# Fuck You Conservative Stupid-Making Machine **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 4, 2010, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977 "2010-10-04T05:12:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/361 "2010-10-10T11:13:09Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > So, Starve, why don’t you name a few of these posters whom you disagree with but respect? … Like this? > [@](#): > > Anyway, I’ve come to feel that you’re ( **Harborwolf** ) one of the good guys on the other side. Several of you I tussled with have become people I respect. **FinnAgain** , **GIGObuster** and **crowmanyclouds** are some of the others. > [**Starving Artist**](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7497597&postcount=202) I’m guessing that’s not gonna leave a mark. > [@Cisco](#): > > … I’m sure they’ll be more than happy to come in here and politely explain to you the ways in which you’re acting like a dingleberry. Nah, I’ve got to cut some lawns and shovel out the driveway and shit. 😉 CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/362 "2010-10-10T15:40:06Z")
[\](http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b282/eveningsky339/troll.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/363 "2010-10-10T15:41:28Z")
So **SA** is saying that he is not finding evidence that he is not lying? Funny that he is smart enough to notice the Alaska republican platform, but deftly marches on over the other evidence. Oh well, he may ignore it but the fact is that indeed many conservatives officially equate evolution with creationism as an origin theory. Saying otherwise is not true at all and ignoring it does show indeed dishonesty from SA. (On Edit) and still more evidence of other dopers not being fooled by Sarving’s “efforts”. ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/364 "2010-10-10T15:48:57Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > And in the end also your point that “No sensible person could possibly contend that it is righties who’ve created the impression that evolution accounts for the origins of life” is demonstrated to be a lie: > > [http://www.adn.com/2006/10/27/217111/creation-science-enters-the-race.html](http://www.adn.com/2006/10/27/217111/creation-science-enters-the-race.html) > > > [@](#): > > > > The Republican Party of Alaska platform says, in its section on education: “We support giving Creation Science equal representation **with other theories of the origin of life**. If evolution is taught, it should be presented as only a theory.” Lawyered! There is also [http://www.conservapedia.com/Creation](http://www.conservapedia.com/Creation) [http://www.conservapedia.com/Evolution](http://www.conservapedia.com/Evolution) [http://www.conservapedia.com/Intelligent\_design](http://www.conservapedia.com/Intelligent_design) ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/365 "2010-10-10T15:52:18Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Do you mean by this last paragraph to imply that I object completely and thoroughly to abortion and that I have been and am completely unwilling to look at the evidence and moderate my views on the matter if the evidence supports it? Oh, man, you really are as dumb as a bag of hammers, aren’t you? The part of my post about abortion was in no way a direct reference to you. I can’t remember ever even discussing abortion with you (although it’s possible that i have), nor did i have any idea of what your position on the issue was. I used the example of the abortion debate as a _general example_ of how i can disagree with someone about an issue and yet still have productive discussions and rational debate with them on the issue, as long as we each accept some ground rules and understand the difference between moral positions and factual assertions. My comment about your hostility to rational debate and rules of evidence was not about abortion in particular, as anyone with three functioning neurons might have been able to work out. That paragraph represented, quite clearly, a shift from my general example of abortion to talking about you specifically. As i said, i neither know nor care about your position on abortion. My main point about you was that you’re not worth the effort it takes to try and engage in rational debate, because you simply don’t know how to do it. I’ve manged to avoid engaging with you over recent months, except for an occasional passing observation about your stupidity or your dishonesty, and that’s the policy i’m going to return to, because it’s all you deserve. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/366 "2010-10-10T15:53:21Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > And in the end also your point that “No sensible person could possibly contend that it is righties who’ve created the impression that evolution accounts for the origins of life” is demonstrated to be a lie: > > [http://www.adn.com/2006/10/27/217111/creation-science-enters-the-race.html](http://www.adn.com/2006/10/27/217111/creation-science-enters-the-race.html) > > > [@](#): > > > > The Republican Party of Alaska platform says, in its section on education: “We support giving Creation Science equal representation **with other theories of the origin of life**. If evolution is taught, it should be presented as only a theory.” Nice one. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/367 "2010-10-10T15:58:29Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > So now we have a situation where the left apparently is deliberately creating the impression that evolution accounts for life on this planet,… [QUOTE=Starving Artist] Of course! That was the whole point - that liberals have been framing the issue of how life as we know it came to be as one of evolution vs. creationism, thus creating the impression in the minds of many that evolution accounts for how life came to be. I’m not necessarily saying that they’ve done this on purpose… [/QUOTE] To a less supple mind, this appears to be a contradiction between “is” and “is not”. But **Starkers** mind is not restrained by such mundane restrictions. Its like a Heisenberg dueling scar of the sort prized by young Prussian physicists of long ago, its there when you want it to be, and disappears instantly when you don’t. And in either case, it either was or it wasn’t, and always will be, or always will not be. This is too many for me. I fold. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/368 "2010-10-10T16:46:28Z")
Meanwhile, at the [del]legion of doom[/del] Conservative Stupid-Making Machine, The Republicans come out not only as supporters of Climate Change deniers, but as their future enforcers of their anti-science efforts. [http://climateprogress.org/2010/10/08/michael-mann-cuccinelli-sensenbrenner-issa-anti-science/](http://climateprogress.org/2010/10/08/michael-mann-cuccinelli-sensenbrenner-issa-anti-science/) > [@](#): > > Memo to all scientists, all who care about science, and all who are concerned about the health and well-being of our children and countless future generations: You have a big stake in the upcoming election. You sit on the sidelines at your peril. > > Dr. Michael Mann makes that clear in a must-read op-ed in the Washington Post today, “Get the anti-science bent out of politics,” which opens: > > > [@](#): > > > > As a scientist, I shouldn’t have a stake in the upcoming midterm elections, but unfortunately, it seems that I — and indeed all my fellow climate scientists — do. > > > > ``` > > Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) has threatened that, if he becomes chairman of the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, he will launch what would be a hostile investigation of climate science. The focus would be on e-mails stolen from scientists at the University of East Anglia in Britain last fall that climate-change deniers have falsely claimed demonstrate wrongdoing by scientists, including me. Rep. James Sensenbrenner (R-Wis.) may do the same if he takes over a committee on climate change and energy security. > > > > ``` > > Mann deserves to be heard — and not just because he has been the focus of the most incessant and deceitful anti-science attacks, and not just because is probably the most thoroughly vindicated climate scientist in the country both in his academic practices and scientific research (see “Much-vindicated Michael Mann and Hockey Stick get final exoneration from Penn State“ and “Two more independent studies back the Hockey Stick: Recent global warming is unprecedented in magnitude and speed and cause“). Yep, dark times are coming thanks to the Republican war on science… Or it will be comedy gold for generations to come. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/369 "2010-10-10T18:19:00Z")
Generations? Plural? From your lips to the Ears… ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/370 "2010-10-10T20:27:52Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > > [@Starving Artist](#): > > > > So now we have a situation where the left apparently is deliberately creating the impression that evolution accounts for life on this planet,… > > [QUOTE=Starving Artist] > Of course! That was the whole point - that liberals have been framing the issue of how life as we know it came to be as one of evolution vs. creationism, thus creating the impression in the minds of many that evolution accounts for how life came to be. I’m not necessarily saying that they’ve done this on purpose… To a less supple mind, this appears to be a contradiction between “is” and “is not”. [/quote] Or to a more supple one, the distinctions made through use of the words “apparently” and “not necessarily” might subtly shade the meaning of the posted quotes, thus making them not quite the contradiction in terms that they may appear to be at eager, fault-finding first glance. > [@elucidator](#): > > This is too many for me. I fold. Good plan. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/371 "2010-10-10T21:04:04Z")
Ah yes, I was expecting him to return and show to all that he was also lying about not caring about this issue anymore… ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/372 "2010-10-10T21:04:31Z")
I’d say it’s safe bet that few people promoting creationism have thought that deeply about it, let alone evolution or abiogenesis, so if they’ve conflated the two it’s not necessary to assume some liberal conspiracy. The simpler explanation is that creationists are dumb. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/373 "2010-10-10T21:29:54Z")
