# Freedom Fries guy changes mind, opposes war. What does this mean for liberals? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 13, 2005, 10:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062 "2005-06-13T10:20:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/161 "2005-06-14T13:06:26Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > Here in your self righteous condecending manner, you miss the point, **again** In my other post I invited anyone to point out something genuinely effective the liberal Democrats have done. PLaese do. I’d love to admit I’m wrong here. We seem, for the time being, to have saved Social Security from death by privatization. We were on course to prevent the appointment of some really questionable judges and force the Republicans into a very uncomfortable political position until some “punch me in the gut” type Democrats stepped up to allow Bush all his nominations with the promise that we wouldn’t exercise our rights unless it was really really really important. We have fought a good fight on the nomination of a really inappropriate UN ambassador. > [@](#): > > I don’t agree, or even understand your logic here. I see others found a way to agree with certain points and call **Lib** to task for the ones they didn’t. You and others chose sarcasm and porfanity. Bullshit. I chose sarcasm, profanity and refutation of his premise as faulty and (I suspect intentionally) offensive. > [@](#): > > Thats your perogative. I don’t find it admirable or useful. I’m crushed. > [@](#): > > I’d say the “forceful” way you stand up for your principles is already a compromise of them. Ironic ain’t it? It would be ironic if it made any fucking sense. > [@](#): > > Here again you draw a quick unfounded conclusion about me based on what. I think is the perfect time for the appropriate use of FUCK YOU I mentioned earlier. See how that works? Got no problem with it. Profanity isn’t murder. It isn’t nuclear war. It isn’t violence. It is an expression of extreme contempt and disagreement. Don’t be a pussy. If you want to tell me “fuck you,” do so. I’m more offended by your arguments in support of this OP than any profanity would ever bother me. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/162 "2005-06-14T13:07:27Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > So several people jump in this thread, not to discuss the OP but to attack **Liberal** , and when he decides to not participate, you accuse him of being childish. How school yard bully of you. > I think several people made valid points and interesting arguements but those of you who just wanted to piss in the sandbox for your own entertaiment put a stop to that. And you refer to him as childish. It’s funny in a “you’re full of crap” way. The problem, it seems to me, is that while **Liberal** complains about the abuse, he also seems to wallow in it. I spent some time, way back in post #66 of this thread, attempting to make a measured and insult-free response to some issues directly related to his OP. Yet, while he has found the time to make 22 posts since then, not one of those posts attempts to address my arguments or offer a rebuttal to them. Now it’s entirely possible that he felt that my observations were not erudite or relevant enough to warrant a response. I’m completely willing to concede that what i believe to be a measured response might not be taken the same way by others. But it seems to me that most of **Liberal** ’s posts in this thread have been more concerned with playing up his role as a beleaguered iconoclast pummelled by the ignorant masses than with actually discussing the very topics that were allegedly the reason for this thread. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/163 "2005-06-14T13:24:59Z")
[QUOTE] > [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > We seem, for the time being, to have saved Social Security from death by privatization. We were on course to prevent the appointment of some really questionable judges and force the Republicans into a very uncomfortable political position until some “punch me in the gut” type Democrats stepped up to allow Bush all his nominations with the promise that we wouldn’t exercise our rights unless it was really really really important. We have fought a good fight on the nomination of a really inappropriate UN ambassador. I will concede the point on preventing Social Security privatization. I think SS stills needs looking at and fixing and chooseing your own private account can be a viable option. I also think just about anything this admin preposes is a smoke screen for some unethical bullshit they want to slip into a pretty package. > [@](#): > > I’m crushed.It would be ironic if it made any fucking sense. I’m not sure but I think that might be one of\*\* Liberal’s\*\* points. You don’t get it. I’ll explain further if you like. > [@](#): > > Got no problem with it. Profanity isn’t murder. It isn’t nuclear war. It isn’t violence. It is an expression of extreme contempt and disagreement. I have no problem with profanity either. When it serves as a substitute for rational arguement it’ serves no purpose other than a venting for the person useing it. > [@](#): > > Don’t be a pussy. If you want to tell me “fuck you,” do so. I’m more offended by your arguments in support of this OP than any profanity would ever bother me. I actually just did. I hope you didn’t miss it. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/164 "2005-06-14T13:31:59Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > I actually just did. I hope you didn’t miss it. I figured you did, but you hid it among so much other bullshit that it was pretty indirect and kind of hard to tell. i was encouraging you to express yourself more directly. Don’t be afraid! Now, you offer to explain the points I am missing. Feel free, but try not to stray beyond **Liberal’s** words. If you have points you want to debate that you have interpolated, extrapolated or just plain thought of while you were reading what **Liberal** actually wrote, it would be beter to start a new thread. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/165 "2005-06-14T13:37:39Z")
