# Fuck you, Disney! (Star-Wars-related) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 27, 2014, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091 "2014-04-27T02:40:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/81 "2014-04-28T01:08:14Z")
> [@dzeiger](#): > > If the choice is between JJ Abrams and Kevin J Anderson, which is the Scylla and which the Charybdis? Quit making my head hurt. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/82 "2014-04-28T01:13:06Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Quit making my head hurt. Slightly off-topic, but have you heard that Aaron Allston died? He was one of the best authors in the EU. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/83 "2014-04-28T03:13:14Z")
> [@Incubus](#): > > This is the problem with a lot of serious geeks in general. People get so obsessed with a media, that it becomes a part of who they are. They’re not someone who like’s Star Wars, they are a Star Wars _fan_/Trekkie/Whovian/etc. They get so attached to their memory and vision of it, that any deviation is seen as a collossal betrayal. They get _way_ too wrapped up in making it their identity. There are a ton of ‘Post Secret’ posts that are some variation of “I base my whole life on [science fiction show]”. > . > . > . > > -People who still think _Firefly_ will get rebooted someday. I fall into this category. I was totally punked this April Fools, in fact, by the story that Netflix was relaunching the series. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/84 "2014-04-28T03:19:52Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …what the hell are you talking about? > > EU was canon because Lucasfilm said it was. They hired a guy to keep it all consistent and he set the rules. Obviously inconsistencies popped up over time: but that doesn’t “prove” that the EU wasn’t canon, or the films weren’t canon. > > As of yesterday the EU is no longer canon. I’m not arguing for one way or the other. I’m explaining what the situation was: as people keep on getting it wrong. I’m sorry - I confused you with the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Aquadementia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aquadementia/32/555_2.png) [@Aquadementia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aquadementia)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/85 "2014-04-28T03:25:30Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > Cannibal Teddy ears. > > Yup. Are they actually eating each other or just the non-woks? ---
**Author:** ![Battle\_Pope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Battle\_Pope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Battle_Pope)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/86 "2014-04-28T04:05:30Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > It’s a **film** franchise. The books ain’t canon. And neither is the _Star Wars Christmas Special._ So there! As God is my witness, I’ll never celebrate \*Life Day \*again! I haven’t read much of the EU stuff in a long time but IIRC it seemed to be at its best when it was dealing with the non-major characters from the original trilogy - The \*X-Wing \*series and _Tales of the Bounty Hunters_ were pretty good. Zahn’s Thrawn trilogy was OK but he’s got several writers “tic’s” that drive me to distraction (see how many times he uses the phrases _“in a heartbeat”_ and _“went straight to hell!”_ when somehting exciting is supposed to be happening). ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/87 "2014-04-28T05:30:23Z")
> [@Battle\_Pope](#): > > As God is my witness, I’ll never celebrate \*Life Day \*again! > > I haven’t read much of the EU stuff in a long time but IIRC it seemed to be at its best when it was dealing with the non-major characters from the original trilogy - The \*X-Wing \*series and _Tales of the Bounty Hunters_ were pretty good. Zahn’s Thrawn trilogy was OK but he’s got several writers “tic’s” that drive me to distraction (see how many times he uses the phrases _“in a heartbeat”_ and _“went straight to hell!”_ when somehting exciting is supposed to be happening). You and I seem to have exactly the same take on the EU novels. Personally, I kept hoping that someone would write a Star Wars story that touched on no major characters, and nothing of any galactic importance. Something like the Cowboy Bebop or Firefly of the Star Wars universe. Anyway, as far as the OP pitting Disney: Disney’s decision is a relief for me. It’s also not a surprise because - as has been pointed out - even Lucas didn’t respect his own canon. Seriously, the guy filled Mos Eisley with dinosaurs, had Greedo shoot first, and turned the Force into a midi-chlorian infection. Respecting the EU is so far down the list of priorities, you’d fill up the Death Star with paper before you got there. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/88 "2014-04-28T05:43:22Z")
