# Fuck you, San Francisco **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 22, 2005, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153 "2005-08-22T18:34:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/41 "2005-08-23T00:34:56Z")
> [@KeithT](#): > > Could be that there’s a still a shitload of bad blood from the Navy’s [coverup of the 1989 gun turret explosion on the Iowa](http://www.salon.com/books/feature/1999/08/18/navy/print.html): I actually remember watching the live CSPAN coverage of the Senate Committee Senators (many of them lawyers) questioning the two main naval investigators about ther “queer revenge” theory. The senators (esp Bill Cohen of Maine) just shredded their smug arguments and “professional opinions” like tissue paper. The investigators were stunned . You could tell it was the _first time_ someone had called them to account for pulling these made behavioral hypotheses out of their ass. I was proud of the Senate that day. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/42 "2005-08-23T00:39:40Z")
> [@Ghanima](#): > > Hey asshole. You realize you’re judging an entire city based on the actions of 8 people, right? > > Just checking. Yes. Eight people who happen to be the elected representatives of the people of San Francisco to the Board of Supervisors. The resolution supporting the berthing of the Iowa in San Francisco was introduced by Supervisiors Michela Alioto-Pier, Sean Elsbernd and Fiona Ma. We can safely assume that these were the three votes for the resolution. That leaves Tom Ammiano, Chris Daly, Bevan Dufty, Sophie Maxwell, Ross Mirkarimi, Aaron Peskin, Gerardo Sandoval and Jake McGoldrick. We can safely assume that these were the votes against. Can anyone show me the conservatives or Republicans on this list, on either side? When I said this was the doing of some liberals, I meant it. San Francisco is one place where their influence is unchecked completely by conservatives. For some, their actions are unchecked by common sense as well. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/43 "2005-08-23T00:44:47Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Wait a minute - > > it’s long and hard and full of seamen, but San Francisco _doesn’t_ want it? > > There’s a first. > > Regards, > Shodan Sorry to burst your bubble, but the seamen are long gone. I suspect that the welcome would be warmer if they were still onboard. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/44 "2005-08-23T01:03:39Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Wait a minute - > > it’s long and hard and full of seamen, but San Francisco _doesn’t_ want it? > > There’s a first. > > Regards, > Shodan Yeah, but it’s also gray, seventy years old, and probably more than a little rusty. Not exactly a prime catch in today’s twink-dominated gay scene. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/45 "2005-08-23T01:23:45Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Yes. Eight people who happen to be the elected representatives of the people of San Francisco to the Board of Supervisors. Yeah, and it was precisely because of issues like this that they won those offices. It was the wedge issue of the last elections: which candidate could show the most disrespect the military in general, and war memorials in particular. I can vividly recall Tom Ammiano’s “I Hate the Navy” campaign commercials. The one where he was pissing on the grave of a WWII service man was particularly effective, and most analysts agree that it played a key role in his winning the election. ---
**Author:** ![kevja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/aeb1de/32.png) [@kevja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevja)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/46 "2005-08-23T01:35:34Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Can anyone show me the conservatives or Republicans on this list, on either side? > > When I said this was the doing of some liberals, I meant it. San Francisco is one place where their influence is unchecked completely by conservatives Thank goodness. And the next time some city 3000 miles away wants to put up the “Ten Commandments” at the Public Court House, I’m going to scream those conservatives go unchecked in [insert town]. Or maybe I’ll just stfu, and let that town decide what they want to do. BTW. I’m a gay liberal and live in San Francisco. Not around it, or close by. If it were up for a vote I would have voted to let the ship dock here. Put your broad brush away. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/47 "2005-08-23T01:37:58Z")
Tom Ammiano didn’t show commercials saying that he hated the Navy or disrespected veterans. But his actions here communicate that exact same message, quite clearly. C’mon, **Miller**. You said you were pissed about this decision. Why, exactly, did it make you angry? And why would you have welcomed the Iowa to the Bay Area, but these supervisors won’t? ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/48 "2005-08-23T01:40:46Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Yes. Eight people who happen to be the elected representatives of the people of San Francisco to the Board of Supervisors. > > The resolution supporting the berthing of the Iowa in San Francisco was introduced by Supervisiors Michela Alioto-Pier, Sean Elsbernd and Fiona Ma. We can safely assume that these were the three votes for the resolution. > > That leaves Tom Ammiano, Chris Daly, Bevan Dufty, Sophie Maxwell, Ross Mirkarimi, Aaron Peskin, Gerardo Sandoval and Jake McGoldrick. We can safely assume that these were the votes against. > > Can anyone show me the conservatives or Republicans on this list, on either side? > > When I said this was the doing of some liberals, I meant it. San Francisco is one place where their influence is unchecked completely by conservatives. > > For some, their actions are unchecked by common sense as well. Well, the three that introduced it were all Democrats. Fuckers, all of them, no? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/49 "2005-08-23T01:53:33Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > They voted 8-3 to reject the ship, thus putting the lie to the assertion that all liberals respect military service. Not all do, and San Francisco apparantly is full of that worthless crowd that does not. My beef here is with those liberals who don’t respect the veterans of the USS Iowa, or indeed veterans of any stripe. That wouldn’t include, obviously, those three that pressed for the ship to come to San Francisco, or Senator Feinstein, who did a lot to make it happen. I’m not painting with a braod brush. I have qualified my statements when necessary. But the fact remains that the government of San Francisco rejected this honor in an insulting way, and this insult reflects poorly on the city at large. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/50 "2005-08-23T01:57:15Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Tom Ammiano didn’t show commercials saying that he hated the Navy or disrespected veterans. But his actions here communicate that exact same message, quite clearly. Great. Tell Tom Ammiano to go fuck himself, then. Nobody voted for Tom Ammiano because they expected him to really stick it to the military in his position as a Terrible and Mighty Supervisor of the City of San Francisco. Jesus, I didn’t think I could have made my last post any more heavy handed, and you _still_ didn’t get it. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised, though. I mean, you voted for George Bush, right? George Bush is a moron, and everyone knows that if you vote for a poltician, it’s because you share all of his views and characteristics, all the way down the line. So, obviously, you must be a moron too. That is the point you were trying to make with your OP, right? > [@](#): > > C’mon, **Miller**. You said you were pissed about this decision. Why, exactly, did it make you angry? And why would you have welcomed the Iowa to the Bay Area, but these supervisors won’t? Because I live near San Francisco, I love the city, I want to see it prosper, and having the Iowa here would have brought the city additional revenue and prestige. The supervisors are failing in their job, which is to do what’s best for the city and its inhabitants. Plus, I’m pissed because I don’t want to go to Stockton to see the damned thing; it’s further away, and there’s nothing else I want to do in Stockton once I’m done with the boat. You live in D.C, which is about as far away from Stockton as it is from San Francisco. Why the fuck do you care where they stick it? ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/51 "2005-08-23T02:03:12Z")
> [@](#): > > That wouldn’t include, obviously, those three that pressed for the ship to come to San Francisco Obviously. I mean, Alioto-Pier is one of the “good” liberals, having endorsed the resolution and all. I’m sure she did it out of her respect for veterans. Why else would the current Fisherman’s Wharf District Supervisor, former SF Port Commissioner, granddaughter of Joe Alioto, former mayor and longtime Fisherman’s Wharf business owner, endorse a bill to bring the USS Iowa to its new permanent home, inside her district, twenty feet from her family’s restaurant? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/52 "2005-08-23T02:08:43Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > You live in D.C, which is about as far away from Stockton as it is from San Francisco. Why the fuck do you care where they stick it? You posted in a pit thread about tourists in my fair city. Why the fuck do you care about that? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/53 "2005-08-23T02:10:28Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > My beef here is with those liberals who don’t respect the veterans of the USS Iowa, or indeed veterans of any stripe. That wouldn’t include, obviously, those three that pressed for the ship to come to San Francisco, or Senator Feinstein, who did a lot to make it happen. The implication here is that you don’t have a beef with conservatives who don’t respect veterans. Yeah, yeah, save your breath, I know what you’re going to say, but you still had to go off and make this into a partisan issue. Says a lot about you, that you can’t view anything except in “liberal v. conservative” terms. Doesn’t say anything good, either. > [@](#): > > I’m not painting with a braod brush. Bullshit. > [@](#): > > I have qualified my statements when necessary. Bullshit. > [@](#): > > But the fact remains that the government of San Francisco rejected this honor in an insulting way, and this insult reflects poorly on the city at large. aaaaand bullshit. Congratulations, you’ve hit the trifecta. D.C… isn’t that the city that re-elected a convicted crack-head and whoremonger as mayor? Does that mean that the people of D.C. in general support illegal drug use and prostitution? Or am I painting with an insufficiently qualified broad brush there? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/54 "2005-08-23T02:12:02Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > You posted in a pit thread about tourists in my fair city. Why the fuck do you care about that? What? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/55 "2005-08-23T02:15:05Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > The implication here is that you don’t have a beef with conservatives who don’t respect veterans. Bullshit. I was talking about a decision of the San Francisco Board of Supervisors, which is 100% liberal Democrats. Had there been a conservative there voting this same way, I’d pit them as well. That’s strictly a theoretical question in this case, because no member of my party influenced this decision either pro or con. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/56 "2005-08-23T02:18:53Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Bullshit. I was talking about a decision of the San Francisco Board of Supervisors, which is 100% liberal Democrats. Had there been a conservative there voting this same way, I’d pit them as well. Next time, try to keep reading after the first sentence: > [@yours truly](#): > > Yeah, yeah, save your breath, I know what you’re going to say, but you still had to go off and make this into a partisan issue. Says a lot about you, that you can’t view anything except in “liberal v. conservative” terms. Doesn’t say anything good, either. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/57 "2005-08-23T02:21:25Z")
I just think that making a stand when they could have had possession of a very famous piece of history, one that could have brought some economic prosperity to boot, is silly. For that matter, homosexuality has never been approved of by the military, and yet I never saw San Francisco politicians attempt to evict the Armed Forces before. This is the politicians of San Francisco playing silly political games that they will regret one day upon reflection. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/58 "2005-08-23T02:23:01Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > This is the politicians of San Francisco playing silly political games that they will regret one day upon reflection. Or, possibly, re-election. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/59 "2005-08-23T02:32:57Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > What? I don’t like your implication, that I shouldn’t comment upon or criticize a city because I don’t happen to live there. It’s obviously advice you don’t follow yourself, as you have commented on other cities besides your hometown many times. You’re just hysterically trying to attack the messenger here, knowing full well that this decision looks bad to most people. It reflects poorly on your city, and it reflects poorly on some liberal Democrats as well. San Francisco would have a black eye over this whether I chose to post about it or not. Merylin Wong, who heads the nonprofit that wants to bring the ship there, [has been calling people to try to repair the damage caused by the supervisors:](http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050803/OPINION01/508030331/1035/archive) > [@](#): > > The woman was calling from San Francisco with a message for Iowans. > > “People in Iowa should know we’re all not crazy in San Francisco,” she said. “The people of Iowa deserve an explanation. You all need to know what’s really happening here.” > > I told her it’s unlikely all Iowans think everybody in San Francisco is wacky. > > Nevertheless, Merylin Wong thinks an explanation is in order because of a controversial action taken a couple of weeks ago by the city’s board of supervisors to prevent the battleship USS Iowa from becoming a floating museum on the San Francisco waterfront. > > The anti-USS Iowa supervisors say they oppose the military in general, the war in Iraq and the military’s alleged discrimination against homosexuals. So they voted to keep the ship out. > > Wong heads the nonprofit organization that wants to bring the World War II-era ship there. The supervisors’ vote, further confirmation San Francisco can be a bit screwy, will make that very difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2005, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153/60 "2005-08-23T03:03:37Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > I don’t like your implication, that I shouldn’t comment upon or criticize a city because I don’t happen to live there. It’s obviously advice you don’t follow yourself, as you have commented on other cities besides your hometown many times. Comment and criticize all you want. I always welcome intelligent disagreement. It’s the _stupid_ comments and criticism I take issue with. Like, for example, insulting the population of an entire city because of the actions of a few party hacks in minor political positions. Although I would be interested to see a serious post I made where I told an entire city to go fuck itself. I’m not saying it’s not there, necessarily, I’d just like to refresh my memory. > [@](#): > > You’re just hysterically trying to attack the messenger here, knowing full well that this decision looks bad to most people. Of course the decision looks bad to most people, dumbfuck. Where have I said otherwise? > [@](#): > > It reflects poorly on your city, and it reflects poorly on some liberal Democrats as well. Yeah, the eight of them who voted against the Iowa. Jesus Christ, man, listen to yourself. You sound just like **rjung** or **ElvisL1ves**. “Here’s something dumb that a minor elected official from the Opposition did that I disagree with! Clearly, it shows how stupid/dishonest everyone who voted for him must be!” You can usually spot that bullshit for what it is when they spout it, why are you having such a hard time recognizing it when its spewing out of your own mouth? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-san-francisco/318153.md?page=4)