> [@Harborwolf](#): > > I know NPR news has three ombudsman (ombudsmen?) going through their news for bias (fyi, they haven’t found any) which is more than any other news organization has by a score of three to zero. That zero represents all other news sources combined. That could be a good start. Get the political spin out so at least people seem like dingalings when they bitch about the liberal media. Don’t hold out much hope for NPR. They’re under siege from the tighty righties for not having enough conservative bias in their reporting. The Bush appointee who heads the Corporation for Public Broadcasting has been making all kinds of efforts to make NPR knuckle down and be more like Fox News. And coincidentally, the CPB is planning to drastically cut its appropriation for NPR this year. I’m already smelling the winds of change in some of NPR’s materials, and it ain’t a good smell. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/166 "2005-06-14T13:43:23Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > I’m already smelling the winds of change in some of NPR’s materials, and it ain’t a good smell. I smelled that smell back in September-October of 2004. I have not renewed my membership since (and I have a pretty good collection of coffee mugs). I don’t listen anymore (my new car came with a CD player that can play MP3’s, so fuck NPR. I do realize of course that it is probably the plan of the right to shift NPR’s message so that they lose support and can eventually be killed altogether, but I am not sure what else I can do. I can’t support the shifting of the message. I only hope that Air America develops into a reliable and viable alternative. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/167 "2005-06-14T14:33:38Z")
Back to what ‘Liberals’ were really screeching about from the beginning, namely OIL!!! Slowly but surely it is becomming obvious that it all _has_ been lies spewing forth from the White House. Now that we have finally established that this war was not waged because of _any_ of the officially stated reasons, can we now move to why Iraq really was invaded? As I see it there are no more excuses and the painfuly obvious must be the truth. Iraq was invaded in order to plunder. Plunder in the modern sense; prestige harvested by the president, multi billion contracts by subcontracters inside Iraq for ‘rebuilding’, the arms industries got rid of their old bomb stocks and get contracts to produce more and probably someone has a few barrels of cheaply gained oil to sell. Anyone got anything better to propose? Please no more of the ‘Well, at least we got rid of a monster’ crap, you didn’t get rid of him he got re-elected. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/168 "2005-06-14T14:54:09Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > I will concede the point on preventing Social Security privatization. I think SS stills needs looking at and fixing and chooseing your own private account can be a viable option. I also think just about anything this admin preposes is a smoke screen for some unethical bullshit they want to slip into a pretty package. This is just for info. I’ve been deliberately staying out of this fight, but wanted to toss this quote in, on privatization: > [@GWBush](#): > > “I repeat, personal accounts do not permanently fix the solution.” —George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., March 16, 2005 ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/169 "2005-06-14T16:05:05Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > When I prove them wrong, they change their accusation, as Giraffe did. Have a big self-pitying, stomping-out-of-the-room tantrum if you want, but don’t pretend I said something I didn’t. I never said you were incapable of changing your mind, I said my point about your hijacking would likely not be effective if history was any guide. Our exchange proves the point – as soon as I criticized your hijacking, you immediately labeled me as an irrational enemy, part of a gang of thugs who exists only to torment you. A walk down memory lane: > [@Giraffe](#): > > Hey, I have no problem with escapism. I just wish you wouldn’t muddy the waters of other people’s political discussions with your masturbation. > [@Liberal](#): > > How successful do you suppose Giraffe will be in getting across to me whatever damnable point it is he is trying to make? > [@Giraffe](#): > > As for how successful I’ll be in getting my damnable point across, my guess is not at all, if history is any guide. You seem to have anti-criticism blinders which flip on whenever someone criticizes how and what you post. > [@Liberal](#): > > That is demonstrably false. If I show you dozens