# Fuck you, Judge Littlejohn **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 7, 2010, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326 "2010-10-07T03:09:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2010, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/81 "2010-10-07T22:50:15Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > How is that even legal? The South just even bothering with the Constitution anymore, I guess. > > As a southerner I very much resent (the damned near complete accuracy of) that remark about our conservative officials. > > This reminds me of when a few years ago a Jewish kid in Troy, Alabama was physically forced to bow his head in a Christian prayer by a school official. :eek:😕:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2010, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/82 "2010-10-07T23:32:24Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > [@Sampiro](#): > > > > As a southerner I very much resent (the damned near complete accuracy of) that remark about our conservative officials. > > > > This reminds me of when a few years ago a Jewish kid in Troy, Alabama was physically forced to bow his head in a Christian prayer by a school official. > > :eek:😕:dubious: Resulted in [a lawsuit](http://www.holysmoke.org/sdhok/jewish.htm), I should mention. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/83 "2010-10-08T02:18:48Z")
YOU guys are being unfair to the judge here. Sure, forcing someone to recite the Pledge is a douche move, but it did result in a lawyer being put behind bars for some time. Can’t underestimate the value in that. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/84 "2010-10-08T02:37:02Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Even beyond this particular case, the judge sounds like a [real peach](http://www.alternet.org/story/148439/mississippi_judge_jails_defense_attorney_for_refusing_to_recite_pledge_of_allegiance): > > > [@](#): > > > > In 1974, when a 21 year-old black man was gunned down by police in Byhalia, Mississippi, local activists with the Marshall County United League criticized law enforcement’s response to the killing. Members of the league distributed pamphlets criticizing Littlejohn, who was then the District Attorney. They called a hearing into the shooting a “farce,” and accused Littlejohn of “acting as defense attorney for the officers rather than as prosecutor,” according to a 1978 ruling by a federal appeals court. > > > > In response, Littlejohn then used a grand jury to launch a legal witch-hunt against the group, investigating its finances and organizational leadership. The Marshall County United League sued, and a federal appeals court concluded that Littlejohn had acted “in bad faith for the purpose of harassing those who, in the exercise of their First Amendment rights, had criticized defendant Littlejohn.” In issuing an injunction preventing Littlejohn from pursuing his investigation further, the justices characterized the case as an “abuse of the grand jury process [that] cannot be tolerated in a free society." > > Charming. Lovely. Why the hell was he still a judge? And now some schmuck wants to let him off with a slap on the wrist and educatin’ I don’t think so. Fire him. No retirement or benefits. No pension. Just a nice fat GTFO. ---
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/85 "2010-10-08T02:37:16Z")
It seems to me that if the Supreme Court has ruled that children cannot be coerced into reciting the Pledge in school, lawyers probably can’t be made to do so in court. If he’s a DA, a government position, that would constitute a religious test to hold the position, which goes beyond the First Amendment into the text of the original Constitution. EDIT: Wait, the “religious test” clause may apply only to elected officials. I’ll check when I have a real connection, or maybe Bricker will help us out. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/86 "2010-10-08T02:39:39Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > The depressing thing is not just that this happened, but that there are probably quite a lot of people in America who think like [this guy](http://www.courierpress.com/news/2010/oct/07/lawyer-jailed-refusing-recite-pledge-allegiance/) about the whole incident: > > > [@](#): > > > > Yet Lampley’s silence infuriated some in the small town of Tupelo, the birthplace of Elvis with a population of about 35,000. > > > > “I thought he was a disgrace to the United States,” Bobby Martin, a 43-year-old self-employed maintenance worker, said of Lampley. “If he can’t say that in front of a judge, he don’t deserve to be here” in this country. And I say that asshole Martin is a disgrace and should get out. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/87 "2010-10-08T02:42:42Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > How is that even legal? The South just even bothering with the Constitution anymore, I guess. > > As a southerner I very much resent (the damned near complete accuracy of) that remark about our conservative officials. > > This reminds me of when a few years ago a Jewish kid in Troy, Alabama was physically forced to bow his head in a Christian prayer by a school official. All I can say is OMG WTF. Land of the free? I guess only “free” for the “right sort” and only as free as some stupid inbred mutant motherfuckers say you are. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/88 "2010-10-08T02:42:51Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > [@Sampiro](#): > > > > As a southerner I very much resent (the damned near complete accuracy of) that remark about our conservative officials. > > > > This reminds me of when a few years ago a Jewish kid in Troy, Alabama was physically forced to bow his head in a Christian prayer by a school official. > > :eek:😕:dubious: “Bow your head. I said _BOW_! _Imperio!_” ordered Superintendent Voldemort. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@Captain\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/89 "2010-10-08T02:52:51Z")
What I dislike is that judges act like total dictators in their courtroom and can more or less put anyone in holding for most anything. Sleeping, chewing gum, talking back in a respectful manner, being one minute late, whatever. Some religions disallow making pledges or saluting the flag, the Jehovah’s Witnesses for example. A lot of JW’s were sent to concentration camps because they refused to be drafted into the military and would not swear oaths. This is considered idolotry. Personally, I am not patriotic. A country is nothing but a piece of land carved out of the Earth ruled by a government. You cannot “love your country” and “hate your government” because the government is the representation of the country. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/90 "2010-10-08T03:00:44Z")
