# Free Electricity From the Sun **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 30, 2001, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054 "2001-03-30T02:17:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![KJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b2d939/32.png) [@KJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KJ)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/41 "2001-03-31T04:07:46Z")
> [@](#): > > Hey fatherjohn, you want I should send you a picture of my solar oven I made out of a cardboard box and AOL disks? Didn’t cost squat aside from the thrift store mirror. 😉 (No this does not translate into electric current…or as fatherjohn would say “electric” “current” …but it will cook a meal without using a commercial power source, thereby expanding the pool of available electricity for others. Nyah!) \*\* I hate to detract from the humorous atmosphere of this thread so far, but… If you were to get some kind of tubing and copper wire (who knows, maybe you can get that free off the side of the road somewhere…not that I’d recommend that) and some water (which could be obtained freely any time it rained) there’s a small chance you may be able to make some kind of steam-powered generator. Which would be pretty much free…also virtually impossible to get to function and it would probably only have enough power to run a small motor. But if you got it to work, you wouldn’t have to pay a cent. Take that, power companies. ---
**Author:** ![Albert\_Rose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de053/32.png) [@Albert\_Rose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Albert_Rose)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/42 "2001-03-31T04:47:07Z")
The AlbertRose, being new, does not understand this piling of heapage upon GoodFatherJohn. Is said poster truly worthy of such derision? The AlbertRose will have to do a “username” “search” for “fatherjohn.” Perhaps his mind will receive heat. ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/43 "2001-03-31T04:53:37Z")
YWalker… Philster strongly believes that fatherjohn will: a. read your posts and ignore, never to respond b. not read your posts c. read and respond with a five word sentence and an eyeroll which speaks volumes about electricity…or the lack of electrical current in his brain fatherjohn does not debate, nor does he concern himself with someone who presents an arguement. Spoofe Bo Didley has mastered the art of dealing with him. Call him a dipshit, cumrag, dickwad or whatever and move on. Keep your posts short, so when he ignores your points you don’t feel so bad. He ain’t worth the key wear. Philster likes fatherjohn. He’s like a movie that’s so bad, you watch it because it’s funny. He’s like the PLAN 9 poster of the SDMB. ---
**Author:** ![Protesilaus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Protesilaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Protesilaus)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/44 "2001-03-31T05:05:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by fatherjohn \* > \*\*If this is how you get electricity from your SUV, then fatherjohn is not interested. \*\* > [@](#): > > **Excuse me, fatherjohn must remember not to drink coca-cola while reading messages posted by SPOOFE Bo Diddly** **Protesilaus** has found that people who seriously refer to themselves in the third person are usually pretentious assholes. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by AlbertRose \* > \*\*The AlbertRose, being new, does not understand this piling of heapage upon GoodFatherJohn. Is said poster truly worthy of such derision? > > The AlbertRose will have to do a “username” “search” for “fatherjohn.” Perhaps his mind will receive heat. \*\* **Protesilaus** would also like to help out **AlbertRose** : [Sensitive ass SUV drivers (Page 4 and on)](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=35772&pagenumber=4) [Silly Useless Vehicles](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=60487) [Stickers to Put on Offensive Cars - Illegal?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=63046) [busted](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=64817) [No such thing as race?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=64852) ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/45 "2001-03-31T05:53:09Z")
Fenris… > [@](#): > > SPOOFE, you know Fenris hates to contradict you, but Fenris must. fatherjohn nas also contributed this gem…this pearl of wisdom: > > > [@](#): > > > > “no such thing as race” is really an argument about what should be pretending to be an argument about what is. But Ol’ John wasn’t the Originator of that particular line of “thought” (if you could call it thought). However, he WAS the first (as far as I know) to think that “SUV’s fall down” and “stuff costs money” were revolutionary new ideas. Johnny… > [@](#): > > :rolleyes: > > Pot? Kettle? You forgot “whatever”. And you forgot to leave out proper capitalization. ---
**Author:** ![fatherjohn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b2d939/32.png) [@fatherjohn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fatherjohn)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/46 "2001-03-31T11:52:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by YWalker \* > \*\*Them fellaters produce all sorts of NOx and SOx and other emissions that contribute to fuckin’ acid rain, \*\* "_in 1987, epa research raised doubts about the destructiveness of acid rain. Then came the most complete study of Acid Rain ever conducted, the half billion dollar Rain were largely a myth. Among other things, the study found that lakes were, on average, no more acidic than National Acid Precipitation Assessment Project (napap), which concluded that the allegedly horrific effects of Acid before the industrial era; just 240 of 7000 Northeast lakes, most with little recreational value, were critically acidic, or “dead”; most of the acidic water was in Florida, where the rain is only one-third as acidic; there was only very limited damage to trees, far less than that evident elsewhere in the world where so2 emissions are minimal; half of the Adirondack lakes were acidified due to natural organic acids; and crops remained undamaged at acidic levels ten times present levels. In the end, napap’s scientists figured that liming the few lakes that were acidic would solve the problem at a fraction of the cost of the Clean Air Act’s Acid Rain provisions."