# From A Guitar God Perspecive... **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 18, 2009, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490 "2009-04-18T01:26:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![mariposalabrown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ad7895/32.png) [@mariposalabrown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mariposalabrown)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/21 "2009-04-20T04:34:23Z")
Of course, Vai’s technical prowess surpasses most, but it leaves me cold. On the other hand, very obvious, but so true, Reinhardt makes me shiver, and makes me really sad that I wasn’t born later in life. [Django Reinhardt](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwfhoI2JrOA) ---
**Author:** ![mariposalabrown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ad7895/32.png) [@mariposalabrown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mariposalabrown)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/22 "2009-04-20T04:40:25Z")
Crap, that didn’t work. My friend isn’t Steve Vai, but Guitar Center liked him enough to crown him Blues Guitarist of 2007 or whatever. That’s a cheap 30 dollar junk guitar from Wal-Mart that he put different pickups and whatnot on, and schooled the guys with $3k guitars. And he’s super nice. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dz9yaX81ao](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dz9yaX81ao) ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/23 "2009-04-20T04:42:28Z")
> [@Enter\_the\_Flagon](#): > > Crap, what did I do to that link? > > Let’s try again: > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=riW6BxNeehU](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=riW6BxNeehU) That was very cool. I feel the same way as this guy about rhythms – the shred stuff leaves me cold sometimes – inject some _silence_ into that scale/arpeggio pattern, and it speaks to me, much more strongly than infinite speed picking. I’ve said this about Al DiMeola, but it applies here – listening to infinitely fast guitar is like listening to a sewing machine, and about as interesting. That said, I love pieces from Satriani, Vai, etc, but the number of pieces I really like are few; it does indeed blend together quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/24 "2009-04-20T04:53:18Z")
Satriani is capable of writing effective melodic hooks at least. His songs sound like songs most of the time instead of just solos. ---
**Author:** ![installLSC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/54ee81/32.png) [@installLSC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/installLSC)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/25 "2009-04-20T05:45:47Z")
I’m not particularly impressed with Vai’s playing either. Compare that video with another noted “guitar god” noted for fast playing, [John McLaughlin](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtSIEkPqVgk). Notice the differences? McLaughlin’s tone is raunchier and he’s playing much looser than Vai. He’s also giving a bigger role to his backing musicians, letting them playing inspired solos that help develop the melody. In contrast Vai’s band sounds pretty anonymous; it’s like they’re just a backdrop for his fancy solos. Also check out how Vai’s mentor, [Frank Zappa](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mq-HWKhnI-s) had a more viscerally exciting playing style. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/26 "2009-04-20T12:54:13Z")
Yeah, I don’t really feel like getting into a pissing contest about who’s the best - besides, I thought I firmly established it is Jeff Beck in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=514132);). Bottom line is that with shredding or any form of hyper-fast playing. It is just so much easier to “fake it” once you play fast - meaning to put your brain on auto-pilot and go through the motions. I remember reading a bio of SRV where he stated that when he was strung out on drugs, he would fake it with his audience just by playing fast and that was part of what felt awful about his addictions - selling his fans short. That makes sense to me. \*\*Euth \*\*- I checked out the Gilbert vid (all of them actually - thanks for sharing). But his main point - get a rhythm going, build a riff and then build your solos, regardless of how fast or slow, into that rhythm - I mean, that’s the WHOLE point, innit? Obviously, as I state above, songs come first, but when you are just noodling on guitar for fun or practice, finding that groove is what it is all about. And the greatest players - Jimi, SRV, EVH and many others listed in this thread - THAT is what is so impressive about them: their fluid movement between rhythm and lead work, all within the context of a song. I guess I was a bit surprised at the need to focus on that - but it is the most basic of truths that a guitar player needs to keep front of mind… ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/27 "2009-04-20T14:34:52Z")
