# Freaking awesome: Even Pope Francis says "Enough with the gays and abortions already!" **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 19, 2013, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235 "2013-09-19T15:41:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/1 "2013-09-19T15:41:41Z")
This guy just keeps get’n cooler every day. He almost makes me wish I weren’t an Atheist. > [@](#): > > “It is not necessary to talk about these issues all the time,” the pope told the Rev. Antonio Spadaro, a fellow Jesuit and editor in chief of La Civiltà Cattolica, the Italian Jesuit journal whose content is routinely approved by the Vatican. “The dogmatic and moral teachings of the church are not all equivalent. The church’s pastoral ministry cannot be obsessed with the transmission of a disjointed multitude of doctrines to be imposed insistently. > > “We have to find a new balance,” the pope continued, “otherwise even the moral edifice of the church is likely to fall like a house of cards, losing the freshness and fragrance of the Gospel.” You tell’em Pope! [Link](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/20/world/europe/pope-bluntly-faults-churchs-focus-on-gays-and-abortion.html?_r=1&) ---
**Author:** ![Capt\_Kirk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@Capt\_Kirk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt_Kirk)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/2 "2013-09-19T16:03:10Z")
A small quotation that stunned me > [@](#): > > “We must not reduce the bosom of the universal church to a nest protecting our mediocrity.” Wow **Capt** ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/3 "2013-09-19T16:28:29Z")
Whoa, who let this guy in? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/4 "2013-09-19T16:49:05Z")
I was hoping, when he chose the name Francis, that he would shift the focus of the church from legalistic/moralistic screeds to poverty, helping others, generosity of spirit, and welcoming love–and I think he’s living up to that so far. Though I’m not going to place too much emphasis on some of the things that others have found exciting (like the recent commentary on gays that just repeated previous teachings). ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/5 "2013-09-19T16:50:09Z")
Best. Pope. Evar. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/6 "2013-09-19T16:55:24Z")
Pope Francis: “I just want you to know, if you ever need anything, don’t be shy, OK? There are NO rules in the house. I’m not like a _regular_ Pope, I’m a _cool_ Pope. Right, Bishop?!” Bishop: “Please stop talking.” Seriously: maybe I’m a cynical bitch, but this is all just lip service. The reality is that the Church is a business and they are quickly learning that their bigotry is hurting the bottom line as the rest of the world quickly evolves beyond their archaic beliefs. Even most Catholics (68-98%, depending on which study you want to cite) use birth control nowadays. He’s the Pope. He could say flat out: you know what, God just talked to me and God said gay people are legit cool. No more being dicks to them, k, guys? Come on down, gay people! You’re welcome into the Kingdom of Heaven even while doing gay stuff, God said so. But he’s not. He’s saying nice things, but they don’t really do anything. Again, I’m probably just a cynical bitch. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/7 "2013-09-19T17:08:44Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > But he’s not. He’s saying nice things, but they don’t really do anything. > > Again, I’m probably just a cynical bitch. I agree with you when it comes to thing like him saying that gays can become priests, which is just a reversion to a previous position (pre-Benedict), but I do think that a shift of focus can help the world, in general. For example, say the RCC doesn’t change its opposition to gay marriage, but stops _lobbying_ against it. Or doesn’t change its opposition to BC but stops trying to interfere with condom usage in Africa, etc. ---
**Author:** ![lavenderviolet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/cdc98d/32.png) [@lavenderviolet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lavenderviolet)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/8 "2013-09-19T17:21:23Z")
It does seem like his approach is based on love and acceptance. As a pro-lifer, I was very impressed with the story of how he [personally called an unwed mother who had resisted pressure to abort with an offer to baptize the baby if she could not find anyone else who would do it](http://www.catholicvirtue.org/2013/09/07/pope-pledges-to-baptize-mothers-illigitimate-child-after-she-rejects-abortion/). That kind of thing is a very pro-life statement. I think he is doing wonderful things. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/9 "2013-09-19T17:25:37Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > For example, say the RCC doesn’t change its opposition to gay marriage, but stops _lobbying_ against it. Or doesn’t change its opposition to BC but stops trying to interfere with condom usage in Africa, etc. True enough, of course. I still think that if there’s one guy who could really make a change, it’s him. Christians in particular are all about standing by your beliefs even in the face of persecution, so even if there was a huge backlash for him welcoming whoever with open arms. . . well, if it’s what God says is right, then it’s right. But they don’t believe that or they’d just say so. Instead, they are pussyfooting around because their current policies are hurting the bottom line. Once again: I’m an awful, cynical bitch. > [@lavenderviolet](#): > > It does seem like his approach is based on love and acceptance. As a pro-lifer, I was very impressed with the story of how he [personally called an unwed mother who had resisted pressure to abort with an offer to baptize the baby if she could not find anyone else who would do it](http://www.catholicvirtue.org/2013/09/07/pope-pledges-to-baptize-mothers-illigitimate-child-after-she-rejects-abortion/). That kind of thing is a very pro-life statement. I think he is doing wonderful things. Agree with this, actually. I did really appreciate that story when I read it when it came out. That’s very good of him. I don’t think the Pope is a bad guy. I think he honestly is trying to be more inclusive and welcoming. Perhaps I’m just No One True Scotsmaning over here or something. I’ll be over here being a Cynical Cynthia. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/10 "2013-09-19T17:26:27Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > Pope Francis: “I just want you to know, if you ever need anything, don’t be shy, OK? There are NO rules in the house. I’m not like a _regular_ Pope, I’m a _cool_ Pope. Right, Bishop?!” > Bishop: “Please stop talking.” > > Seriously: maybe I’m a cynical bitch, but this is all just lip service. The reality is that the Church is a business and they are quickly learning that their bigotry is hurting the bottom line as the rest of the world quickly evolves beyond their archaic beliefs. Even most Catholics (68-98%, depending on which study you want to cite) use birth control nowadays. > > He’s the Pope. He could say flat out: you know what, God just talked to me and God said gay people are legit cool. No more being dicks to them, k, guys? Come on down, gay people! You’re welcome into the Kingdom of Heaven even while doing gay stuff, God said so. > > But he’s not. He’s saying nice things, but they don’t really do anything. > > Again, I’m probably just a cynical bitch. People have a hard time adjusting to radical change. You have to ease them into it. Baby steps, so to speak. As an analogy, if I took someone from the 50’s and plopped him down in front of a TV, his head would probably explode with all the women and their skimpy clothes. However, you take the same guy and let him live the sixty years it took to get to this day and age, it would probably be a big “Meh” to him. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/11 "2013-09-19T17:27:04Z")
> [@lavenderviolet](#): > > It does seem like his approach is based on love and acceptance. As a pro-lifer, I was very impressed with the story of how he [personally called an unwed mother who had resisted pressure to abort with an offer to baptize the baby if she could not find anyone else who would do it](http://www.catholicvirtue.org/2013/09/07/pope-pledges-to-baptize-mothers-illigitimate-child-after-she-rejects-abortion/). That kind of thing is a very pro-life statement. I think he is doing wonderful things. Really? That strikes me as nearly the least he could possibly do. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/12 "2013-09-19T17:45:25Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Really? That strikes me as nearly the least he could possibly do. Sometimes someone needs to come out and categorically state that you WILL do “the least you could possibly do”, rather than try to affect aloofness. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/13 "2013-09-19T17:47:10Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Sometimes someone needs to come out and categorically state that you WILL do “the least you could possibly do”, rather than try to affect aloofness. Sure, but let’s not act like it’s some monumental gesture for a priest to say he’ll baptize a baby. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/14 "2013-09-19T17:52:17Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > Pope Francis: “I just want you to know, if you ever need anything, don’t be shy, OK? There are NO rules in the house. I’m not like a _regular_ Pope, I’m a _cool_ Pope. Right, Bishop?!” > Bishop: “Please stop talking.” > > Seriously: maybe I’m a cynical bitch, but this is all just lip service. The reality is that the Church is a business and they are quickly learning that their bigotry is hurting the bottom line as the rest of the world quickly evolves beyond their archaic beliefs. Even most Catholics (68-98%, depending on which study you want to cite) use birth control nowadays. > > He’s the Pope. He could say flat out: you know what, God just talked to me and God said gay people are legit cool. No more being dicks to them, k, guys? Come on down, gay people! You’re welcome into the Kingdom of Heaven even while doing gay stuff, God said so. > > But he’s not. He’s saying nice things, but they don’t really do anything. > > Again, I’m probably just a cynical bitch. U.S. Catholics. The world really doesn’t revolve around us. The church’s base shifted long ago. The power comes from the multitude of followers in the 3rd world. Those Catholics are way more conservative than American Catholics. What he is saying is pretty radical to most Catholics of the world. Even if in the US its ho hum. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/15 "2013-09-19T17:57:01Z")