of instances in which compelling argument has convinced me that I was wrong this year alone, would you recant that accusation? Or is it something you you’ve already decided regardless of evidence to the contrary. > [@Giraffe](#): > > You misunderstand what I’m accusing you of. I’m accusing you of turning other people’s political discussions into The Liberal Show, not of never changing your mind during one of your libertarian wankfests. It’s not a new accusation – I’ve seen it made over and over again. You usually dismiss your accusors as irrational enemies who hate you for either your beliefs or for no good reason at all. > [@Liberal](#): > > Whenever I’m piled-on like this, it is always the same gaggle of nabobs. They repeat the same nonsense and lies about me over and over as though that will make it true. When I prove them wrong, they change their accusation, as Giraffe did. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/170 "2005-06-14T16:14:22Z")
> [@Giraffe](#): > > A walk down memory lane: I’ve started calling him a drama queen and I think it’s pretty fucking accurate. Everything has to be about him. He’s instantly offended and never incorrect. Everyone who doesn’t think he’s both brilliant and correct is obviously out to get him. He (figuartively) stomps out of the room at the drop of a hat, typically to return later. I wouldn’t be surprised if his political “philosophy” was nothing more than a way to drum up more drama. His nick change certainly was. It’s the same thing with him every fucking time. I can’t believe peoples still give him attention. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/171 "2005-06-14T16:22:11Z")
The most frustrating part for him in this thread must be his inability to post to it again, already having announced his departure. **Giraffe** , thanks for taking on this long-festering problem. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/172 "2005-06-14T16:25:41Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > When commenting on any issue whose political and philosophical views do you expect \*\*Liberal \*\* to give? Don’t we all respond with our own views? Isn’t that to be expected? Of course he can only offer his. However, his basic axia are so far removed from those of most other people that they do not provide a means for common-ground discussion: the underlying assumptions themselves must be debated or rejected if any discussion is to happen with him on almost all issues. And that gets really old: he knows that his underlying assumptions are different from almost everyone else’s, and we know that he knows that, and yet he keeps pushing them front and center. Try a thought experiment. Personally, I don’t believe that logic is necessarily valid, that the universe necessarily corresponds to the principles of reason. (This is true, by the way, but is another discussion that I’m not having now). For the next week, **every time you open a thread** , imagine there’s a post from me about halfway down the first page making some oblique reference to how the OP is incorrect, given that the universe doesn’t necessarily correspond to the principles of reason. Imagine that these references are occasionally very insulting, suggesting that people are sheep if they believe so naively in the principles of reason. I’m not saying to imagine that in every thread dealing with metaphysics. Open a thread about whether Michael Jackson is guilty? There’s a post there stating that we can’t believe in any evidence proffered by the court, because… Open a thread about Freedom Fries Guy? I’m right there, suggesting that you can’t show FFG ever said that FFG because… Looking at a thread about the use of tasers in police stops? Guess who’s got a post excoriating everyone for assuming that statistics on police stops have any sort of meaning, since everyone knows that cause-and-effect is just an illusion? Seriously, try it out. See how old it gets, how fast. Now imagine that every time I make one of those (sincere, from-my-heart) posts, half a dozen people jump on it as either easily dismissed, bizarrely intriguing, or simply unignorably outrageous. Whatever the thread you were reading _was_ about, it _now_ is about whether the universe operates according to the principles of logic and reason. We’ve all got our own nutty views of the cosmos. Most of us are capable of recognizing them, and setting them aside for the purposes of discussion. For the purposes of discussion (and many other purposes, I should add), I act as if the principles of logic and reason hold sway in our universe. **Lib** very rarely will set Libertarianism/Propertarianism to the side for the purposes of discussion. And that’s what’s so frustrating. > [@](#): > > Personnally If I had already explored all the differences between my views and any other posters several times I would be unlikely to engage them in a debate of any length again. I agree, and I’ve stopped debating him on these issues. The problem is that so many people **don’t** stop, either because they’ve never seen the ontological “proof of God” before, or because they lack the self-discipline to ignore yet another argument about whether taxation really equals robbery. And so the discussion, no matter what it was about, is now about his pet issue. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/173 "2005-06-14T16:53:04Z")
