# Fuck you Ann, hell has a special place for you **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 22, 2011, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175 "2011-09-22T07:23:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/61 "2011-09-22T18:25:29Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > So what should we do with convicted murderers? Tell me oh wise one. What we do today. Prison sentences up to and including life, and capital punishment. But don’t pretend that one is more “barbaric” than the other. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/62 "2011-09-22T18:31:16Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > What we do today. Prison sentences up to and including life, and capital punishment. But don’t pretend that one is more “barbaric” than the other. One is more barbaric than the other. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/63 "2011-09-22T18:33:23Z")
> [@bup](#): > > One is more barbaric than the other. Yeah. Especially if you later find out the guy’s innocent at least you can let them out of jail. You can’t bring someone back from the dead. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/64 "2011-09-22T18:34:16Z")
> [@bup](#): > > One is more barbaric than the other. IYO. I consider shutting someone up in a small room for the rest of his life a lot more barbaric. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/65 "2011-09-22T18:34:36Z")
Coulter is a shock jock. She plays people such as the OP like a Stratovarius. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/66 "2011-09-22T18:34:46Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > _pfffft._ Not because I say so. Just because it is. > > Also, it’s not an argument. I don’t waste my time arguing about what are established facts. But you do waste your time claiming that your opinion is an established fact. It can’t be an established fact until somebody establishes it. Nobody has established it, least of all you. Is it now to be known as the ‘ **kaylasdad** ’ Show? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/67 "2011-09-22T18:37:40Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Even then. Capital punishment is WRONG, always, and everywhere. There are no two ways about it, and the matter is not open to debate. Hitler comes closest to a counterexample, and not because of how vile he was. The argument is that “life in prison without parole” still leaves open the possibility that the imprisoned might be released due to favorable political winds (or sloppy parole boards), whereas if you execute them they’re dead. Of course, Hitler wasn’t sentenced to life in prison without parole, but rather a 5 year sentence, and was let go after just a few months, in both cases due to the court’s favortism toward rightist groups (leftist rebels were of course not shown mercy.) ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/68 "2011-09-22T18:42:07Z")
> [@Capitaine\_Zombie](#): > > It’s kind of sad to see a fifty-something woman writing like her fourteenth birthday is tomorrow. I agree about her writing. I’ve also seen her speak, in person, and i was actually amazed at how poor a public speaker she is. I expected the crazy and the irrational, but i thought that it would at least be lively and entertaining; in fact, it was about as sparkling as a reading of the Congressional Record. One minor nitpick: she’s not quite 50 yet. December 8 this year, if you’re interested in sending a gift. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/69 "2011-09-22T18:46:08Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > One minor nitpick: she’s not quite 50 yet. December 8 this year, if you’re interested in sending a gift. Maybe a Fleshlight. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/70 "2011-09-22T18:56:24Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > **Diogenes the Cynic** is gone, but his spirit lives in our hearts forever. > > Regards, > Shodan How long before you stop gloating? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/71 "2011-09-22T18:57:55Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > How long before you stop gloating? From past experience, I’d lay in a supply of non-perishable food and warm clothing if you’re planning to wait. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/72 "2011-09-22T19:09:19Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > How long before you stop gloating? He’s not gloating. He’s insulting **kaylasdad**. If **Dio** were still here, he’d just say that **kd** was picking up arguing techniques from him. If this was your attempt at a joke, then it’s below even your usual standards. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/73 "2011-09-22T19:12:42Z")
Shodan is perfectly capable of explaining himself. What exactly is your purpose here, kid? No one needs your help in defending their assholery. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/74 "2011-09-22T19:29:35Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Shodan is perfectly capable of explaining himself. > > What exactly is your purpose here, kid? No one needs your help in defending their assholery. I totally do. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/75 "2011-09-22T19:36:11Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > …If this was your attempt at a joke, then it’s below even your usual standards. Ain’t nobody forcing you to read any of it, podnuh. Got my name right up top there, so you get plenty of warning. You can just pick up your little basket and skip along, skip along. I’ll get over it. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/76 "2011-09-22T19:47:15Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > No offense, but Wikipedia is not a good place to cite this kind of information, especially in a case like this. Just sayin’. He can’t cite Anne Coulter as reliable, you really shouldn’t cite Wikipedia in an instance like this. I find Wiki useful mostly as a source for other cites. I usually try to link directly to the primary source but I didn’t this time. My fault for cutting corners. I did look at the primary sources before I posted the wiki link. I’ll discuss them now. > [@Bricker](#): > > And this statement came from Wikipedia, with a footnote. So it must be true. > > Of course, the footnote goes to an Amnesty International page. FTR, here’s the quote from Wiki to which I was refering (it’s under the heading “Trial and Conviction”): > [@](#): > > A ballistics expert testified that the .38 caliber bullet that killed MacPhail could have been fired from the same gun that wounded Cooper at the Cloverdale pool party, though he admitted doubt about this. However, he stated he was confident that .38 casings found at Cloverdale matched one allegedly later found by a homeless man near the scene of MacPhail’s shooting. This is supported by three footnote citations (#32, #33, and #34). Here are three footnote citations: > [@](#): > > #32: [“‘Where is the justice for me?’: The case of Troy Davis, facing execution in Georgia”.](https://www.amnesty.org/en/library/asset/AMR51/023/2007/en/909e39f7-d3b6-11dd-a329-2f46302a8cc6/amr510232007en.html) Amnesty International. February 1, 2007. Retrieved August 14, 2010. This is the Amnesty paper to which Bricker referred. The Wiki quote is a direct quote from this page. (A little _too_ directly, in fact.) While it’s true that Amnesty International is anti-death penalty, Bricker has not demonstrated that they are lying in this matter. In fact, Amnesty’s paper is supported on the Wiki page with two other citations, as we’re discussing now. > [@](#): > > #33: [“Troy Davis’s attorneys file last-ditch court appeal”.](http://articles.cnn.com/2011-09-21/justice/justice_georgia-execution_1_execution-convict-death-sentence?_s=PM:JUSTICE)[cnn.com](http://cnn.com). 21 September 2011. Retrieved 21 September 2011. This supporting footnote leads to a CNN page which just mentions briefly Davis’ attorneys are asking a judge to stop the execution because they’re claiming that the ballistics testimony at the trial was “inaccurate and misleading”. As footnotes go, this one’s not particularly productive. > [@](#): > > #34: [“New Execution Date Set For Troy Anthony Davis Who Was Convicted Of 1989 Murder Of Savannah Police Officer Mark McPhail”.](http://law.ga.gov/00/press/detail/0,2668,87670814_103214659_125286435,00.html) Attorney General of Georgia. October 15, 2008. Retrieved September 21, 2011. This is a press release from Georgia’s Attorney General. (Not a rah-rah press release, an FYI press release about various legal happenings.) Under the section on Davis’ case, it says: > [@Georgia Attorney General](#): > > A ballistics expert testified that the bullet that wounded Michael Cooper could have been fired from a .38 special revolver or a .357 magnum. (T. 1291). The bullet from McPhail’s body was of the same type and was possibly fired from the same weapon as used in the Cooper shooting. (T. 1292). Four .38 special casings recovered at Cloverdale, where Michael Cooper was wounded, were fired from the same gun as casings found at the scene of Officer McPhail’s murder. (T. 1292). To sum up, the Wiki link that I posted which stated that the ballistics expert wasn’t sure that the bullets came from the same gun, while taking its text from the Amnesty case, is also supported by documents from the Georgia attorney general’s office relaying official testimony. > [@Bricker](#): > > The bullet fragments could not be matched with certainty, because they were too damaged. But the shell casings retrieved from each scene were matched with great certainty to the same gun. This proves the same gun shot both Cooper and MacPhail. > > It’s true that this, alone, doesn’t tie Davis to the crime… but it ties the two crimes to each other. Yeah but the shell casings are mighty thin rope. For starters, casings from both scenes were stored in the same evidence bag ([Cite, about half way down](http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/20/prosecutor-says-he-has-no-doubt-about-troy-davis-guilt/?hpt=hp_t2)). The prosecutor says it was all explained at trial, but well, he would say that, wouldn’t he? Secondly, a review in 2003 of the ballistics evidence by a retired GBI officer said that they weren’t conclusively link. ([Cite](http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/troy-davis-from-gurney-1185593.html) This is one of the pieces of “new evidence” that Davis wanted to discuss at his hearing. The Judge in the case didn’t allow Davis to pursue this though, saying: > [@](#): > > The order signed by Judge Wilson today said that claims being pursued by Davis had previously been raised and rejected. As for the ballistics evidence, the order said, a federal court judge had previously found that there was never a definitive contention at trial that the bullets matched and that the munitions evidence was not relevant to Davis’ guilt of the MacPhail murder. Given that, it’s pretty hard to see the shell casings as physical evidence related Davis’ case, which was Coulter’s claim. And that’s really what I’m saying here in all this: Ann Coulter is a piece of shit. Speaking of the Ann Coulter - did you know she followed up her original tweet? > [@@AnnCoulter](#): > > HOLD THE PICKLE, HOLD THE LETTUCE, FRYING KILLERS WON’T UPSET US > **[Comedy Central | Homepage - Shows & Schedules](https://www.cc.com)** > > Comedy Central makes you laugh with satirical shows, stand-up special and classics, including The Daily Show and South Park. Because that’s what all this is to Coulter, the state’s execution of a citizen, it’s just a cutsey little joke she can sing to piss off the liberals. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/77 "2011-09-22T19:50:19Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I totally do. You just need more practice, honey. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/78 "2011-09-22T19:53:16Z")
“A pickle? Why, yes, Ms. Coulter, I am quite fond of pickles. But could I pick my own right out of the jar, if you don’t mind?” ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/79 "2011-09-22T19:53:34Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > You just need more practice, honey. 😉 See, it’s posts like this that give me something to strive for. I, too, can be independently assholish, if I just work at it and stop relying on charity! ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175/80 "2011-09-22T19:55:05Z")
The tweet was in very poor taste. Everyone is in agreement on that, yes? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-ann-hell-has-a-special-place-for-you/597175.md?page=5)