# ...from the President of the United States: WE CANNOT LET THE CURE BE WORSE THAN THE PROBLEM ITSELF **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 23, 2020, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078 "2020-03-23T05:48:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/241 "2020-03-26T10:25:11Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Abortions are “essential health-care”? There are circumstances where continued pregnancy can kill the mother. In such cases, yes, abortions are essential health care. The fact that such circumstances are uncommon do not make them any less real. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/242 "2020-03-26T12:47:51Z")
Men are in no position to talk about abortion - full stop. If a man wants to be part of a ground-breaking lab experiment that tries to get him pregnant and carry a child to term via a natural birth, then maybe at that time he can talk about abortion. Until then, I really don’t give a shit what someone with a penis has to say on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/243 "2020-03-26T12:54:28Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > C’mon, Grandma! Go with the floe! That’s cold, dude. ---
**Author:** ![MulderMuffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldermuffin/32/2862_2.png) [@MulderMuffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MulderMuffin)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/244 "2020-03-26T13:20:55Z")
> **[A Georgia healthcare worker was found dead in her home, and a posthumous test...](https://news.yahoo.com/georgia-healthcare-worker-found-dead-065819012.html)** > > Healthcare workers in the US are contracting the novel coronavirus and few have already died from COVID-19. > [@](#): > > Wilkes was 42 years old. She appears to have died 12 to 16 hours before her body was found in her home. Her four-year-old child was near her body when police found her. … An autopsy is being conducted but the mother did not have any known underlying health conditions. _Only the elderly and those with underlying conditions are at risk. It is known_! Trump wants the younger, healthy people to start working again, because you have to be over 60 or already suffering from an underlying condition to get a bad case of the virus. Maybe that WAS true, I don’t think it is any more. Hospitals and families are reluctant to discuss deaths and hospitalizations, due to privacy laws and social stigma I imagine, but more and more I’m hearing of younger people being increasingly more ill and requiring medical intervention and even dying. Thinking that we can lock up senior citizens and have the rest of the country carry on may be more wrong than Trump knows. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/245 "2020-03-26T13:53:00Z")
Gaggle of Republicants think that the Coronavirus aid will [make all those proles an even more irresponsible lot of scofflaws.](https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/gop-senators-coronavirus-unemployment_n_5e7bb651c5b6cb08a926dd62?ri18n=true) > [@](#): > > “A massive drafting error in the current version of the coronavirus relief legislation could have devastating consequences: Unless this bill is fixed, there is a strong incentive for employees to be laid off instead of going to work,” GOP Sens. Lindsey Graham (S.C.), Rick Scott (Fla.), Tim Scott (S.C.) and Ben Sasse (Neb.) said Wednesday in a statement, according to RawStory. Riiiiiight, those crazy drafting errors (oops!) (_Hate_ it when that happens.) Meanwhile, an unnamed reporter nicely sums it up: > [@](#): > > “I don’t know how to ask this without sounding like I’m being a smartass, and I’m not,” the reporter said. “But do you understand how bad the optics are to have probably the wealthiest person in the Senate potentially holding up this bill for a couple hundred bucks for some of the poorest people in this country?” And of course to rebut, with this rich piece of down-home, greenish calf’s diarrhea from Ben Sasse (R. Neb.): > [@](#): > > “If you go into any coffee shop in Nebraska … and you say, ‘Do we as a people think what America wants to do is say, “Let’s have the federal government build a program that says we want to incentivize severing people’s work relationships?”’ Hell no!” he said. And of course none of those people in said coffee shop would _never ever_ have to worry about unemployment or getting sick. You see: they’re too chosen, or something. Ya, _HELL NO!_ ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/246 "2020-03-26T14:30:28Z")
> [@Guest-starring\_Id](#): > > Gaggle of Republicants think that the Coronavirus aid will [make all those proles an even more irresponsible lot of scofflaws.](https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/gop-senators-coronavirus-unemployment_n_5e7bb651c5b6cb08a926dd62?ri18n=true) So let me see if I have this straight. GOP congresspeople believe that, if we don’t extend aid to people who lose their jobs because of virus measures, that businesses won’t actually lay them off? That businesses will just continue to pay people to do nothing while they have zero or greatly reduced revenue coming in? Or do they believe people are laying themselves off out of choice, not because their employers are closed or crippled? Personal responsibility = virus, schmirus, get back to work you slackers. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/247 "2020-03-26T14:37:49Z")