> [@Captain\_Midnight](#): > > What I dislike is that judges act like total dictators in their courtroom and can more or less put anyone in holding for most anything. Sleeping, chewing gum, talking back in a respectful manner, being one minute late, whatever. There is NOTHING that pisses me off more than being punished for talking respectfully to someone. I mean, WTF? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/91 "2010-10-08T03:31:56Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > There is NOTHING that pisses me off more than being punished for talking respectfully to someone. I mean, WTF? 😕 If we’re going to jail anyway, well shit. Let’s just tell the no good sumbitch what we really think \ ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/92 "2010-10-08T05:09:10Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > [@Captain\_Midnight](#): > > > > What I dislike is that judges act like total dictators in their courtroom and can more or less put anyone in holding for most anything. Sleeping, chewing gum, talking back in a respectful manner, being one minute late, whatever. > > There is NOTHING that pisses me off more than being punished for talking respectfully to someone. I mean, WTF? 😕 You’re not supposed to argue with a judge in his courtroom, no matter how respectfully you do it. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/93 "2010-10-08T06:00:56Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > The South just even bothering with the Constitution anymore, I guess. > > That’s right, Dio. It is very fair to smear the entire South over the actions of one judge in Mississippi. > > Asshole. > :rolleyes: Yeah, because it’s the only thing the south has ever done wrong. Except slavery, and the Civil War, and lynchings, and Jim Crow, and threatening little girls trying to go to school, and Miley Cyrus. ---
**Author:** ![straight\_man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straight_man/32/3027_2.png) [@straight\_man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/straight_man)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/94 "2010-10-08T06:59:34Z")
> [@DanBlather](#): > > > [@Oakminster](#): > > > > That’s right, Dio. It is very fair to smear the entire South over the actions of one judge in Mississippi. > > > > Asshole. > > :rolleyes: > > Yeah, because it’s the only thing the south has ever done wrong. Except slavery, and the Civil War, and lynchings, and Jim Crow, and threatening little girls trying to go to school, and Miley Cyrus. Now, I don’t think anyone alive in the South today was responsible for slavery. And the laboratory near Universal Studios where Miley Cyrus was created isn’t a part of the South, either. The rest is fair game. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/95 "2010-10-08T07:52:56Z")
Judge Littlejohn should be made, on pain of being held in contempt of America and locked up in Gitmo, to publicly recite [_West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette_](http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=319&invol=624). And _then_ removed from office. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/96 "2010-10-08T14:13:14Z")
The key phrase of the pledge of allegiance, “with liberty and justice for all”, seems inconsistent with throwing someone in jail for not reciting it. Methinks the judge should be forced to recite it a few times until he understands it. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/97 "2010-10-08T14:41:36Z")
> [@appleciders](#): > > EDIT: Wait, the “religious test” clause may apply only to elected officials. I’ll check when I have a real connection, or maybe Bricker will help us out. It applies across the board: [QUOTE=US Constitution, Article VI] no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/98 "2010-10-08T15:00:08Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > Judge Littlejohn should be made, on pain of being held in contempt of America and locked up in Gitmo, to publicly recite [_West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette_](http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=319&invol=624). > > And _then_ removed from office. I think this is more important than people realize. In post #85, **Appleciders** notes that _Barnette_ held that schoolchildren could not be made to say the Pledge (true; that was the ruling), but confuses the Free Speech and Establishment Clauses (of the First Amendment) with the Article Six Religious Test clause, and misses the legal principle underlying **Barnette** : \*\*\*No person acting under color of governmental authority may require or coerce another to enter into any religion-motivated act or take any formal vow, including specifically reciting the Pledge of Allegiance. * * * And Judge Littlejohn should receive the same choice as former Alabama State Supreme Court Justice Roy Moore – comply with the U.S. Constitution, resign, or be removed from office. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/99 "2010-10-08T18:23:02Z")
> [@DanBlather](#): > > > [@Oakminster](#): > > > > That’s right, Dio. It is very fair to smear the entire South over the actions of one judge in Mississippi. > > > > Asshole. > > :rolleyes: > > Yeah, because it’s the only thing the south has ever done wrong. Except slavery, and the Civil War, and lynchings, and Jim Crow, and threatening little girls trying to go to school, and Miley Cyrus. You’ve already been told once to drop this hijack. Any more posts on this topic, from anyone, and I start handing out warnings. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326/100 "2010-10-08T18:42:09Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > > [@MEBuckner](#): > > > > Judge Littlejohn should be made, on pain of being held in contempt of America and locked up in Gitmo, to publicly recite [_West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette_](http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=319&invol=624). > > > > And _then_ removed from office. > > I think this is more important than people realize. In post #85, **Appleciders** notes that _Barnette_ held that schoolchildren could not be made to say the Pledge (true; that was the ruling), but confuses the Free Speech and Establishment Clauses (of the First Amendment) with the Article Six Religious Test clause, and misses the legal principle underlying **Barnette** : > > \*\*\*No person acting under color of governmental authority may require or coerce another to enter into any religion-motivated act or take any formal vow, including specifically reciting the Pledge of Allegiance. > > * * * > > And Judge Littlejohn should receive the same choice as former Alabama State Supreme Court Justice Roy Moore – comply with the U.S. Constitution, resign, or be removed from office. Since, according to the cites already mentioned in just this thread, he apparently has a healthy contempt for the law he supposedly enforces and upholds :rolleyes: I would personally demand his resignation or “fire” him before he had a chance to retire. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-judge-littlejohn/556326.md?page=6)