014, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/49 "2014-10-20T23:19:31Z")
And a non-spoiler comment about Minority Report – the motivation and ending to the novella is (IMO) superior to the movie. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2014, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/50 "2014-10-21T02:56:57Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > **The Second Stone** ’s post above; and **Baal Houtham** ’s thoughts on “reality leakage” – in the book’s “universe”, did the Axis not in fact win, and the characters’ seeming experiences are unreal? – have me feeling that maybe I’m just a simple soul, who likes his alternative history simply to be plain alternative history, “and no messing”? I suspect that for alt. hist., I’m liable to be happier with the likes of Harry Turtledove (on his good days). There are problems with reality too in “Do androids…” In fact there are in most if not all of Dick’s books. And there’s no point in asking what is really real, because you never know. Random, confuse, unsympathetic characters? Well, that’s Dick. I used to love it specifically for these reasons. I don’t anymore. I doubt the OP will have more luck with other books. If anything, they’re worst from this point of view. The man in the high castle is pretty straightforward, by Dickian standarts. ---
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2014, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119/51 "2014-10-22T01:21:51Z")
Hated _TMitHC_ (boring!!!). Loved “WCRIfYW.” Not sure if I’ve ever read anything else by him… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/found-the-man-in-the-high-castle-wanting-still-hope-for-me-re-philip-k-dick/701119.md?page=2)