# Frivolous lawsuits **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 18, 2013, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809 "2013-07-18T02:43:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/81 "2013-07-22T10:54:41Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > …I remember living in Europe. I bought a step-ladder for my apartment and was amazed to see that it had no warning labels on it. No “WARNING: injury could occur if ladder used improperly” labels. Nothing like:“DO NOT PLACE LADDER AGAINST ELECTRICAL TRANSMISSION LINES! ELECTROCUTION COULD RESULT!” > > As an American, I had become so accustomed to seeing the vast array of warning stickers and placards everywhere that it jolted my attention when suddenly I was in an environment where there were almost none. … Perhaps in Europe the difference might be that an injured person’s medical costs are covered by national healthcare. By far, the biggest damages issue is medical care costs incurred by the injured person. It would only be fair that the person who caused the damages pay for it, just as if you broke my car with your car, that you pay for it to be repaired or replaced. That’s only fair. As far as those warning labels are concerned, they’re there because people actually have done those things warned about. I mean, have you met any humans? Not everyone uses good sense all the time. The idea is to stop people from being injured. Punitive damages are awarded generally when a company knows (or should have known) that something could cause an injury but did nothing to fix or warn of it. A label is a cheap fix. Now, how do we get people to actually read labels? I don’t know the answer that one. I live in Europe and I see dangerous things all the time that just make me cringe because I know someone’s going to get injured on it. They’ll have their medical needs taken care of, but that doesn’t take away pain or scars or death from whatever it is. I think they need more of the American system to address potential injuries, and I hope they are moving in that direction. Our system isn’t perfect, but it’s pretty darned good. ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/82 "2013-07-22T11:02:10Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > She may have wet her pants because she forgot to buy her boyfriend tickets to the tractor-pull. Duddint matter. It’s still the driver’s fault, right? Did you happen to go to the same law school as U. C. Ambulance-Chaser, Esq. ???.. LOL! Your ignorance is patent. If she wet her pants because she forgot to buy her boyfriend tickets then the automobile hitting her (or nearly hitting her) was not the proximate cause of the injury. Go back to your t.v. child. The adults are talking. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/83 "2013-07-22T11:05:44Z")
> [@legalsnugs](#): > > As far as those warning labels are concerned, they’re there because people actually have done those things warned about. I mean, have you met any humans? Not everyone uses good sense all the time. I’m looking at a ladder right now. “Do not stand at or above this level. YOU CAN LOSE YOUR BALANCE.” Meh, do it all the time, albeit it with caution. ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/84 "2013-07-22T11:17:04Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > …Another question is: at what point do legal ethics depart from current laws? A hypothetical: let’s say you are an attorney practicing in a U.S. state. You have all of the knowledge, customs, and personal beliefs that you currently possess, But in this hypothetical situation it is illegal in the USA for any black person to touch any white person. > > Are you within legal ethical bounds if you take the case of a white man suing for damages in civil court because he was touched by a black man (emotional distress, etc.)? Never mind that your personal repulsion to such a situation might keep you from taking on such a case… is it ethical (only considering legal ethics)?.. Since the ethics of a particular act cannot always be determined by the legality of the act, I’d have to say: It depends. There would be too many variables in your scenario for me to give a yes or no answer. It used to be the law that runaway slaves had to be returned to their owner. That was the law, but was it ethical? It used to be the law that investment banks could screw over their investors for a profit. It was legal, but was it ethical? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/85 "2013-07-22T11:24:03Z")
> [@legalsnugs](#): > > Since the ethics of a particular act cannot always be determined by the legality of the act, I’d have to say: It depends. There would be too many variables in your scenario for me to give a yes or no answer. It used to be the law that runaway slaves had to be returned to their owner. That was the law, but was it ethical? It used to be the law that investment banks could screw over their investors for a profit. It was legal, but was it ethical? And the answer in each case is…? ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/86 "2013-07-22T11:34:05Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > I’m looking at a ladder right now. “Do not stand at or above this level. YOU CAN LOSE YOUR BALANCE.” Meh, do it all the time, albeit it with caution. And you would be perfectly within your rights to do so, after having made your informed decision with the fact at your disposal that if you do so, you may lose your balance and get hurt. But you could not thereafter win your lawsuit against the ladder-maker for your medical costs claiming that you didn’t know that might happen. ---
**Author:** ![Tracijo67](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@Tracijo67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tracijo67)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/87 "2013-07-22T11:34:43Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Sure, but again, the insurance companies are a business. Their goal is to maximise profits for their shareholders. If they fight every case, their costs go up, your premiums go up, and profits go down. I think that everyone here can agree that there is a lot of room for exploitation when another business (“Call 911 and then call 411!”) understands what you have just highlighted above. And at this point, I am not even suggesting that my circumstances meet this criteria. I am just asking, would you agree that if some lawyers with questionable ethics knew that ABC Insurance has a reputation of settling even dubious claims, there is in fact room for exploitatiin to happen? Sure, the insurance company wants to do everything it can to maximize profit an I am sure they have risk assessment people who will do just that. So if we take my case out of the equation altogether, and just generalize, do you believe that claims are filed and that they are not in good faith? What I’d really like to know is, does it happen often enough to rise beyond the level of nuisance? I am not nudging here; I am genuinely curious. Perhaps I am too jaded by the inundation of ads, and my own personal biases, to have a realistic grasp on this. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/88 "2013-07-22T11:51:12Z")
> [@legalsnugs](#): > > And you would be perfectly within your rights to do so, after having made your informed decision with the fact at your disposal that if you do so, you may lose your balance and get hurt. But you could not thereafter win your lawsuit against the ladder-maker for your medical costs claiming that you didn’t know that might happen. But what is being pointed is that you don’t _have_ to win the lawsuit to get paid-you just have to be enough of a nuisance for the insurance company to pay you to go away. ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/89 "2013-07-22T11:57:14Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > And the answer in each case is…? Are you really so childish as to demand a black-and-white answer to an ethics question? Whole courses and seminars, and philosophies, are devoted to these issues! What is “right”? If you’re really so hot to explore ethics, I suggest you sign up for some continuing education. FYI: Lawyers are required to take continuing education courses in ethics every year in my licensing state, and probably most, if not all, other states have that requirement as well. Lawyers probably learn more about ethics than you can even imagine exists. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/90 "2013-07-22T11:59:17Z")
> [@legalsnugs](#): > > Are you really so childish as to demand a black-and-white answer to an ethics question? Whole courses and seminars, and philosophies, are devoted to these issues! What is “right”? If you’re really so hot to explore ethics, I suggest you sign up for some continuing education. I just wanted your opinion in each case. What courses do I have to take to get _that_? ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/91 "2013-07-22T12:49:31Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > But what is being pointed is that you don’t _have_ to win the lawsuit to get paid-you just have to be enough of a nuisance for the insurance company to pay you to go away. This is not true. Nothing is as simple as you’re trying to portray it. And I can cite to my own brother-in-law’s history on that. One example, he allegedly slipped and hurt himself in a fast-food “restaurant” and made a claim. They laughed at him. He learned that, thanks to misinformation like you are promulgating, this one chain gets about 1,000 claims every day and declines a huge majority of them. They investigate them, sure, but they’ve gotten pretty good at weeding out the frivolous ones. He also fell at his place of employment, again claiming injuries, but via workers’ compensation. That also just didn’t fly. Insurers are pretty savvy enterprises (which is why an injured plaintiff might NEED a lawyer). If insurers threw a couple thousand at each and every nuisance claim, they’d be out of business. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/92 "2013-07-22T12:51:33Z")
> [@legalsnugs](#): > > This is not true. Nothing is as simple as you’re trying to portray it. And I can cite to my own brother-in-law’s history on that. That’s not a cite that it doesn’t happen that often-that’s a cite that your brother picked the wrong company to go after. ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/93 "2013-07-22T12:52:33Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I just wanted your opinion in each case. What courses do I have to take to get _that_? You can’t always get what you want. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/94 "2013-07-22T12:53:39Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > You assume wrong. Based on your posts overall in this thread, I don’t believe you. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/95 "2013-07-22T12:58:41Z")
> [@legalsnugs](#): > > You can’t always get what you want. Considering your last few posts, may I assume that you’re going the “tit for tat” route when it comes to snark, and that the demand for an apology on my part has been dropped? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/96 "2013-07-22T13:03:09Z")
> [@legalsnugs](#): > > You can’t always get what you want. But if you try sometimes well you just might find You get what you need. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/97 "2013-07-22T13:05:49Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Based on your posts overall in this thread, I don’t believe you. Do you know what I believe? I believe that a bit of indignity _coupled with_ an actual answer to my questions regarding the place of personal morals when it comes to the law might have gone over a bit better than the “How _dare_ you ask such a question?? I’m not even going to dignify that with an answer!” non-answers given so far. This isn’t a court of law where personal questions about the lawyers aren’t permitted-this is a forum titled “In My Humble Opinion”, where personal opinions are actually expected. Of course, this is only _my_ humble opinion. ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/98 "2013-07-22T13:10:57Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > That’s not a cite that it doesn’t happen that often-that’s a cite that your brother picked the wrong company to go after. Ooh, way to prove me wrong. Not even. And it was “companies.” Okay, you don’t believe me. Maybe you’ll believe Duke University Law Professor Neil Vidmar who found in his research: > [@](#): > > “In interviews with liability insurers that I undertook in North Carolina and other states, the most consistent theme from them was: ‘We do not settle frivolous cases!’ The insurers indicated that there are minor exceptions, but their policy on frivolous cases was based on the belief that if they ever begin to settle cases just to make them go away, their credibility will be destroyed and this will encourage more litigation.” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/99 "2013-07-22T13:14:02Z")
Did he actually ask them if they settled “frivolous” cases? What kind of answer did he _expect_ to get back? No insurance company on earth wouldl admit to such a thing in an interview. ---
**Author:** ![legalsnugs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@legalsnugs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/legalsnugs)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2013, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809/100 "2013-07-22T13:18:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Do you know what I believe? …This isn’t a court of law where personal questions about the lawyers aren’t permitted-this is a forum titled “In My Humble Opinion”, where personal opinions are actually expected. > Of course, this is only _my_ humble opinion. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > But what is being pointed is that you don’t _have_ to win the lawsuit to get paid-you just have to be enough of a nuisance for the insurance company to pay you to go away. THAT is your humble opinion. And all I’m doing is pointing out that it is based on erroneous information. Keep it if you want, but it just shows your ignorance. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > Considering your last few posts, may I assume that you’re going the “tit for tat” route when it comes to snark, and that the demand for an apology on my part has been dropped? LOL. That’s not snark. That’s a fact. But I’m not holding my breath waiting for an apology, if that’s what you’re worried about. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/frivolous-lawsuits/663809.md?page=6)