And as I’ve seen pointed out in multiple places - you don’t get unemployment if you quit. So Lindsey’s hypothetical nurse isn’t going to quit her job with the increased odds of getting Covid-19 to sit at home and enjoy $600 a week, because she won’t be eligible. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/248 "2020-03-26T14:45:10Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > And as I’ve seen pointed out in multiple places - you don’t get unemployment if you quit. So Lindsey’s hypothetical nurse isn’t going to quit her job with the increased odds of getting Covid-19 to sit at home and enjoy $600 a week, because she won’t be eligible. They ought to be giving her an extra $1200 a week to stay on the job, then, and free health insurance for life. But no – she knew what she signed up for when she took the job, right? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/249 "2020-03-26T15:09:06Z")
Basically Sasse and others are exposing how THEY would look at the world. This suggests the only reason \*they \*have, in their own lives, hustled and strived is because of ambition for wealth and power; but that if they were in the position of being stuck as a lowly minion, \*they would \*be looking to do maximum leeching off the productive members of the economy. Besides, there’s an easy solution for those who think unemployment compensation is so plush that people will rather stay on it than come back to the company. _ **Increase worker pay.** _ But the way they completely leave aside that _if you willingly quit or choose not to seek new employment, you do not qualify_ is no accident. It’s part of a systematic project to establish in the base’s consciousness that ALL of the Safety Net, whether vested or not (and remember, Unemployment and SocSec are PAID by taxes on the employment transaction, they are not gifts) is just undeserved welfare for lazy slackers, and if you end up suffering in destitution well just tough cookies, that’s life, Jesus will take care of you after you die. Remember, these are people not just out to undo Obama or the Great Society, but out to undo the New Deal and if possible the Progressive Era. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/250 "2020-03-26T15:09:36Z")
> [@MulderMuffin](#): > > Maybe that WAS true, I don’t think it is any more. Let’s get this right out of the way. It was NEVER true. The intimation that it only affects older people is based on false premises. Most of the ICU beds occupied for the virus currently are used by people under the age of 65. Based on what we have seen over the last 3 months, it IS true that older people and people with underlying conditions appear to be at GREATER risk for serious symptoms or death. This has been consistently true. Somehow, this became conflated (in typical human fashion) with the idea that being younger or having no underlying conditions posed NO risk for serious complications or even death. Lower risk is NOT the same as no risk but it has been treated this way by a lot of people. So even if (and these numbers are totally out of the air for purposes of demonstration) that not being older or underlying complications poses a 0.1% risk of death or conditions serious enough to require hospitalization, 0.1% is NOT 0. The reason you see more stories of younger people dying is there are now MORE infected. 0.1% of 100 people is 1/10 of a person, i.e. no news stories about it. 0.1% of 100000 people is 100 people, i.e. you’ll start hearing stories about them as more people are affected. And, of course, they can still spread the virus. We already know people are bad at math. Unfortunately, this time it may cost some people their lives. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/251 "2020-03-26T15:27:40Z")
> [@Fugazi](#): > > It always bothers me when folks try to justify abortions with saving the life of the mother or aborting because of rape. Fuck that. It’s her body and she does not want it to be used at that time for growing a fetus. Period. That should be all the explanation anyone needs. > > So yes, it is a necessary medical procedure that should be performed as soon as possible. If abortion was always considered a necessary medical procedure then the human race would die out when no more births occur. 😛 It should be uncontroversial that abortion is necessary when the mother’s life is at risk. Anyone but the most hardcore anti-abortion zealot should accept that. Whether or not it’s necessary because a woman does not want to be pregnant is trickier. I understand the belief that if a woman doesn’t want to be pregnant she should be allowed to terminate the pregnancy. I have two daughters and I remember what that was like for their mothers. It’s a massive life-changing experience to carry a child and give birth and a woman should not have to go through that involuntarily. But from a medical perspective, giving birth to a child is a natural process, so an abortion from that angle does not seem like a medical “necessity”. Not in most cases. So to me it depends on how you are defining it. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/252 "2020-03-26T15:53:06Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > But from a medical perspective, giving birth to a child is a natural process, so an abortion from that angle does not seem like a medical “necessity”. Not in most cases. So to me it depends on how you are defining it. But we intervene to prevent many other natural processes from irrevocably altering a person’s life, right? ---