Vai’s good and he’s got talent. But he can’t hold a cancel to the late [Micheal Hedges](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JE7eVfIAkkE). ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/28 "2009-04-20T15:29:20Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Vai’s good and he’s got talent. But he can’t hold a cancel to the late [Micheal Hedges](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JE7eVfIAkkE). Chalk and cheese - Hedges was brilliant at what Hedges did: acoustic, unorthodox tunings, playing techniques and even guitar prep (leaving big tangles of used strings on the guitar to evoke sympathetic vibrations is NOT standard practice, for instance! ;)). Vai plays electric primarily and fits much more neatly in the shredder category, although his study and skills range far beyond that one box. Aerial Boundaries is a great, great CD of Hedges’ and I am sure there are many others…truly a tragic loss (he died in a car accident, what, maybe 10+ years ago…) ---
**Author:** ![Shadowfyre](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfyre/32/9972_2.png) [@Shadowfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shadowfyre)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/29 "2009-04-20T15:59:55Z")
I agree with a lot that has been said here. Vai, Johnson, Satriani, Malmsteen, et al are great, but **BORING**. I’m gonna fanwank for SRV. I may have heard Pride and Joy or Lovestruck Baby a few times on the radio growing up, but it wasn’t until a friend of mine played Texas Flood for me that I really understood what great guitar playing was. Within a month of hearing Texas Flood (unfortunately a couple years after he died) I had all his CDs and a shiny new Fender Strat copy. I’m not sure if he could be considered a Guitar God, but Gary Hoey is quite amazing. He plays quite fast and only has a couple of songs that have words. He’s mostly known for his Ho, Ho, Hoey Christmas albums which are pretty cool. I especially like his Mister Grinch rendition. But he has done remakes of other famous songs like Wipeout, Linus and Lucy, Frankenstein, and Hocus Pocus. He favors a more “from the heart” approach. More like SRV than Vai. At least on his remakes. His originals tend more towards the Vai side of the spectrum. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/30 "2009-04-20T17:10:36Z")
> [@Shadowfyre](#): > > I’m gonna fanwank for SRV. No need to call it fanwanking - SRV’s in the Pantheon. I tried to capture some thoughts on his playing in Post #21 in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=510336)… ---
**Author:** ![Black\_Sunshine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ce73a5/32.png) [@Black\_Sunshine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Black_Sunshine)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/31 "2009-04-20T17:45:09Z")
Nothing to add here other than to say that if you ever get a chance to see Vai in concert, you _absolutely_ have to go. His facial expressions and such look kinda silly on video, but in real life, he can work a crowd like no one I’ve ever seen. Best concert experience(s) I’ve had. I’m sure it’s put on, but he really makes you feel like, “Oh! Hi! This riff is for you - I’m happy to see you again and glad you could make it out. OH MY GOD MY FINGERS ARE ON FIRE I CAN’T BELIEVE I CAN PLAY THIS FAST!” ---
**Author:** ![Euthanasiast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Euthanasiast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euthanasiast)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/32 "2009-04-20T23:13:09Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > \*\*Euth \*\*- I checked out the Gilbert vid (all of them actually - thanks for sharing). But his main point - get a rhythm going, build a riff and then build your solos, regardless of how fast or slow, into that rhythm - I mean, that’s the WHOLE point, innit? Obviously, as I state above, songs come first, but when you are just noodling on guitar for fun or practice, finding that groove is what it is all about. And the greatest players - Jimi, SRV, EVH and many others listed in this thread - THAT is what is so impressive about them: their fluid movement between rhythm and lead work, all within the context of a song. > > I guess I was a bit surprised at the need to focus on that - but it is the most basic of truths that a guitar player needs to keep front of mind… Exactly, and my point was that it seems to me that players like Vai craft their solos first and then try to fit a rhythm around that, or worse, that it’s all about the showmanship and even their rhythms are so complex and dynamic that it’s like listening to one long solo. There has to be some reason why I can’t get through a complete song of his without feeling wrung out and numb. And it’s funny how watching Paul Gilbert teach something so basic, so fundamental, seems refreshing and new in contrast to that. ---
**Author:** ![Euthanasiast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Euthanasiast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euthanasiast)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2009, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/33 "2009-04-20T23:34:37Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > No need to call it fanwanking - SRV’s in the Pantheon. I tried to capture some thoughts on his playing in Post #21 in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=510336)… I want to quote you in that thread here, and say that I found your views spot on regarding SRV. It always seemed to me like he was working between the frequencies of two worlds and somehow we were getting the stereo effect of that. For someone that knew dick about what key he was in or even the basics of music theory (or hell, much at all about the fretboard beyond the most basic of chords—I suspect he may even have been borderline retarded), he discovered some wormhole, perhaps by accident, into another dimension of sound, and when he played it was as if he was holding it open for us to peer inside. It was the one thing I always felt that **no one** else could quite reach. Great analysis. > [@Wordman](#): > > - A bit of a savant - folks, especially other famous blues players, use words like “he had a direct channel” or “I’ve never heard someone so endlessly creative and fresh.” I would frame it this way - blues players typically have a bag of licks and tricks and string them together in predictable ways. SRV not only had a freakin’ HUGE back of licks and tricks, but he focused much more on the transitions. I don’t know if I can describe, but it’s like he set himself a challenge “okay, I will do lick number 427b - now how can I make that transition to the trick where I grab my whammy bar and rattle it to get that crushing low end E?” and it’s making those unexpected transitions that give the old-school licks their freshness. But it’s weird - there is a hint of Rain Man in SRV - like on the spectrum from “all mental/head-driven” on one side and “all heart/instinct” on the other side, SRV is redlined all the way to the right - no head at all. Heck, even hippy-dippy Hendrix wrote his songs, innovated on their production, tweaked his guitars to suit his needs, etc. When Cesar Diaz, SRV’s guitar man, is interviewed, he talks about how SRV had a “native intelligence” but no clue. Now, Cesar seems to also want to inflate his own legend a bit, so I would take this with a grain of salt. But if I hear one more story about how SRV never bathed, had no idea how his rig worked but knew what sounded good and “had a direct channel to God” I may actually start believing them…he sounds like freakin’s St. Stevie out in the desert for 40 days and 40 nights trying to divine the message or something. > > - SRV relative to Hendrix: SRV is an acolyte of Hendrix’, pure and simple. It is understood that from SRV’s perspective, Hendrix is the originator and far superior to himself. But most guitarists acknowledge that Hendrix had a sloppier approach - when SRV kicks in the wah-lick intro of Voodoo Chile (Slight Return) his bends are more precise and his synchronization of the wah foot-pedal with his fingers playing the lick is more spot on. > > - His tone stands alone - if SRV is revered for anything above all else, it is his tone. His guitar tone is the Michael Jordan of Stratocaster tones - there are other great players just as worthy of respect, but Jordan is fixed in the cross-over public’s mind as the Platonic Ideal of a basketball greatness. So it is with SRV’s Strat tone. Clear and bell-like, it crunches up perfectly - so his walking bass licks in Pride and Joy sound deep and bassy and tight, but the minute he attacks the strings harder, the tone breaks up. I think ultimately what is so amazing about his guitar tone is that you can hear him working - his tone is so clear and so touch-responsive, with no distracting sonic bits like ice-picky highs or distorted lows - that you feel like you can hear more of what his fingers and hands are doing? I mean - you know how much cooler it is to hear someone sing live where you KNOW they are flying without a net and you can hear the breaths and the decisions to reach for the note - isn’t that better than a radio-scrubbed vocal that almost sounds manufactured? Well, SRV’s tone puts you right there. And omigod, you should read the geekery that goes on when folks try to pick apart his tone. Jeez, the specific circuit changes on his Fender amps; the fact that he used a Dumble (a hand-made amp based on a Fender circuit of which only ~150 were made - due to SRV, they go for tens of thousands of $$ now), the fact that he (in homage to Hendrix) prefers Radio Shack curly guitar cables (they inefficiently cut the highs in a way that Hendrix had to tolerate at the time but SRV prefers). And don’t get me started on the “dummy coil” that Cesar Diaz apparently set up underneath SRV’s legendary #1 Firstwife’s pickguard - it’s like the Loch Ness Monster of modifications…_if_ it was done, it would’ve been to cut out the noise that comes from a Fender’s single-coil pickups… ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2009, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490/34 "2009-04-21T01:06:35Z")
Hey - that’s cool to hear coming from you; thanks. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-a-guitar-god-perspecive/493490.md?page=1)