> [@zweisamkeit](#): > > This is a GREAT example of the bizarre entitlement attitude many geeks (across many fandoms) have. And I say this as someone still annoyed with the changes Lucas made to the original trilogy. > > Being a geek about anything inherently means being emotionally connected/attached to it. That’s awesome - it means you get a lot of entertainment and happiness out of it. _But your emotional connection does not mean YOU have ANY ownership of it_. You wouldn’t know that if you went by how (many but not all) geeks react when they don’t like something that happens in {fandom}. How dare they??? They’re fucking morons!!! They just ruined the entire {fandom} universe!!! They need to get fucked by a cactus!!! > > Grow.up. The reason your fandom exists is that people worked their asses off to create something amazing. Now you want to hobble their creativity so they do everything exactly as you would like it. What if they don’t want to? What if they NEVER wanted to go in that direction? > > There’s no problem with disagreeing with a creative choice. Of course that’s going to happen. Extended debates about it can be interesting, too. But acting like they have an obligation _to you personally_ is narcissistic and self absorbed. It assumes every fan agrees with your opinions or that your opinions are the only valid ones. > > Just treat the EU as an AU. What’s so hard or terrible about that? Right? The EU was some low order of “canon” that the movies were always going to overrule. So now they lose the label of z-canon (or whatever). So what? The works still exist. They’re just labeled Legends instead of w-canon. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/89 "2014-04-28T08:16:23Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Technically, I think this is D-canon. A-canon? There needs to be a new term, as G is Gone. The new Disney movies will be Canon in D, I’m going to have them played at my wedding. > [@Miller](#): > > Are they going around to everyone’s house, taking their comics and noveizations, and burning them? Not until _Episode CDLI_. ---
**Author:** ![Brican14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9d8465/32.png) [@Brican14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brican14)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/90 "2014-04-28T10:53:29Z")
Okay i dont even know how to respond. Canon!! Im beginning to hate that word. Oh yeah and to whoever said the eu is for nerds can go jump off a cliff. For us REAL star wars fans the novels, comics etc. are what we turned to when wanted more of the story. The novels filled the storyline in damn near perfectly. It gave us a way to explore the ST universe that the movies couldnt possible do. Everything in it is sooo amazing and makes perfect sense. Lots of fans have dug deeper into this for decades and become familiar and somewhat attached. To rip this away is tantamount to erasing a part of us and pissing on the many genius authors who have put so much into giving this to us. To anyone out there who isnt upset by this is not a true fan. If they do this it will not be star wars to me. ---
**Author:** ![Double\_Foolscap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85e7bf/32.png) [@Double\_Foolscap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Double_Foolscap)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/91 "2014-04-28T11:09:47Z")
I’m sure all the non-true fans will live without your approval, **Brican14.** I hope Disney go one step further and reference the EU from time to time, only to dismiss it. “How did Chewbacca die, Uncle Luke?” “A moon fell on him.” “Wow, really?” “No, not really. Go to bed.” ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/92 "2014-04-28T11:15:17Z")
> [@Brican14](#): > > Okay i dont even know how to respond. Canon!! Im beginning to hate that word. Oh yeah and to whoever said the eu is for nerds can go jump off a cliff. For us REAL star wars fans the novels, comics etc. are what we turned to when wanted more of the story. The novels filled the storyline in damn near perfectly. It gave us a way to explore the ST universe that the movies couldnt possible do. Everything in it is sooo amazing and makes perfect sense. Lots of fans have dug deeper into this for decades and become familiar and somewhat attached. To rip this away is tantamount to erasing a part of us and pissing on the many genius authors who have put so much into giving this to us. To anyone out there who isnt upset by this is not a true fan. If they do this it will not be star wars to me. Who’s taking anything away from you? As far as I know, Disney isn’t taking every licensed product published between 1977 and a few days ago out of print, and they’re not sending goons to your house to confiscate your Knights of the Old Republic game discs and your Clone Wars DVDs and your dog-eared copy of Splinter of the Mind’s Eye. The works are still _there_. Why does it matter if the corporation that currently owns the license no longer considers them to be factual in relation to a group of movies that almost never referenced them and never made any significant effort to accommodate their existence in the first place? On a side note, I find it amusing how many of the people who are complaining about the EU not being canon, are similarly proclaiming about how they don’t consider most of the _movies_ to be canon. I guess this is one of the reasons why the SCP Foundation’s motto is “There is no canon”; to stop arguments like these before they start. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/93 "2014-04-28T11:17:17Z")