> [@Giraffe](#): > > > [@Liberal](#): > > > > You take a great risk defending me. I’m very grateful, but do not injure your own reputation on my account. Lose me, and no big deal. But lose you, and the board is poorer for it. > > I can’t believe people keep accusing you of acting like a martyr. Hey! **Liberal** ’s grace and calm nobility in this thread have touched me. Turns out it was bad touch. . . . The point when I realized that **Liberal** had zero interest in actual discussions of his philosophy - and the point when I started to suspect he doesn’t really have any genuine thought underlying it - was when I saw [this quote of his.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=5810248&postcount=201) > [@Liberal](#): > > Because it is not the case. Present a compelling argument that peaceful honest people ought NOT to be allowed to pursue their own happiness in their own way, and I’ll leave the philosophy behind. The likelihood that you will do so, however, is miniscule. In that thread, he blamed his refusal to engage in honest discussions (and his constant hijacks to boot) on **Dewey Cheatem Undhow** ; I’m sure he’s willing to blame someone else for it now. But when you consider that the core of his political “philosophy” is the paranoid and apparently _a priori_ belief that everyone who disagrees with him _is opposed to the pursuit of happiness_, you get a feeling that the whole thing is just a house of cards. That’s my personal guess as to why he becomes so viciously personal when people disagree with him; the mindless adherence of the fanatic or the zealot turns to mindless violence when it’s questioned. It’s telling, incidentally, that he started this thread by repeating sound bites about modern American liberalism that me might as well have picked up from Bill O’Reilly. I’m beginning to feel that his knowledge and thought on the subject of American politics is just as fragile as his grasp of political theory. I understand the optimism, though. He has a unique knack for arguing graciously and rationally just often enough to make one think that _this_ thread is going to be the one that does justice to his reputation as a thinker and a debater. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/174 "2005-06-14T16:55:35Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > Of course he can only offer his. However, his basic axia are so far removed from those of most other people that they do not provide a means for common-ground discussion: “[axes](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Axis)” Sorry. But it really jumped out at me. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/175 "2005-06-14T16:59:42Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > “[axes](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Axis)” > > Sorry. But it really jumped out at me. 🙂 Nope, “axia” as a pluralization of “axiom.” ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/176 "2005-06-14T17:20:43Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Nope, “axia” as a pluralization of “axiom.” “[axioms](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Axiom)” then. “Axiom” is definitely a better fit for the sentence than “axis”, though. ---
**Author:** ![I\_don\_t\_care\_about\_your\_cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f08c70/32.png) [@I\_don\_t\_care\_about\_your\_cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_don_t_care_about_your_cat)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/177 "2005-06-14T17:21:57Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Whenever I’m piled-on like this, it is always the same gaggle of nabobs. They repeat the same nonsense and lies about me over and over as though that will make it true. I haven’t been here that long, but I’ve already heard you say this twice in 2 different threads. And I’ve already observed that it’s _not_ just a few of the same people. It is in fact _a lot_ of people telling you this, and many of them seem to me to be level-headed and respected posters. Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/178 "2005-06-14T17:35:09Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > “[axioms](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Axiom)” then. > > “Axiom” is definitely a better fit for the sentence than “axis”, though. By George, you’re right. I’ve got no idea where I got the idea that “axia” was the correct plural; thanks! Daniel ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/179 "2005-06-14T17:36:20Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > …to make one think that _this_ thread is going to be the one that does justice to his reputation as a thinker and a debater. It did. He started with a faulty premise. Got called on it. Was dismayed that we did not bow to his wisdom. Cast aspersions. Played the martyr card. Was defended by a sycophant that did not catch the irony. Then stomped off. I would say that this thread did justice to his reputation as a debator and thinker. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2005, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062/180 "2005-06-14T17:37:17Z")
> [@I don't care about your cat](#): > > It is in fact _a lot_ of people telling you this, and many of them seem to me to be level-headed and respected posters. I’m not level-headed. I can’t keep a flower pot up there to save my life. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/freedom-fries-guy-changes-mind-opposes-war-what-does-this-mean-for-liberals/308062.md?page=10)