Well, just to be clear I never said it was a ‘conspiracy’. It’s just that minds that are essentially in agreement tend to think and speak alike and to say and understand things in a similar way. This board, for example, is overwhelmingly liberal and posters here voice their liberal opinions in very similar ways, but that isn’t the result of a conspiracy. And William F. Buckley, Jr. was a creationist, as have been and are many other extremely intelligent men. It’s dumb to claim that creationists are dumb. > [@GIGObuster](#): > > Ah yes, I was expecting him to return and show to all that he was also lying about not caring about this issue anymore… Well, you know, interest ebbs and flows. Plus some allegations demand response lest some poor schlub actually believe them. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/374 "2010-10-10T21:37:18Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Or to a more supple one, the distinctions made through use of the words “apparently” and “not necessarily” might subtly shade the meaning of the posted quotes, thus making them not quite the contradiction in terms that they may appear to be at eager, fault-finding first glance. What the hell? I posted those exact same quotes and didn’t get a peep out of you. I wonder if I’m on **Starving** ’s ignore list. Let’s find out. **Woo hoo! Aerosmith should be played during the seventh-inning stretch! Medical marijauna covered by public health plans! Short skirts! More condoms in schools!** That oughta do it. (Not quite sure what to make of **luci** ’s asertion that my brain isn’t spongy enough.) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/375 "2010-10-10T21:57:59Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Or to a more supple one, the distinctions made through use of the words “apparently” and “not necessarily” might subtly shade the meaning of the posted quotes, thus making them not quite the contradiction in terms that they may appear to be at eager, fault-finding first glance… Oh. So, the ambiguity is _intentional_, then? Tsk. Clarity, **Starkers** , clarity! Stupidity is not redeemed by subtle shades of meaning. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/376 "2010-10-10T22:00:46Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > > [@GIGObuster](#): > > > > Ah yes, I was expecting him to return and show to all that he was also lying about not caring about this issue anymore… > > Well, you know, interest ebbs and flows. Plus some allegations demand response lest some poor schlub actually believe them. He is not thinking that we forgot that his assertion that conservatives are not confusing the origin issue with evolution was a stinky lie? I guess he is.. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/377 "2010-10-10T22:09:09Z")
By “stinky lie”, do you mean it wasn’t true, or do you mean it was false? You have to mind these subtle distinctions with **Starkers** , he is a very nuanced thinker. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/378 "2010-10-10T22:26:16Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > And William F. Buckley, Jr. was a creationist, as have been and are many other extremely intelligent men. It’s dumb to claim that creationists are dumb. Well, he was dumb when it came to life origins. Unless you’re arguing that creationism is a reasoned intelligent position, in which case I’d just love to see the evidence. To the trivial extent Buckley is relevant to this discussion, I’m inclined to pity him as having spent his formative years trapped in a more primitive era, myself. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/379 "2010-10-10T22:46:57Z")
Pssst…hey, **GIGO** , **luci** said he was gonna fold but he’s still posting. That’s a lie in your book, right? So I trust you’re going to be an equal opportunity lie-accuser and accuse **luci** of lying now. Right? > [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > Well, he was dumb when it came to life origins. But that’s not what you said, is it? > [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > Unless you’re arguing that creationism is a reasoned intelligent position… Which I’m not. > [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > To the trivial extent Buckley is relevant to this discussion.. He’s perfectly relevant given your assertion that people who believe in creation are dumb. > [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > I’m inclined to pity him as having spent his formative years trapped in a more primitive era, myself. Ah, so you admit that these kinds of issues depend more upon one’s experiences in their formative years than they do upon one’s innate intelligence? In that case I’d say you’re right…now. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977/380 "2010-10-10T23:18:30Z")
But later, the intelligent come to realize that the existence of fact is not subjective, nor related to experiences in their formative years. And some people fail to do so. Or worse, refuse. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-conservative-stupid-making-machine/555977.md?page=20)