# Fuck you, right-wing, anti-American traitors! (the effort to stop Fahrenheit 9/11) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 14, 2004, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205 "2004-06-14T00:18:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Equipoise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/equipoise/32/151_2.png) [@Equipoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Equipoise)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/1 "2004-06-14T00:18:52Z")
> [@](#): > > [Stop Michael Moore!](http://www.moveamericaforward.org/NewsMax/) > STOP MICHAEL MOORE FROM PROFITTING > IN HIS ATTACKS ON AMERICA & OUR MILITARY > > “Bash America” filmmaker Michael Moore is about to unleash an attack on the U.S. Military, the heroic men and women of the Armed Forces and our Commander-In-Chief via his film “Fahrenheit 9/11.” > > Inexplicably, more than 1,000 theaters have indicated they will proudly broadcast what The Guardian calls an “anti-war/anti-Bush” film – beginning June 25th. And the number keeps growing each day. The goal of the film is abundantly clear: to undermine the war on terrorism. > > … > > Michael Moore and his anti-American film distributors are hoping to cash in to the tune of millions of dollars and also change U.S. politics. One British paper noted that “Moore hopes that it will bring down the U.S. government.” > > So why are mainstream movie theaters involved in promoting a political advertisement that defames our military, insults our troops and attempts to undermine the public’s support for the War on Terror? > > Why are movie theaters showing political propaganda that should be governed by Federal Elections Commission regulations on campaign finance? > … > > Move America Forward – the national organization working to support our troops and the war on terrorism – has compiled contact information for the leading movie executives in the business. > > If you don’t want to see them promoting anti-American propaganda then tell these executives so directly. > … [WHO PAYS THE BILLS FOR “MOVEAMERICAFORWARD.ORG”](http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/russo.html)? A PR firm. Who pays the PR firm? Fuckers. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/2 "2004-06-14T00:24:14Z")
I’d make an effort to stop Michael Moore from ever making a movie again if I could because he’s a dishonest, morally bankrupt person who makes propaganda films. Does that make me a traitor? Hardly. ---
**Author:** ![MysteryFellow63427](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@MysteryFellow63427](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MysteryFellow63427)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/3 "2004-06-14T00:25:44Z")
Indeed - who _does_ pay the PR firm? Could it be (_ **GASP** _) some right-wingers who don’t like Michael Moore? Do you have a real point here? If so, then it would have been nice to elaborate upon it in place of your masterful two sentence OP. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/4 "2004-06-14T00:28:06Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > I’d make an effort to stop Michael Moore from ever making a movie again if I could because he’s a dishonest, morally bankrupt person who makes propaganda films. Does that make me a traitor? Hardly. No traitor, but it does put you firmly in the anti first amendment camp. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/5 "2004-06-14T00:35:26Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > No traitor, but it does put you firmly in the anti first amendment camp. Really? So you have no particular problem with Riefenstahl or Eisenstein, propagandists nonpareil? Admirable. You know what? You’re right. Let his films live or die on their own merits. Sooner or later people will realize that Moore blows sunshine up their butts and will stay away in droves. Or not. You can’t account for people who blindly take people’s word for it. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/6 "2004-06-14T00:44:40Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > No traitor, but it does put you firmly in the anti first amendment camp. For about the Nth time, unless he’s a government agency, no it doesn’t. All it does is put him in the “Wish Michael Moore Would Shut Up” camp. ---
**Author:** ![Cerri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3bc359/32.png) [@Cerri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cerri)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/7 "2004-06-14T00:46:27Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Really? So you have no particular problem with Riefenstahl or Eisenstein, propagandists nonpareil? Admirable. Whether or not anyone has a _problem_ with the propaganda is besides the point as regards our Constitution, however. Having a problem with it, is irrelevant. It’s when people try to stop the _issuance_ of the propaganda, that us tree-huggers get all up in arms. (Well, _this_ tree-hugger anyways.) 😉 The best way to fight propaganda isn’t to muffle it, but debunk it publicly and honestly. If right-wingers don’t feel Moore’s films are accurate, they should put effort into debunking it, rather than trying to stop it. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/8 "2004-06-14T00:51:06Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Really? So you have no particular problem with **Riefenstahl or Eisenstein** , propagandists nonpareil? Admirable. > > You know what? You’re right. Let his films live or die on their own merits. Sooner or later people will realize that Moore blows sunshine up their butts and will stay away in droves. Or not. You can’t account for people who blindly take people’s word for it. Last time I looked they weren’t covered by the first amendment. Have you seen the movie Dave? If not, and I know you haven’t,. How can you judge something you haven’t seen? ---
**Author:** ![black\_rabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f19dbf/32.png) [@black\_rabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/black_rabbit)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/9 "2004-06-14T00:51:40Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Really? So you have no particular problem with Riefenstahl or Eisenstein, propagandists nonpareil? Admirable. Equating Moore with Nazis, huh? Glad to see you have so much respect for the principle of freedom of speech. Equipoise wins. I’ve got no problem with any trulygrass roots effort against the film, just as I’ve got no problem with an any grass roots effort to get the _National Review_, _Weekly Standard_, and _Washington Times_ to be pulled off of news stands and Sean Hannity shitcanned. The MAF-types kinda have a point with the campaign finance angle, but not much of one. Can you imagine the howls if the FEC decided to start regulating the Heritage Foundation like a campaign organization? Actually, that would be pretty sweet. