I disagree. The church without a congregation isn’t anything. Change can be forced from the laity if they insist on it. They won’t because they just don’t see enough wrong with it. It’s “wrong,” they say, just not wrong enough.
There’s no such thing as an organization that can’t be changed by the masses. Egad, pun not intended.
If institutionalized child rape isn’t enough even to stop you ardently defending it, then what would? If requiring death isn’t enough even to stop you ardently defending it, then what would be? If institutionalized misogyny isn’t enough either, then what is?
There are many, many ways to be a Christian without having to support that shit. There are many Christian denominations you could convert to, almost all of whom are free of that shit. Yet your loyalty remains to a human organization above the teachings of Christ himself. How is it that you call yourself a Christian?
Please, prey tell-if child abuse and molestation, the subjugation of women, the condemnation of gays and the suppression of needed birth control(the list can be made much longer easily, btw) isn’t enough, what the fuck is?
RCC rep: You’re excommunicated!
Nun: Oh no! It’s a disaster!
Rep: Oh, it’s not that bad really. Nothing to worry about. Certainly not a disaster. No no. It’s just a flesh wound.
Nun: A flesh wound!
Rep: A paper cut! That’s it. A paper cut. Who would complain about a paper cut? Look, I’ll just cut my own finger with this paper, shall I? It’s no big deal.
Nun: You didn’t do it.
Rep: I’m steeling myself.
The only change they can force is to make it dwindle, perhaps eventually disappear. But I do agree in general that the continued blind institutional loyalty of so many members of this organization has enabled its moral corruption.
Surely it’s clear though, that the Pope is the most widely admired, respected and adored leader that no one follows.
The whole world, Catholics included, continue to have premarital sex, abortions, cheat on their wives, lie on their taxes, screw people over in business, embrace homosexuality as acceptable, and cruelly judge anyone they deem lesser than themselves.
Sure, they flock to St Peter’s square to see him, wouldn’t dream of missing the Vatican, on a visit to Rome, attend church every week, tithe, practice the sacraments and pray over their dead. But they don’t take direction from him. They continue to live as they believe regardless of church doctrine. Pretty obvious to anyone with eyes.
The last time the Pope’s teachings were relevant were at least a century ago. If the God of the bible, (harsh, judgmental, vengeful), truly existed, these bastards would have been out of business long ago. But, then, what can you expect from a cult that worships a, risen from the dead, zombie?
The Pope? Dearly beloved, wildly respected, much admired and totally useless for any practical purpose. If this particular Pope believed in any tiny bit of what Christ said he’d have acted to end child abuse by priests when he had the chance, and he had many. But he didn’t, instead he followed Church protocol and shined everybody on. For which, I hope, his zombie God delivers him the very warm afterlife he uses to threaten his parishioners with.
Perhaps his enamoration with being able to play with something called “law”, however inaccurately, to the point of inability to see almost any other concern, is part of the problem, as for him it so often is?
And practices ritual cannibalism. Don’t forget that part.
I wonder what would happen if all practicing Catholics kept practicing, except no one gave any money.
In any case, if all the lay members left the church, it would cease to exist. I do hold individual Catholics accountable, but their accountability is much more dilute, and sadly I have seen how brainwashed many are. It’s quite a racket to set up your club as the *only *way to avoid eternal hell, and indoctrinate people in that from birth.
You know, something is telling me you’re not really asking this question in good faith.
I do have a serious question about all of this confusing and complex Catholic doctrine. I’ll admit up front that I know nothing about it, so I’d appreciate help from any experts about how the following tricky hypothetical situation would be judged according to Canon Law:
What would happen if Jesus pulled-off another Lazarus deal and re-animated the rotting corpse of Mother Teresa, who then, after checking her email, popped in to the SDMB and read this thread. Upon encountering my post #154 she finds my logic unassailable and thus is pleasantly surprised to learn that raping Jesus is not a violation of Canon Law.
The Zombie Teresa then proceeds (remember–this is only hypothetical) to tie-up and gag The Prince of Peace, then squats down on his raging, Rock-of-Ages-hard Holy Cock, riding away to Rape-Ecstasy until so much of her decomposing cunt rots away that Christ’s dick falls out and the fun’s over. But not before he has jizzed up her Blessed Cooze, Immaculately Impregnating her.
Further, suppose that Jesus–cursing his shitty luck for knocking-up some groupie the very first time either of them has ever had sex–says, “Zombie T? I’m sorry but there is no way in Hell you gonna keep that baby!”
Then (hypothetically) Mother Teresa responds aghast, “Why, My Lord, Savior, and Fuck-Buddy… it is a mortal sin to abort a child!”