_ SCORE!! ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/47 "2001-03-31T12:18:07Z")
_“In 1994, a little bundle of excrement was shat, and it’s parents called it **fatherjohn**. It wasn’t very bright, and it soon found that it didn’t have a brain. It wasn’t worried, though, as it found that it could post random shit without ever having to worry about backing up a single fucking thing he said, or even replying to half of the arguments presented before him (much less addressing them or even refuting them). It was predicted that his existence was the result of nuclear waste bubbling up from the ground when its ‘mother’ evacuated her bowels. How or why it continues to exist is a mystery that may never be answered.”_ SCORE!! ---
**Author:** ![fatherjohn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b2d939/32.png) [@fatherjohn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fatherjohn)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/48 "2001-03-31T12:24:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Coldfire \* > \*\* > > Look, dweeb. I know what my electricity bill looks like. I pay about 15% per kWHr more for “green energy”. Not 400%. Trust me. And I am an end user, since I didn’t notice a nuclear power plant on my balcony the last time I checked. > > \*\* **fatherjohn** wonders if the discrepancy could be explained by a _subsidy_ **subsidy** : “financial assistance granted by a government or philanthropic foundation to a person or association for the purpose of promoting an enterprise considered beneficial to the public welfare.” Source: [http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/bus/A0847070.html](http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/bus/A0847070.html) Could the dutch government be subsidizing “solar energy”? Could the dutch government be requiring dutch power companies to absorb some of the costs of “solar energy”? [sarcasm mode on] naahhhhhhhh, that would never happen in the NETHERLANDS [sarcasm mode off] But have a nice day! :wally ---
**Author:** ![Astroboy14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@Astroboy14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroboy14)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/49 "2001-03-31T12:30:26Z")
**fatherjohn** , the acidity of lakes and other so-called “measures” of the life-cycle of any of the MANY eco-systems on our beautiful planet are WAY debatable! Once, when I was young and more stupid than now, I asked my father (a PhD in entomology, and a researcher for the US gov’t) about this very issue… he told me (I will here paraphrase for brevity): “Lakes, etc. may very well be adversly affected by acid rain. But we DON’T KNOW, and CAN’T KNOW for sure. Why? Because these systems have only been studied for a handful of years. The life-cycle of a lake may be measured in the hundreds of thousands of years, and a database of only a minute fraction of that time is next to meaningless!” So, in conclusion, uh… bite me? (that doesn’t seem harsh enough, but as I’m going on ‘what my Dad tole me’ I can’t justify anything stronger… 😃 ) ---
**Author:** ![fatherjohn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b2d939/32.png) [@fatherjohn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fatherjohn)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/50 "2001-03-31T13:28:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Protesilaus \* > \*\* > **Protesilaus** has found that people who seriously refer to themselves in the third person are usually pretentious assholes. > > \*\* :rolleyes: Kettle calling pot . . . Kettle calling pot . . . Come in pot . . . . ---
**Author:** ![Olentzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90ced4/32.png) [@Olentzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Olentzero)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/51 "2001-03-31T14:23:13Z")
It is apparent to **Olentzero** that **fatherjohn** has serious issues with several different choices of lifestyle, or rather choices of lifsetyle that do not match **fatherjohn** ’s choice of lifestyle exactly. It is also apparent to **Olentzero** that **fatherjohn** has not, in **fatherjohn** ’s voluminous collection of 160+ pithy, intelligent, well-considered and highly informative posts on the SDMB, provided any hints, clues, or other disclosures as to the nature of **fatherjohn** ’s choices of lifestyle, hence providing the SDMB with an ideal which thus becomes the SDMB’s goal to achieve. **Olentzero** is therefore forced to conclude that **fatherjohn** did _ **not** _ have a life previous to joining the SDMB, unless **Olentzero** chooses to consider **fatherjohn** ’s sitting in the corner, rambling incoherently, picking **fatherjohn** ’s nose, and drooling while doing so a life. Which does not mean **fatherjohn** has a life now that **fatherjohn** has joined the SDMB. This merely proves to **Olentzero** that **fatherjohn** has progressed from an incoherent, drooling, nose-picking moron to an incoherent, drooling, nose-picking moron that has learned how to type. ---
**Author:** ![Monster104](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Monster104](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monster104)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/52 "2001-03-31T16:48:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*:rolleyes: > > Kettle calling pot . . . Kettle calling pot . . . Come in pot . . . .\*\* Watch out everyone, **fatherdumbshit** is getting creative on us! Maybe the solar energy conducted into his brain through his tinfoil hat caused a spark of intelligence. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/53 "2001-03-31T16:53:33Z")
One would think that after **Johnny L.A.** channelled **fatherschmuck** that **fatherschmuck** would have caught on that **fatherschmuck** was becoming boring and repetitive. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/54 "2001-03-31T21:50:40Z")
