# Fuck you, Rowan County (KY) Clerk Kim Davis **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 13, 2015, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757 "2015-08-13T18:09:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 32
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/621 "2015-09-04T08:39:40Z")
Kim Davis’s attorney compares her to [Jews in Nazi Germany](http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/kim-davis-lawyer-says-shes-just-jew-living-nazi-germany): > [@](#): > > “Does that mean that if you’re Christian, don’t apply here; if you’re a Jew, you gotta get — what happened in Nazi Germany, what happened there first, they removed the Jews from government public employment, then they stopped patronizing them in their private businesses, then they continued to stigmatize them, then they were the ‘problems,’ then they killed them,” Staver said. “The fact of the matter is, she has a right to this employment and you don’t lose your constitutional liberties just because you are employed by the government.” ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/622 "2015-09-04T08:59:04Z")
> [@Mat Staver](#): > > The fact of the matter is, she has a right to this employment and **you don’t lose your constitutional liberties just because you are employed by the government**. As I pointed out earlier in the thread: [yeah, you do](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garcetti_v._Ceballos). ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/623 "2015-09-04T09:16:51Z")
> [@Truman\_Burbank](#): > > Republican Candidates on the Rule of Law: > > IMMIGRATION LAWS: Must be strictly enforced. > > MARRIAGE LAWS: Totally up to the clerk.\*\*\*\* Also: Thousand of black people being shot by police: “They should have obeyed the law.” One Christian clerk violating several court rulings including a direct order being temporarily put in jail until she complies: “OMG PERSECUTION!!!111!” BTW, not to be outdone by Ted Cruz, Mike Huckabee has announced that he’s going to Kentucky to “stand with Kim Davis”. We’re all hoping he means “in jail”. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/624 "2015-09-04T09:44:10Z")
Christie and Carly have come out in favor of government officials following the law. I guess that’s the end of their campaigns. Most of the Repliopathidates came out squarely in favor of Jesus and Kim Davis and against sodomy, but Jeb! is hedging his bets. He thinks the gays should be allowed to marry wherever they want AND Kim Davis should be allowed to refuse their marriage. Deep thinking isn’t a strong suit for the Bush family. Is it too early to help President Ted Crazed or Mike Hackableep plan their cabinets? Kim Davis should be the shoo-in for Secretary of State. Joe Arpaio would make a fine Attorney General. Any other suggestions? ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/625 "2015-09-04T10:56:03Z")
> [@](#): > > Quote: > Originally Posted by Anaamika View Post > And please! Stop putting apostrophes on everything. Apostrophe does not mean “oncoming s”. “Muslims” doesn’t need an apostrophe unless you are talking about one Muslim who owns something. Same with Mormons, Rastafarians, and anything else! > I…I think I love you… > Seriously, Anaamika, please don’t make good on the threat you made in the AprilR pitting to leave the board. Your posts are always worth reading. Sheesh! Tough crowd. I composed a different sentence, then after an edit, simply forgot to remove the apostrophes. It was a simply oversight. Having never made an oversight yourselves you can never know the true depth of the shame I feel. All I can do is prostrate myself before you ladies and beg your forgiveness that your poor eyes should have been exposed to the horror that is a typing error! Please accept my humblest apologies, in future I shall strive to emulate your ways that I too may reach punctuation perfection! School’s never out on the Dope! ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/626 "2015-09-04T11:27:54Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Davis has [doubled](http://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/local/2015/09/02/kentucky-clerk-kim-davis-contempt-gay-marriage/71573666/) down: the judge told her he would lift the contempt charges since her deputies have (mostly) agreed to start issuing licenses, but she refused to leave jail and declared (through her attorney) that “she does not authorize any employee to issue licenses in her absence.” I don’t understand why her “refusal” to leave could be relevant to anything. He didn’t make her authorization a condition on her no longer being jailed. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/627 "2015-09-04T11:42:10Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > She has the authority to direct her deputies to issue licences, but she can’t put an unlawful condition on the issuance of licences, which is what she has done. The judge is severing the unlawful condition from her directive and telling the deputies to issue the licences in her name, without the unlawful condition. > > It’s really much the same as > If she was taking bribes as a condition of issuing a licence, and telling her clerks not to issue a licence without demanding a bribe. The judge could tell the deputies that she’s put an unlawful condition on their duties and they are to disregard that unlawful condition and to issue licences in her name, as required by law. > > And, since she insists that she will continue to refuse, then it is appropriate to keep her in jail because she is in contempt of a court order until she purges her contempt by either resigning her office, or agreeing to issue the licences. It is my understanding that she is not issuing any marriage licenses at all, whether to gay couples or straight couples. This is clearly against the law and I am not defending her actions. However, the judge’s remedy is to basically divest her of her