# Fraternities, defend yourselves! Against bad public image. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 13, 2015, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482 "2015-11-13T17:48:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2015, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/81 "2015-11-17T14:39:49Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Of course fraternities have a negative public image. It’s a self-selecting group of college age guys declaring themselves to be superior to everyone while spending all their free time getting drunk, stoned and laid as much as possible. > > Don’t get me wrong. Being in a fraternity is a lot of fun. You’re living with 30 of your buddies. And it’s even better if your school has a strong Greek system (my college had something like 35 fraternities). And we did all that Animal House / Van Wilder shit. > > The downside is that it does create an elitist culture of drunken a-hole entitlement. It can also be a somewhat insular culture. You tend to mostly hang out with other fraternity people doing fraternity people stuff. Finally, someone who knows what they’re talking about. I wasn’t even in a frat (although I did go to an exclusive private high school that was basically a frat training academy), and this is probably the most accurate thing I’ve read so far. It’s a self-selecting bunch. They’re picking guys just like themselves - not out of any evil mustache-twirling desire to be superior really, but out of a sort of dumb-assed, lazy methodology of who fits in. I mean (and this gets a bit stereotypical), if you’re some white, upper-middle-class frat brother named Brice, are you going to pick another white, upper-middle-class guy named Hunter from a school you know about, and who dresses like you and talks like you, or are you going to pick that hispanic dude named Hector who doesn’t dress or talk like you, and who (in your mind) probably only knows hispanic girls with sharpied-on eyebrows? Or, for that matter, is Hector going to try and join that frat in the first place? Probably not. It’ll probably be guys named Chet, Brice, and Hunter who went to upper-middle-class high schools, and who already dress and act like frat guys. In other words, I think that it’s the members who make the frat, not the other way around. And those members are already knuckleheads when they show up- that’s a big part of WHY they pledge a frat in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2015, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/82 "2015-11-17T14:48:34Z")
That’s certainly true, but it’s not fair to say that Chet and Brice will pick each other just because. My chapter actively recruited minority students, and that was actively encouraged by our national organization. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2015, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/83 "2015-11-17T14:55:07Z")
> [@Asimovian](#): > > [Emphasis added.] > > Let me be very clear, here. If you have a problem with what someone else posts, you can report it. Someone else making a post that offends you does not give you license to threaten them, under any circumstance. As noted above, you’ve already previously been noted AND warned for it, so you have no excuse for posting anything that sounds like a threat. Don’t do this again. I read you loud and clear. I shall comply; I should have paid more attention to the option to report a post–having seen it often enough–to get the message myself. You have properly chastised me. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2015, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/84 "2015-11-17T14:56:33Z")
Animal House is definitely gross if you are a woman. In my experience, there are fraternities and there are fraternities. The ‘traditional’ fraternities are exactly what their reputation makes them out to be: rich entitled and mostly white. I was part of an Asian student association and I clearly remember things literally being taken from us and given to the frat boys. They had a huge budget, whereas ours was $250. One time we had the college van reserved for our uses, but the main fraternity needed it, so when we went to go get it we found they had been permitted to take it because clearly “they needed it more”. In college the only experience I had with frats was drunken assholes. Then I grew up and went to work for a not for profit organization. And I discovered a different type of fraternity. These were fraternities that were serious about the future, and they worked damn hard to ensure the future of their members. Mostly minority-based, they came to our events and worked extremely hard, doing anything we asked them without complaint, showing up at 7 am on a Sunday morning. They were gentlemen and they were very nice. I have not had any experiences with sororities except for the exclusionism. I never joined one and honestly would never - I am not a joiner. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveroptic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiveroptic/32/8257_2.png) [@Fiveroptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveroptic)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2015, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/85 "2015-11-17T16:45:14Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Fiveroptic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiveroptic/32/8257_2.png) [@Fiveroptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveroptic)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2015, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/86 "2015-11-17T16:47:13Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/87 "2015-11-20T20:46:45Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > I just don’t consider it a loss that I haven’t seen movies such as \*Animal House–\*and I know it was something of a box-office champ. Life is just not worth living if you haven’t seen Animal House. Some of the best actors ever were in that treasure gem. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/88 "2015-11-21T04:30:59Z")
The talent of the actors is irrelevant. The \*specific content \*of the movie is my grievance. If it pains me to see a college man act like a drunken boor I don’t want to watch a movie even if the guy graduated from an acting school with honors and has ten Oscars to his credit. I concentrate on the verb, not the adverb. The studio may pride itself on is high production values–as the company that produced _Dallas_ for TV apparently did–but the only thing I appraise is what I see on the screen. I don’t give a damn how much money the star, the director, or the executive producer has in the bank, nor how many people all told, bought tickets to see the movie. To me all that is irrelevant. The only relevant matter is the content, and if that turns out to be repulsive, I am not going to watch the movie. It’s as simple as that. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/89 "2015-11-21T12:36:43Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > I concentrate on the verb, not the adverb. And I’m all about adjectives. We are very different, you and I. ---
**Author:** ![Strainger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strainger/32/244_2.png) [@Strainger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strainger)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/90 "2015-11-21T14:13:12Z")
I was in a fraternity. I’d say we were all solidly middle class. Maybe there were a couple of well-off guys as well as a couple of not-so-well off guys. I was never hazed; hazing was a few years in the past. I participated in a number of philanthropic events, got tutoring and did some tutoring myself, learned various skills related to maintaining a house and–gasp–went to parties here and there. Even made a number of friends there though I had several friends outside the fraternity as well. Occasionally we ate babies. It was fun. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/91 "2015-11-21T16:01:57Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > And I’m all about adjectives. We are very different, you and I. Clever, but irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/92 "2015-11-21T16:21:16Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > Clever, but irrelevant. That cuts like a knife, dude. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Nylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Mr.Nylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Nylock)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/93 "2015-11-21T16:29:45Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > That cuts like a knife, dude. But does it also feel so right? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/94 "2015-11-21T16:33:16Z")
> [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > But does it also feel so right? Whoa! _That_ feels like a bullet in the gun of Robert Ford! **dougie** , little help, please? ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/95 "2015-11-21T17:26:50Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > Clever, but irrelevant. Being that neither relevance nor cleverness are your strong suits - how the hell would you know? ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/96 "2015-11-21T17:27:42Z")
That depends. Are you a masochist? ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/97 "2015-11-21T18:26:57Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > That depends. Are you a masochist? yup - neither clever nor relevant - thanks for proving the point. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/98 "2015-11-21T19:30:23Z")
Maybe you can give me one off the top of your head. :D:p ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/99 "2015-11-21T22:59:23Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > Maybe you can give me one off the top of your head. :D:p I don’t know what is more pathetic - this quoted post of yours or the fact you actually think its funny. So, **dougie\_monty** - what will be your next rant on this board? What will you pick next that you have no personal experience or knowledge of ? Or will it be another missive on a movie you hate based on never having seen it? The amount of ignorance you bring to these topics is truly amazing. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2015, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482/100 "2015-11-21T23:12:35Z")
I just call them as I see them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fraternities-defend-yourselves-against-bad-public-image/737482.md?page=6)