# Fuck the fashion police. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 2, 2018, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462 "2018-05-02T14:23:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/21 "2018-05-02T16:45:49Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I find it mildly stupid that a _man_ Judging by the Twitter feed, he still has a few more years before getting to that point. Looks like a whiny, racist _kid_ to me. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/22 "2018-05-02T16:51:51Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > Judging by the Twitter feed, he still has a few more years before getting to that point. Looks like a whiny, racist _kid_ to me. Yes. What made his comment a bigger deal is that he got himself a nice little twitter mob to attack the girl. By himself he’s a pissant. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/23 "2018-05-02T16:52:12Z")
As a Chinese American, for one data point I’ll weigh in with, “I couldn’t possibly care less,” and the people complaining about it are fucking idiots. That people other than Asians can see beauty and value in the Eastern aesthetic is both flattering and an absolute nothingburger. Of all the ignorant, racist shit people have ever done to Asians _this_ is where you pick to make your stand, random guy on Twitter?! ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/24 "2018-05-02T16:59:52Z")
Oh my god! Attacked by a Twitter mob! I hope she’s okay. The fashion police are not about cultural appropriation BTW. They are about socks with sandals and white shoes after labor day. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/25 "2018-05-02T17:00:33Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Yeah, they aren’t like that guy who, get this, flipped out because someone said that a kid creeped them out in commercial. The kid has some sort of disorder, so he had to defend them from these vile posters. Nevermind that the only thing that bothered them was that he was being smarmy to some adults. > > Why is it so fucking hard to listen to these people who are upset about a legitimate topic? Why is it that we think making fun of them will fix the issue? Did making fun of that guy I describe help him figure it out? Nah. I even praised him for having his heart in the right place, because it was. > > These are actual Asian people who feel their culture is being appropriated and sold by Americans. This problem isn’t going to go away. There will be no line fixed as long as mocking is the only thing they ever receive. Mockery means you are the enemy, and thus you are the person they need to stop. > > And, yes, you can call me an SJW if you like. I don’t really care. I am in fact standing up for these people, because I think it’s ridiculous to ignore them, even if I think that the likely dress isn’t actually cultural appropriation. > > This isn’t some big contentious issue. We could actually come together and work this out, but we won’t. Most people in this country don’t give a shit about other people anymore. Why are you using the internet? Did you invent it? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/26 "2018-05-02T17:02:39Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Of all the ignorant, racist shit people have ever done to Asians _this_ is where you pick to make your stand, random guy on Twitter?! A few days ago, he blamed all his problems on white people; now he’s singled one out. ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/27 "2018-05-02T17:07:11Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > _ **Cultural appropriation** _ is when someone profits by waltzing in and grabbing up something created by another community–by selling it, (without really understanding it or appreciating it)–while the original creators get nothing. > > The situation in the OP doesn’t apply. They are misusing the term, and that just causes general knee-jerk backlash to the term itself. Considering all the western stuff that China bootlegs, this discussion about a freaking dress should end now. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/28 "2018-05-02T17:10:55Z")
I should think one could respond that, if cultural appropriation had been an issue for the owner, they wouldn’t have dropped it in a goodwill bin now would they? But who can say how it got there? It could be someone bought it on holiday in a foreign land, as in it was actively being marketed to tourists, then is it still cultural appropriation? Or support for local craftsmen and industry? Where’s that line get drawn I wonder? ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/29 "2018-05-02T17:12:14Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > _ **Cultural appropriation** _ is when someone profits by waltzing in and grabbing up something created by another community–by selling it, (without really understanding it or appreciating it)–while the original creators get nothing… But the amount of valid mockery that seems to surround claims of cultural appropriation really makes me question whether it’s a coherent and valid idea at all. The concept of intellectual property is usually applied to a _specific_ creator(s) and _specific_ work. Cultural appropriation seems to want to extend this, but it runs into problems in two senses: (1) “Culture” in a broad seems pretty much by definition to mean something that has passed into the public domain. (2) How do you define the boundaries of the “community” that “owns” it? In this example, just how “Chinese” do I have to be make use of Chinese culture - is it defined by birth, by genetics, by what exactly? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/30 "2018-05-02T17:21:37Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > I should think one could respond that, if cultural appropriation had been an issue for the owner, they wouldn’t have dropped it in a goodwill bin now would they? > > But who can say how it got there? [Lots of them for sale](https://www.alibaba.com/showroom/qipao.html) at [Alibaba](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alibaba_Group). Some even have Westerners modeling them. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/31 "2018-05-02T17:35:45Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Why are you using the internet? Did you invent it? Hey **Octoputz** , how you been? I’d missed you. I was afraid you finally got your head too far up your ass to breath. Glad I was wrong. Take care bro. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/32 "2018-05-02T17:45:21Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > (1) “Culture” in a broad seems pretty much by definition to mean something that has passed into the public domain. > > (2) How do you define the boundaries of the “community” that “owns” it? In this example, just how “Chinese” do I have to be make use of Chinese culture - is it defined by birth, by genetics, by what exactly? The concept isn’t so much concerned with such technical points, but rather, it’s more about power dynamics. It’s a general, sociological idea, and was never meant to be applied to things at such a specific level. That’s why the people who complain about the dress are missing the point, but also so are people who make the false equivalency that if an enthincially Chinese person takes on a “western” name it’s exactly the same thing. Existing power relationships set a context that belies such supposed equivalencies. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/33 "2018-05-02T17:53:45Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > The concept isn’t so much concerned with such technical points, but rather, it’s more about power dynamics. It’s a general, sociological idea, and was never meant to be applied to things at such a specific level. Can you give examples of when the concept really means something valid and important? ---
**Author:** ![Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Living_Well_Is_Best_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/34 "2018-05-02T18:02:01Z")
I thought part of the issue too was that she made some sort of stereotypical Asian gesture in a picture. I am too lazy and don’t care enough to look for it though. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/35 "2018-05-02T18:02:26Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > The concept isn’t so much concerned with such technical points, but rather, it’s more about power dynamics. It’s a general, sociological idea, and was never meant to be applied to things at such a specific level. > > That’s why the people who complain about the dress are missing the point, but also so are people who make the false equivalency that if an enthincially Chinese person takes on a “western” name it’s exactly the same thing. Existing power relationships set a context that belies such supposed equivalencies. Let’s weigh the power relationships in this case–[while China has the second-largest economy based on nominal GDP, it has the largest economy based on purchasing power parity](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_China). And [with a population of 1.39 billion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependencies_by_population), Chinese outnumber Americans 4.25 to 1. So I’d say those are pretty darn even power dynamics. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/36 "2018-05-02T18:09:40Z")
> [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](#): > > I thought part of the issue too was that she made some sort of stereotypical Asian gesture in a picture. I am too lazy and don’t care enough to look for it though. According to comments on some of the sites I linked in the OP, they were posing in memes from [some YouTube channel called H3H3productions](http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/people/h3h3productions) that I had never heard of. [H3H3 has responded](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvdDKjy-87w). ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/37 "2018-05-02T18:24:28Z")
I love it when people toss around “cultural appropriation” and such like terms. Helps me quickly identify the morons hiding amongst the progressives. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/38 "2018-05-02T19:33:56Z")
I can understand Indian nations objecting to the ornamental wearing of war bonnets, because it looks like stolen honor. But this was a _cheongsam._ It’s old-fashioned now, but it was an extremely common kind of dress in much of the Chinese world for ages. Denouncing a white girl who wears such an incredibly ordinary sort of women’s clothing for “not learning about whiteness” sounds _exactly_ like denouncing a Punjabi girl who wears a blazer and slacks for “not learning about Hindutva.” Jeremy Lan is a troll. Y’all been trolled. I don’t know what WaPo’s excuse is. _The Mary Sue_ is a clickbait site, and yet\* you’d think they’d know better.\* I don’t pay attention to most of the British press, but it looks like the _Independent_ is some kind of river scum like much of the British press. Are they all just being trolled? Or do they really think this nonsense makes sense? Anybody serious about this sounds like a Nazi to me. These nazi twits, these \*Twitstaffel, \*do they even realize what they’re saying? ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/39 "2018-05-02T19:44:27Z")
> [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](#): > > I thought part of the issue too was that she made some sort of stereotypical Asian gesture in a picture. I am too lazy and don’t care enough to look for it though. What the hell is a stereotypical Asian gesture? I can only think of bowing and I don’t think that’s Chinese. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2018, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462/40 "2018-05-02T19:52:28Z")
Also, while trying to not delve too deep down various rabbit holes, I believe that cultural/economic power differential is central to the idea of cultural appropriation. I think one would be hard pressed to make the argument that Chinese culture (and the ability to control its meaning and/or profit from it) has been taken from the Chinese in this case. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-the-fashion-police/813462.md?page=3)