And then, just suppose that Christ replies, “Yes my child. That has always been my Holy Law. But I ain’t never knocked no bitch up before, neither! So I, as the Ultimate Bossman of the Holy Church, hereby decree a Sacred Miracle that which I now do unto you.”
At that point, let’s say Jesus rams some forceps (sprinkled with Holy Water–this is key) up the Blessed Birth Canal and yanks out His own little Holy Fetus-Son who has somehow, Miraculously, developed almost to full-term.
And then, after he throws the bloody pile of fetal goo into the bio-hazard bin, Pope Benedict, hypothetically-speaking, sneaks up, removes the slimy, Neverborn Heir of Heaven and Earth from the garbage can and forces his already bloody and shit-stained Joy-Rod repeatedly up the Unborn Carcass’ asshole (Clue: Remember, the Pope is Infallible!)
Again, this situation is only hypothetical. It is offered as a thought experiment for advanced scholars of Catholic Canon Law only. Read the above scenario several times carefully, pray over it, show it to your kids, have a wank or two, and then please give your answer to the following three-part question (Be careful! There’s a few Zingers in there! This one’s a real noggin-scratcher!)
**In the above thought experiment, has any Person, Deity, or Blessed Biological Waste-Product committed any Mortal Sins? If you answered yes, who is (are) the sinner(s) and how many Mortal Sins were committed?
Show your work.**
Bricker: It’s in as good a faith as your claim that he’s responding to. If you really meant that there are scenarios that could make you leave the RCC, then try telling us what they are. If you want to be believed, that is.
I Love Me, didn’t they do that on “South Park” once? 
The hell I’m not. Your response tells me that you just got called with nothing but a pair of deuces. This isn’t the first time you’ve avoided this very straightforward question.
Let me tell you what clues I am relying upon in deciding that you’re not quite serious.
Please, prey tell-if child abuse and molestation, the subjugation of women, the condemnation of gays and the suppression of needed birth control(the list can be made much longer easily, btw) isn’t enough, what the fuck is?
You frame this question in a manner that’s … less than neutral. One might even call it hostile.
You also conflate the issue of child abuse and molestation, a gravely serious problem but one practiced by – what - one hundredth of one percent of the church body? Make a more generous estimate, and also add in the hierarchy who didn’t do it, but acted to protect the Church instead of the victims, and maybe you get to one tenth of a percent. But your line mixes it right in with condemnation of gays, something that’s a part of actual doctrine.
That seems dishonest to me, almost as if you didn’t care about telling the truth at all. Almost as if you wanted it accepted without question that the doctrine of the church is to abuse and molest children. You know that isn’t so, and if you say, “Sure it is,” then I think we’ve finished our discussion.
In fact, it lets me answer the question: THAT would make me leave the Church institution. If the leadership announced, “Actually, we’re making it official: we exist to rape and abuse children, and that’s part and parcel of our doctrine from now on.”
OK?
There’s your answer, helpfully suggested by your own question.
So there aren’t any after all. Thought not.
Or do you really not grasp that the faith whose goodness in question is not Czarcasm’s, but your own? That an institutional practice of enabling child rape, supported by top leadership, is effectively identical to the “official policy” that you claim would be enough, yet in fact has not been?
As evidenced in the film Deliver us from Evil, he didn’t want to in the past, in his pre-Pope days, either.
By the way, shouldn’t the title of the thread be changed to Fuck the kiddiefucking Pope? Sure, there is no evidence that he himself actually partook of the sweet nectar of alter boys, but he has given his approval by not only looking the other way, but covering it up and moving said child rapists to other diocese so they could destroy more lives (before actually becoming Poop, I know ((spelling intentional))).
After all, fucking a woman would be bad enough, but if she was also a MILF…I shudder at the implication.
Is it fair that your precious little priests fuck some kid in the ass?! Does butt-fucking children not violate secular law?!
Maybe when you pull the fucking canon “law” out of your ass and the pope’s cock out of your mouth you might realize that there is a pretty big problem afoot.
You are not worthy in any way of the life you wish to give the fetuses.
It’s not the doctrine, it’s the church protocol, that makes it SOP to just pass along a child molesting priest to another parish, (no police involvement, even though a serious crime has been committed), no warning to the new parish. Who’s conflating things now?
While this certainly isn’t the case, aren’t they supposed to be all about protecting the innocent children in their parishes? Haven’t they completely failed at that? Doesn’t their protocol, for dealing with child abusers in their midst, say anything to you about where the rot in this organization lies?
The only person that seems dishonest here is you, in my opinion. You are exactly what’s wrong with the Catholic Church. “Morality is doing what is right, no matter what you’re told. Religion is doing what you’re told, no matter what is right.”
And, just for good measure;
“The truths of religion are never so well understood as by those who have lost the power of reasoning.” -Voltaire