**Author:** ![Frazzled](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frazzled/32/3368_2.png) [@Frazzled](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frazzled)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/253 "2020-03-26T15:57:32Z")
Check out this ad about the number of Corona Virus cases over time and Trumps response to it. This one needs to be aired constantly! What’s truly scary about it is it clearly shows the exponential rise of cases. That Trump is even remotely thinking we’re going back to work in 2 weeks is a fools dream. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/bkMwvmJLnc0/maxresdefault.jpg "Exponential Threat") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkMwvmJLnc0) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/254 "2020-03-26T15:58:08Z")
Does anyone know if Fox News is still telling their core demographic of people over 65 that they should sacrifice themselves so that the kids can go out to bars and get drunk again? How is this going over with the older generation? Are they happy to die in order to keep the DOW above water? ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/255 "2020-03-26T15:59:11Z")
And lest we forget, Best Buys, sporting goods stores, and Hobby Lobbys are apparently essential businesses. Maybe they have a point, but if so, it’s not exactly a stretch to say legal abortions are as necessary as a medical procedure, if not more so, than those as essential public businesses. The accusation that some officials are taking advantage of the situation is not entirely unfounded. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/256 "2020-03-26T16:00:09Z")
> [@MulderMuffin](#): > > [A Georgia healthcare worker was found dead in her home, and a posthumous test found she was infected with the new coronavirus](https://news.yahoo.com/georgia-healthcare-worker-found-dead-065819012.html) > _Only the elderly and those with underlying conditions are at risk. It is known_! Trump wants the younger, healthy people to start working again, because you have to be over 60 or already suffering from an underlying condition to get a bad case of the virus. Maybe that WAS true, I don’t think it is any more. Hospitals and families are reluctant to discuss deaths and hospitalizations, due to privacy laws and social stigma I imagine, but more and more I’m hearing of younger people being increasingly more ill and requiring medical intervention and even dying. Thinking that we can lock up senior citizens and have the rest of the country carry on may be more wrong than Trump knows. Wait until it’s not just one 30-something who goes to the ER deprived of oxygen but scores of them at the same time. They’ll end up in waiting rooms with all of the other 40, 50, 60, and 70-somethings. I don’t care how old you are: struggle to breathe long enough, and you die. ---
**Author:** ![Keith1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/6de8d8/32.png) [@Keith1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keith1)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/257 "2020-03-26T16:03:26Z")
> **[Opinion: Canada must be ready for the mayhem Trump’s about to unleash](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-canada-must-be-ready-for-the-mayhem-trumps-about-to-unleash/)** > > President Donald Trump’s vow to begin relaxing social distancing requirements by Easter Sunday could have profound health implications for the U.S. – and, in turn, for us in Canada ---
**Author:** ![Keith1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/6de8d8/32.png) [@Keith1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keith1)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/258 "2020-03-26T16:05:37Z")
[quote=“Frazzled, post:253, topic:850078”] Check out this ad about the number of Corona Virus cases over time and Trumps response to it. This one needs to be aired constantly! What’s truly scary about it is it clearly shows the exponential rise of cases. That Trump is even remotely thinking we’re going back to work in 2 weeks is a fools dream. [/QUOTE] What bigger fool?! ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/259 "2020-03-26T16:40:22Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > But we intervene to prevent many other natural processes from irrevocably altering a person’s life, right? Do we? Do you have an example of an equivalent procedure done as a medical necessity? I don’t know of an example, I’m legitimately curious what you have in mind. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078/260 "2020-03-26T18:15:24Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > I looked at the top 15 states with the most cases of Covid-19 and separated by 2016 Presidential vote. > > Current fatality rates: > > Red-land: 1.5% > Blue-land: 1.1% > > Hard to predict where the primary hit will come. I expect worse care in red country. However, I would expect that the average child count per family is and has been lower in blue country, so the elderly are a larger slice of the pie there. Blue country is also more densely populated. I did a deeper, county-by-county analysis. Current fatality rate: Red-land: 1.37% Blue-land: 1.27% [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/from-the-president-of-the-united-states-we-cannot-let-the-cure-be-worse-than-the-problem-itself/850078.md?page=14)