I think a shift of emphasis can matter a great deal. There’s what’s right, what’s wrong, and what’s\* important\* to you. Ratzinger said all the right words about economic issues, but it was only so much noise, because while he believed what he was saying about those issues was true, he clearly didn’t regard it as something worth putting an iota of the Church’s muscle behind. Rather, all that effort was going into fighting battles over gays and abortion and birth control and the role of women. If Francis flips that script, and admits to the same ‘truths’ about gays and abortion and birth control and the role of women that the Rat bought into, but isn’t going to have the Church lift a finger to lobby earthly governments about these things, but does OTOH put the weight of the Church behind what he’s saying about economic justice, then that puts the Church in a very different place than it’s been. We’ll see how this plays out, but I’d say there’s reason to be hopeful. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/16 "2013-09-19T18:19:48Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Really? That strikes me as nearly the least he could possibly do. LOL. No, no, no. Some random priest at some no name church, babtizing a baby would be the very least he could do. But the Pope doing it? That’s freaking epic! ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/17 "2013-09-19T19:15:51Z")
> [@Shakes](#): > > LOL. No, no, no. Some random priest at some no name church, babtizing a baby would be the very least he could do. > > But the Pope doing it? That’s freaking epic! It’s like Joe Namath visiting Bobby Brady! While I don’t get any of my hopes up that this pope will overturn traditional dogma, his perspective that the institution’s purpose is to support the people, and not for the people to support the institution, is earth-shattering for any religious leader to espouse, let alone a pope. ---
**Author:** ![Laudenum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Laudenum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laudenum)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/18 "2013-09-19T20:59:21Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Really? That strikes me as nearly the least he could possibly do. You’ve clearly just decided to set your standards so high that the Church, no matter what it does, will never meet them. ---
**Author:** ![Laudenum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Laudenum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laudenum)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/19 "2013-09-19T21:04:29Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > Pope Francis: “I just want you to know, if you ever need anything, don’t be shy, OK? There are NO rules in the house. I’m not like a _regular_ Pope, I’m a _cool_ Pope. Right, Bishop?!” > Bishop: “Please stop talking.” > > Seriously: maybe I’m a cynical bitch, but this is all just lip service. The reality is that the Church is a business and they are quickly learning that their bigotry is hurting the bottom line as the rest of the world quickly evolves beyond their archaic beliefs. Even most Catholics (68-98%, depending on which study you want to cite) use birth control nowadays. > \*\* > He’s the Pope. He could say flat out: you know what, God just talked to me and God said gay people are legit cool. No more being dicks to them, k, guys? Come on down, gay people! You’re welcome into the Kingdom of Heaven even while doing gay stuff, God said so. > > But he’s not. He’s saying nice things, but they don’t really do anything. \*\* > > Again, I’m probably just a cynical bitch. You are cynical (we’ll leave the rest in abeyance 😛 ) Maybe, just maybe, he actually, you know, believes in the Church he has given his life to and won’t fake a revelation? Maybe he believes that God disapproves of homosexuality and abortion but believes that he hates poverty and corruption more? He’s most likely, in his eyes, just balancing the focus of the Church; Jesus seems to have despised poverty and corruption much more than homosexuality. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235/20 "2013-09-19T21:13:57Z")
> [@Laudenum](#): > > You’ve clearly just decided to set your standards so high that the Church, no matter what it does, will never meet them. Because I don’t think a priest saying he’d baptize a baby is something amazing? Maybe you have your standards set a little too low? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freaking-awesome-even-pope-francis-says-enough-with-the-gays-and-abortions-already/669235.md?page=2)