> [@](#): > > Maybe the solar energy conducted into his brain through his tinfoil hat caused a spark of intelligence. Not likely. Have you ever seen walking stool display intelligence? ---
**Author:** ![waxteeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/258eb7/32.png) [@waxteeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waxteeth)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/55 "2001-03-31T22:17:31Z")
Yes I’m talkin about “ROI” It’s called “return on investment” Keanu Reeves. Add all the costs for the equipment and then subtract what you would have to pay in electric bills until you get to Zero. (It wont take 4eva you know) Solar panels? Surplus power generation? Meter running backwards? Hello Mc Father your “solar power” deserves a second look. ---
**Author:** ![Albert\_Rose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de053/32.png) [@Albert\_Rose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Albert_Rose)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2001, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/56 "2001-03-31T23:05:03Z")
The AlbertRose would like to thank **Protesilaus** for the links. The AlbertRose now understands. The AlbertRose has a new goal in life: to buy an SUV with solar panels. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2001, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/57 "2001-04-01T00:34:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by fatherjohn \* > **fatherjohn** wonders if the discrepancy could be explained by a _subsidy_ > > **subsidy** : “financial assistance granted by a government or philanthropic foundation to a person or association for the purpose of promoting an enterprise considered beneficial to the public welfare.” > > Source: [http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/bus/A0847070.html](http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/bus/A0847070.html) > > Could the dutch government be subsidizing “solar energy”? Could the dutch government be requiring dutch power companies to absorb some of the costs of “solar energy”? > > [sarcasm mode on] naahhhhhhhh, that would never happen in the NETHERLANDS [sarcasm mode off] > > But have a nice day! > > :wally Of _course_ it is subsidized. How else do you expect for-profit companies to implement energy generating methods that (at least for now) are more costly than the conventional ones? The program as it is in the Netherlands relies on two things: a government subsidy (and an EU cover for this, but let’s not make it too complicated for **fatherjohn** ) that enables power companies to erect windmills, install solar panels, etc., for only slightly more than erecting a comparable (in capacity) conventional plant. An _incentive_. A one-off (per project) subsidy. Not a continuous one. The rest relies on the people to be convinced that “green energy” is better, and their willingness to pay 15% more for it - since the power companies STILL invest more in green methods than they do in conventional ones, relatively speaking. But a lot of these costs are start-up costs. In due time, the need for subsidisation will decrease, and green energy will be able to support its own business. We might as well get used to it - we’re burning up our fossil fuels, you know. The main point is, of course, this: while there is a subsidy system, it does not compensate for a 400 to 500% price increase for green energy over “normal” energy. In other words: you’d better substantiate that statement already, or take it back. You chose. But have a nice day. **Coldfire** now presses “submit”. ---
**Author:** ![fatherjohn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b2d939/32.png) [@fatherjohn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fatherjohn)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2001, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/58 "2001-04-01T00:46:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by waxteeth \* > \*\* > Add all the costs for the equipment and then subtract what you would have to pay in electric bills until you get to Zero. (It wont take 4eva you know) > \*\* Umm, false. Don’t believe me? Borrow the money to install your panels, and see if your monthly loan payment + upkeep is less than what your electric bill was. ---
**Author:** ![fatherjohn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b2d939/32.png) [@fatherjohn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fatherjohn)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2001, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/59 "2001-04-01T00:55:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Coldfire \* > \*\* > > The main point is, of course, this: _while there is a subsidy system,_ it does not compensate for a 400 to 500% price increase for green energy over “normal” energy. In other words: you’d better substantiate that statement already, or take it back. > > You chose. But have a nice day. **Coldfire** now presses “submit”. \*\* (emphasis mine) Interesting that **coldfire** doesn’t mention anything about subsidies until he is called on it. substantiation? The earlier quote was from a report sponsored by _Greenpeace_ **fatherjohn** will try to find a link, if I have the time. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2001, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054/60 "2001-04-01T01:40:54Z")
It wasn’t relevant, you idiot. Oh, and if you’re chosing to be an idiot by referring to yourself in the third person, at least be _consistent_. _“fatherjohn will look up a link if I have the time.”_ Are you just plain dumb, or is this some sort of multiple personality deal? Oh, don’t bother. I know the answer already: “:rolleyes: Pot? Kettle?” You’re getting really boring really fast, **John John**. How are things in Cyberia, anyway? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/free-electricity-from-the-sun/60054.md?page=4)