powers in regards to issuing marriage licenses. I don’t think that is the proper remedy, but let’s roll with that. If the judge has said, “I am divesting your of your marriage licensing powers, and ordering your deputies to issue licenses no matter what you say” then there is no reason to hold her in jail. Let the deputies issue the licenses regardless of what she says. Yes, clearly, if she shows up to work tomorrow and the deputies refuse to issue licenses (which I cannot see how after telling the judge that they would) then arrest her and possibly the deputies as well. But the situation is the same whether she is in jail or not: She is ordering the deputies to refuse and the judge is telling them to issue; they have agreed to issue. How does she purge herself of contempt? Just by saying that she won’t engage in the now meaningless act of telling her deputies not to issue marriage licenses? IOW, the judge has effectively removed her from office with regards to the authority to issue marriage licenses. Her power in this regard is gone. She has no more authority (lawful or unlawful) to direct her deputies from issuing marriage license than I do. Jailing her serves no purpose. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/628 "2015-09-04T11:48:44Z")
ETA: What if she fires all of her deputies? What if they show up for work today with pink slips in their inboxes? What if she closes her office today? Did the judge address any of this? ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/629 "2015-09-04T11:49:18Z")
I’m reading a lot of posts today (on Twitter, for example) where people are comparing her to a modern day Rosa Parks. Are these people serious? That’s so ridiculous, I don’t know where to start. Even just mentioning Kim in the same sentence as her is a huge insult to Rosa. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/630 "2015-09-04T11:52:15Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > However, the judge’s remedy is to basically divest her of her powers in regards to issuing marriage licenses. I don’t think that is the proper remedy, but let’s roll with that. > > IOW, the judge has effectively removed her from office with regards to the authority to issue marriage licenses. Her power in this regard is gone. She has no more authority (lawful or unlawful) to direct her deputies from issuing marriage license than I do. Jailing her serves no purpose. The judge doesn’t technically have the authority to strip away her powers. His powers are limited to fines and jail for civil contempt. He’s telling everyone in the office that their choices are to provide the licenses or be jailed for contempt. Kim Davis can (and has, I believe) tell the staff to not issue licenses, but it’s now up to them to choose which order to violate. ---
**Author:** ![theR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@theR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theR)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/631 "2015-09-04T12:23:32Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > ETA: What if she fires all of her deputies? What if they show up for work today with pink slips in their inboxes? What if she closes her office today? Did the judge address any of this? I assume that would be her right as the elected clerk, but I’m not sure. It depends what rules the county has in place for terminating employees at the clerk’s office. On the other hand, none of this would get her out of jail and eventually it seems that the legislature would have to do something. As is typical with a county clerk’s office, the one in Rowan county apparently also handles land records, voter registration, and motor vehicles, and other public records in addition to marriage (divorce, lien release, etc). Fees for all this fund the county government, so that’s one problem if she fired everyone and she was in jail. Another problem is the citizens who couldn’t do things like real estate transactions and vehicle licensing. In other words, if she goes full nuclear it will eventually cost her the job because she’ll be causing problems for a much larger segment of the county, not just those trying to get married. ---
**Author:** ![theR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@theR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theR)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/632 "2015-09-04T12:28:37Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > It is my understanding that she is not issuing any marriage licenses at all, whether to gay couples or straight couples. This is clearly against the law and I am not defending her actions. > > However, the judge’s remedy is to basically divest her of her powers in regards to issuing marriage licenses. I don’t think that is the proper remedy, but let’s roll with that. > > If the judge has said, “I am divesting your of your marriage licensing powers, and ordering your deputies to issue licenses no matter what you say” then there is no reason to hold her in jail. Let the deputies issue the licenses regardless of what she says. Yes, clearly, if she shows up to work tomorrow and the deputies refuse to issue licenses (which I cannot see how after telling the judge that they would) then arrest her and possibly the deputies as well. > > But the situation is the same whether she is in jail or not: She is ordering the deputies to refuse and the judge is telling them to issue; they have agreed to issue. How does she purge herself of contempt? Just by saying that she won’t engage in the now meaningless act of telling her deputies not to issue marriage licenses? > > IOW, the judge has effectively removed her from office with regards to the authority to issue marriage licenses. Her power in this regard is gone. She has no more authority (lawful or unlawful) to direct her deputies from issuing marriage license than I do. Jailing her serves no purpose. What is your exact best case remedy that should be imposed by the judge since you seem to think the judge can’t do what has been done? ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/633 "2015-09-04T12:30:36Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > This is Kentucky we are talking about here, folks. No way is the legislature going to impeach her. That puts them on the wrong side of the lord. They just won’t do it, no matter how much political sense it makes. Not gonna happen. QFT ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/634 "2015-09-04T12:31:10Z")
For me, the perfect next step involves Ms Davis carving a swastika into her forehead ala Manson. Please, Kimmie? Please? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/635 "2015-09-04T12:34:46Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > It is my understanding that she is not issuing any marriage licenses at all, whether to gay couples or straight couples. This is clearly against the law and I am not defending her actions. > > However, the judge’s remedy is to basically divest her of her powers in regards to issuing marriage licenses. I don’t think that is the proper remedy, but let’s roll with that. > > If the judge has said, “I am divesting your of your marriage licensing powers, and ordering your deputies to issue licenses no matter what you say” then there is no reason to hold her in jail. Let the deputies issue the licenses regardless of what she says. Yes, clearly, if she shows up to work tomorrow and the deputies refuse to issue licenses (which I cannot see how after telling the judge that they would) then arrest her and possibly the deputies as well. > > But the situation is the same whether she is in jail or not: She is ordering the deputies to refuse and the judge is telling them to issue; they have agreed to issue. How does she purge herself of contempt? Just by saying that she won’t engage in the now meaningless act of telling her deputies not to issue marriage licenses? > > IOW, the judge has effectively removed her from office with regards to the authority to issue marriage licenses. Her power in this regard is gone. She has no more authority (lawful or unlawful) to direct her deputies from issuing marriage license than I do. Jailing her serves no purpose. The judge hasn’t, and can’t, remove her power to issue marriage licences. If she is released from jail and goes back to the office, she still personally has the power to issue marriage licences. And she’s said she won’t. That’s still being in contempt. She also could turn up at the office and try to tell her staff not to obey the court order. That’s also contempt. ---
**Author:** ![theR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@theR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theR)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/636 "2015-09-04T12:35:32Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > I’m thinking as she sits and rots in her cell, members of the Legislature will push for the Governor to call a special session so they can impeach her and rescue her. That way she can start her book tour/campaign appearances in Iowa. I don’t see Judge Bunning caving in anytime soon. > > Impeaching her gets everyone off the hook and lets the GOP turn a loss into a PR victory. Surely, Rove or Priebus will realize the opportunity they have and put the wheels in motion! No way. She will eventually fold and let others issue the licenses while claiming she is still standing by her beliefs and won the fight. If it’s true as someone stated that her mother was also the county clerk and her son works for her, she won’t be willing to give it up. Better to be a big fish in a small pond than a little fish for her 15 minutes in the big pond of national politics. The county clerk’s office is her family legacy and almost certainly makes her an important person even prior to this kerfuffle in county of only 20-some-thousand people. Either that or she’ll resign, try to make some money for a bit, then win the seat again and quietly let the office continue to issue the licenses. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/637 "2015-09-04T12:36:56Z")
First License issued @ 8:10am. [http://www.lex18.com/story/29959551/gay-couple-gets-marriage-license-at-rowan-county-clerks-office](http://www.lex18.com/story/29959551/gay-couple-gets-marriage-license-at-rowan-county-clerks-office) ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/638 "2015-09-04T12:45:46Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Sheesh! Tough crowd. > > I composed a different sentence, then after an edit, simply forgot to remove the apostrophes. It was a simply oversight. Having never made an oversight yourselves you can never know the true depth of the shame I feel. All I can do is prostrate myself before you ladies and beg your forgiveness that your poor eyes should have been exposed to the horror that is a typing error! Please accept my humblest apologies, in future I shall strive to emulate your ways that I too may reach punctuation perfection! > > School’s never out on the Dope! You don’t mess with the Grammar Police, man. We. Will. Cut. You. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/639 "2015-09-04T13:00:16Z")
I found an article in which she suggested as a remedy that her name be removed from marriage licenses/certificates. It seems to me that there’s a very easy way to accomplish that; for her to resign her post. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757/640 "2015-09-04T13:03:18Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > As I pointed out earlier in the thread: [yeah, you do](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garcetti_v._Ceballos). Also, > [@Mat Staver](#): > > The fact of the matter is, she has a right to this employment No to that too. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757.md?page=31) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-rowan-county-ky-clerk-kim-davis/727757.md?page=33)