# FTR: No matter how harsh I get here with the nasty wordsies, I am not "persecuting" you **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 7, 2014, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591 "2014-04-07T23:17:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2014, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/141 "2014-04-14T03:34:36Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Did it sound something like this: So, I’ll just do EVERYone’s work! What does it matter if I drop dead at my desk? 😛 Stop channeling my bubbe! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2014, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/142 "2014-04-14T03:55:57Z")
How many\* bubbes\* to change a lightbulb? None, don’t bother, I’ll sit in the dark… ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2014, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/143 "2014-04-14T12:55:18Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Brief sidetrack: surely it cannot have escaped your notice that the new rolleyes smilie, looking as it does like someone trying to escape the blame for a fart, lacks a great deal of the disdainful impact of the old green one, with its “Lord give me strength to suffer this fool” flavor. Oh, I get that. The new roll eyes sucks. Just not seeing why **White SIFL** used a roll eyes at all. ---
**Author:** ![Nancarrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@Nancarrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nancarrow)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2014, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/144 "2014-04-14T13:35:09Z")
> [@Stanislaus](#): > > Well, yes, words do have meanings. “Persecute”, for example, has two: both equally valid… > > …but one has rhetorical impact and one does not. Four days later and only tangentially related, but I’d like to use **Stanislaus** ’s impeccable example on another religiously-themed case of less-than-honest meaning substitution. I am an _outspoken_ atheist. If you call me a _militant_ atheist, you are being a sneaky, Brickeresque slimeball. But you’re being the ‘best’\* kind of sneaky - the technically true ‘I can hide behind a dictionary’ sneaky. You can claim that you’re only using the word ‘militant’ in its mild sense as a synonym for ‘forthright’. Then you can turn round and say you think militant atheists are as awful as militant theists and, people being as careless about language as they are, _you’ll probably get away with it_. :mad: \*Interestingly, another dual use word, though in this case the uses are practically antonyms. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2014, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/145 "2014-04-14T14:45:39Z")
They do the same thing with “radical”…like its a bad thing. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2014, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/146 "2014-04-14T23:25:06Z")
> [@Nancarrow](#): > > Four days later and only tangentially related, but I’d like to use **Stanislaus** ’s impeccable example on another religiously-themed case of less-than-honest meaning substitution. > > I am an _outspoken_ atheist. If you call me a _militant_ atheist, you are being a sneaky, Brickeresque slimeball. But you’re being the ‘best’\* kind of sneaky - the technically true ‘I can hide behind a dictionary’ sneaky. You can claim that you’re only using the word ‘militant’ in its mild sense as a synonym for ‘forthright’. Then you can turn round and say you think militant atheists are as awful as militant theists and, people being as careless about language as they are, _you’ll probably get away with it_. :mad: > \*Interestingly, another dual use word, though in this case the uses are practically antonyms. “Dictionary sneaky”? That’s a new one. Why would anyone use a dictionary definition to define a word. :rolleyes: Militant means active, determined, and often willing to use force. Outspoken means expressing strong opinions very directly without worrying if other people will be upset by them. Referring to someone as a _militant_ means you believe they are willing to use force or have used force in an attempt to make others do their bidding. ---
**Author:** ![Nancarrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@Nancarrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nancarrow)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2014, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/147 "2014-04-15T14:49:11Z")
So when the likes of Dawkins, Dennett and Harris get described as ‘militant atheists’, rather than seeing it as a slimy attempt to smear their character, you would prefer to simply call out their accusers for the bald-faced liars that they are? That works for me too. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/148 "2014-04-17T14:50:03Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Brief sidetrack: surely it cannot have escaped your notice that the new rolleyes smilie, looking as it does like someone trying to escape the blame for a fart, lacks a great deal of the disdainful impact of the old green one, with its “Lord give me strength to suffer this fool” flavor. > [@magellan01](#): > > Oh, I get that. The new roll eyes sucks. Just not seeing why **White SIFL** used a roll eyes at all. I should think that was obvious, isn’t it? It’s because he was responding to something posted by . . . uhhh, oh wait, no, I suppose it’s not going to be apparent to you, is it? ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/149 "2014-04-17T15:12:28Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > I should think that was obvious, isn’t it? It’s because he was responding to something posted by . . . uhhh, oh wait, no, I suppose it’s not going to be apparent to you, is it? What are you talking about? This is what I wrote that generated the roll eyes by\*\* White SIFL\*\*: [QUOTE=magellan01] Wait—I’m not aware of the thread that this was discussed in, nor all of the details… [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2014, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/150 "2014-04-17T17:43:27Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, you are what you eat. You eat stupid? Slee ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/151 "2014-04-18T05:32:08Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > What are you talking about? This is what I wrote that generated the roll eyes by\*\* White SIFL\*\*: My bad, I guess. In my defense, it DOES save time to just assume that if you posted it, it merits a rolleyes. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/152 "2014-04-18T12:12:41Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > My bad, I guess. In my defense, it DOES save time to just assume that if you posted it, it merits a rolleyes. > > 😛 I can certainly respect a a quest for efficiency. And it’s a good way for you to zoom straight to being wrong again without having to further tax those two brain cells.😉 ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/153 "2014-04-18T19:53:12Z")
> [@Nancarrow](#): > > So when the likes of Dawkins, Dennett and Harris get described as ‘militant atheists’, rather than seeing it as a slimy attempt to smear their character, you would prefer to simply call out their accusers for the bald-faced liars that they are? > > That works for me too. I’ll decide my own preferences, if’n that’s OK with you. Even if it ain’t, it’s what I intend to do. If someone wants to describe Dawkins, Dennett, and Harris as “militant atheists”, that’s for that “someone” to decide. It’s then up to that “someone” to back up their statements. Again - Referring to someone as a _militant_ means you believe they are willing to use force or have used force in an attempt to make others do their bidding. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/154 "2014-04-18T21:20:37Z")
The term has been debased and distorted beyond all recognition. Bet I could find someone being described as a “militant pacifist”, if I took the time. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/155 "2014-04-18T21:30:52Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Again - > Referring to someone as a _militant_ means you believe they are willing to use force or have used force in an attempt to make others do their bidding. Inventing silly definitions does not actually help one win a debate–particularly when the audience is sufficiently literate to know that the invented definition does not actually describe the term. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/156 "2014-04-18T22:47:21Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Inventing silly definitions does not actually help one win a debate–particularly when the audience is sufficiently literate to know that the invented definition does not actually describe the term. People are constantly inventing silly definitions, especially on the internet. I’m not sure if they are trying to win a debate, preaching to the choir, or hoping for an emotional reaction. For the record, I used the term _militant atheist_ as an example and not to imply that anyone was actually a militant anything. However, referring to someone as a _militant_ does mean the speaker believes, or wants others to believe, that the subject is willing to use force, or have used force, in an attempt to make others do their bidding. _militant adjective /ˈmɪl.ɪ.tənt/ › active, determined, and often willing to use force: militant union extremists The group has taken a militant position on the abortion issue and is refusing to compromise_. > **[militant](https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/militant?q=Militant%2B)** > > 1. active, determined, and often willing to use force: 2. someone who is… A _militant atheist_ would be an atheist who is willing to use force. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2014, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591/157 "2014-04-18T22:59:08Z")
Atheists (or anyone, really) who are loudmouthed but not specifically or potentially violent, I like to call “strident”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ftr-no-matter-how-harsh-i-get-here-with-the-nasty-wordsies-i-am-not-persecuting-you/685591.md?page=7)