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/10 "2004-06-14T00:56:09Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Really? So you have no particular problem with Riefenstahl or Eisenstein, propagandists nonpareil? Admirable. Are you tired tonight, **Airman**? Because that’s a pretty dumb analogy. Neither were U.S. citizens, neither worked in the U.S., and both effectively worked for their respective governments. > [@](#): > > You know what? You’re right. Let his films live or die on their own merits. Sooner or later people will realize that Moore blows sunshine up their butts and will stay away in droves. Or not. You can’t account for people who blindly take people’s word for it. This part, whether or not you meant it sarcastically, is exactly correct. Moore has every right to put forward his views. Every one else has every right to argue with him, agree with him, or ignore him, as they choose. And in case you’re wondering, every word I’ve just typed about Moore also applies to the web site referenced in the OP. They also have every right to put forward their views. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/11 "2004-06-14T00:56:37Z")
Just fyi… Eisenstein was Russian. **The Battleship Potemkin** was his. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/12 "2004-06-14T00:56:43Z")
> [@black455](#): > > Equating Moore with Nazis, huh? Glad to see you have so much respect for the principle of freedom of speech. Equipoise wins. No, actually, you thought I was equating Moore with Nazis, when I took great pains to avoid that comparison. I compared him with propagandists, one of which was in fact Soviet, or actually a Russian nationalist to be specific. Looks like I win. 🙂 Of course, that’s not the point, and you know it. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/13 "2004-06-14T01:03:30Z")
I think the only point here is that **Airman Doors** has shown his true colors. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/14 "2004-06-14T01:04:43Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > I think the only point here is that **Airman Doors** has shown his true colors. Agreed. ---
**Author:** ![SolGrundy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@SolGrundy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SolGrundy)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/15 "2004-06-14T01:14:41Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > For about the Nth time, unless he’s a government agency, no it doesn’t. All it does is put him in the “Wish Michael Moore Would Shut Up” camp. I’ve been in that camp so long, they should make me a camp counselor. If the world hadn’t gone completely insane over the past few years, people would be able to recognize what all this is: two sets of asinine self-important blowhards pissing at each other, manipulating facts to support their own propaganda. They _should_ just cancel each other out and let the rational people of the world get some work done. ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/16 "2004-06-14T01:23:21Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > For about the Nth time, unless he’s a government agency, no it doesn’t. All it does is put him in the “Wish Michael Moore Would Shut Up” camp. That depends on how he thinks Michael Moore should be encouraged to shut up. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/17 "2004-06-14T01:23:27Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > I think the only point here is that **Airman Doors** has shown his true colors. Oh? And what would those “true colors” be? That I think Michael Moore is an idiot, that I think he fleeces the public with his fabrications that he passes off as movies, or that I’m appalled that the people of the United States have made a charlatan like Moore a rich man? I’m sure you’ll come up with something suitably stupid, but regardless I wait with bated breath for your answer. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/18 "2004-06-14T01:23:57Z")
Well, i really don’t see the problem here. I think those right-wingers trying to stop the film are idiots, but i have no problem with them expressing their opposition to the film or to Moore. And **finagle** , while you’re correct that the first amendment applies much more narrowly than some people seem to think, it still seems to me that it’s somewhat hypocritical to claim, as some peope do, that America is a great country because it allows freedom of speech, and then argue that a private attempt to halt someone’s speech is fine. While such private attempts to stop speech do not invoke the first amendment legally, they demonstrate, at least to me, that some people’s alleged commitment to the idea of free expression is rather narrowly held. There’s no moral or ethical high ground in supporting freedom of speech only for ideas that you agree with. Personally, i believe that freedom of expression extends–or at least should extend–well beyond the limits encompassed by the first amendment, and that attempts to suppress others’ speech demonstrate a dislike for open discourse and the free market of ideas. And i apply this critique equally to those on the right and the left. ---
**Author:** ![SolGrundy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@SolGrundy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SolGrundy)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/19 "2004-06-14T01:26:14Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > I think the only point here is that **Airman Doors** has shown his true colors. > [@Reeder](#): > > Agreed. Dude, **Airman Doors**! You got _served_! I’m still not sure exactly what they were saying there, but they’re standing there with their arms crossed looking all smug, so I’m sure it was a pisser! Seriously, what the hell was that all about? That’s the equivalent of raising an eyebrow and saying, “Oh, he’s one of _them_.” What are these “true colors” you’re talking about? Only thing I’ve read is a poster’s saying that Moore makes propaganda movies, which is a point I agree with 100%. Moore’s hysterics, fact-manipulating, hyperbole, and propaganda are acceptable, but a press release and website that do the same exact thing are not? Does this mean I’m one of _them_ too? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2004, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205/20 "2004-06-14T01:29:49Z")
Oh, I know what’s coming. I’m an evil censor in the same mold as Ashcroft. I would violate the 1st Amendment in my zeal to stifle dissenting opinions. You know how the story goes. However, simply stating that I’d love to get the guy to shut up because he’s a dishonest fuck doesn’t mean that I would do so. Another blithe assumption on their behalf. Whatever. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-right-wing-anti-american-traitors-the-effort-to-stop-fahrenheit-9-11/250205.md?page=2)