It seems to me that there’s a fundamental problem in the first place with debates over canon, and that’s that we’re dealing with a fictional universe. So, when you say, “Book X is canon and book Y isn’t”, you’re not actually saying that the events of book X happened and the events of Book Y didn’t, because obviously, none of it happened. So, really, when you say “Book X is canon”, what you really mean is that, if somebody’s making a future work set in the fictional universe, they shouldn’t include information that contradicts what happened in Book X, or, if they do, at least come up with some reason. So, Disney’s saying that they’re going to forget about that. But as far as Lucasfilms is concerned, they always did that. From a 2005 quote by Leland Chee, who manages Lucasfilm’s continuity database: > [@](#): > > “GL is certainly not bound by the EU, though he’s certainly open to using things created in it (Aayla Secura and the Coruscant name, for example). On the other hand, the quote you provide makes it sound like the EU is separate from George’s vision of the Star Wars universe. It is not. The EU must follow certain tenets set by George through the films and other guidelines that he provides outside of the films.” And Lucas has said: > [@](#): > > nterviewer: “Do you think you’d have other people continue the Star Wars saga past Episode VI or turn some of the other material into films?” > Lucas: “But there’s no story past Episode VI, there’s just no story. It’s a certain story about Anakin Skywalker and once Anakin Skywalker dies, that’s kind of the end of the story. There is no story about Luke Skywalker, I mean apart from the books. But there’s three worlds: There’s my world that I made up, there’s the licensing world that’s the books, the comics, all that kind of stuff, the games, which is their world, and then there’s the fans’ world, which is also very rich in imagination, but they don’t always mesh. All I’m in charge of is my world. I can’t be in charge of those other people’s world, because I can’t keep up with it.” and > [@](#): > > LUCAS: “I’ve left pretty explicit instructions for there not to be any more features. There will definitely be no Episodes VII-IX. [Heh-CA] That’s because there isn’t any story. I mean, I never thought of anything. And now there have been novels about the events after Episode VI, which isn’t at all what I would have done with it. The Star Wars story is really the tragedy of Darth Vader. That is the story. Once Vader dies, he doesn’t come back to life, the Emperor doesn’t get cloned and Luke doesn’t get married…” So, since Lucas and his people didn’t feel bound by the books and comic books and games and whatever anyway when writing this story, the only real change is that future derivative works won’t have to be bound by them either. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/94 "2014-04-28T11:39:18Z")
> [@enomaj](#): > > No Christina Hendricks as Mara Jade?! I’m on board wih he OP. If Christina Hendricks were cast as Mara Jade, they would definitely ask her to lose weight. Then her breasts would no longer be cannons. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/95 "2014-04-28T11:52:50Z")
> [@Brican14](#): > > To rip this away is tantamount to erasing a part of us and pissing on the many genius authors who have put so much into giving this to us. Except it really isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/96 "2014-04-28T12:02:46Z")
The idea that any set of new writers should be beholden to continuity canon in any universe needs to be dispensed with. Stories are about storytelling. If you need to change canon to tell a new story do it without hesitation. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/97 "2014-04-28T12:54:08Z")
The list of truly, truly great movies that freely changed, altered, or totally dispensed with huge chunks of the “canon” and source material would be too long to list here. A movie must stand on its own merits, and if that means deviating from the canon, great. There’s also the problem that the novels pick up \*\*right after \*\*the events in “Return of the Jedi,” which would require a casting change - Hamill, Ford, Fisher et al. are too old to do that - so you might as well accept that that isn’t gonna happen. If you plan on pouring half a billion dollars into making some movies, and that’s a LOW estimate, tying your screenwriter to some cheap paperback written 28 years ago is fiscal irresponsibility that borders on insanity. Not that you can’t blow the movie anyway (cf. The Phantom Menace) but why start with a disadvantage? ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/98 "2014-04-28T12:59:21Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > The ewoks were awesome, and anyone who says otherwise I’d an imperial sympathizer Well, I say otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Gedd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gedd/32/4938_2.png) [@Gedd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gedd)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/99 "2014-04-28T13:21:55Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > The ewoks were awesome, and anyone who says otherwise I’d an imperial sympathizer > > > [@Darth\_Panda](#): > > > > Well, I say otherwise. Of course _you_ would, being a _panda_ and all :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091/100 "2014-04-28T13:55:32Z")
Wasn’t this obviously going to happen? It was either this or the new films had to follow the EU. They chose wisely. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-disney-star-wars-related/687091.md?page=6)