# Fuck You, Voters **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 3, 2010, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326 "2010-11-03T14:09:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2010, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/301 "2010-11-06T20:33:21Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > So if the tactic in order to try to steer away from a plan by your opponents is instead to formulate and advocate your own plan, where was the Republican health plan this time? > > You are hypocrites. You are so partisan that if the democrats proposed that puppies are cute you would fight tooth and nail to deny it even if you just said yesterday that puppies are cute. Your goal is not to advanced the political discourse or improve the country, it is to lie and exaggerate and fabricate in order to oppose whatever the other side is proposing. > > If the plan will destroy america and ruin health care and all the other shit that’s being flung about, then you were wholly irresponsible to propose it yourselves 20 years ago. If it’s actually a step in the right direction, then you are fucking dickless puppets serving your corporate masters to oppose it so fiercely that you lie to the point of declaring that the government is going to start killing people on purpose. First of all, don’t say ‘you’ are hypocrites because I’m not a Republican, I’m an independent. I probably have more liberal positions than conservative ones, in fact. It’s just that this board has so many uberlefty whackjobs (like, for example, **Dio** , who I still suspect is a Rovian plant to make the left sound stupid) so I appear otherwise; as one poster here has said, if you’re in Hawii, even California looks East. Where was the Republican health plan? Last I checked, this plan was built in Harry Reid’s conference room table. If it had GOP inputs it would have tort reform, more free market solutions, and would have been more honestly accounted for cost-wise. If you want an alternative plan, check out the Bennett-Wyden plan, which went nowhere because it had no public option. Look, it’s simple: you don’t pass a bill with this monumental of an affect on the citizenry without doing it a) in the sunlight, and b) on a bipartisan basis. Hell, you couldn’t even get the Maine Senators to vote for it, and they’re practically Democrats. Violate this rule and there’s hell to pay (a la last Tuesday) ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2010, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/302 "2010-11-06T20:35:12Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > The republicans wrecked the country so badly it couldn’t be fixed in 2 years. The voters’ memories are short and don’t remember it was the republicans who fucked it up in the first place, and so they’re blaming the democrats for not cleaning up the huge fucking mess fast enough and thereby putting the people back into power that caused it. That’s what I chalk this up to. > > If the economy rebounded faster and was doing fine now, then the democrats would still hold both houses, despite their EVIL LIBERAL AGENDA. And just so we are clear, you put NONE of the blame on the four years of Democratically controlled Congress. None, it was all Bush’s fault. Got it :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2010, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/303 "2010-11-06T20:43:57Z")
The performance of the economy is almost always the primary way to determine whether the incumbents will be elected or not, and the actual root causes for the bad economy seem irrelevant. Even if you were to credit the republican anger over democratic policies for the resurgence, it’s still primarily based on lies. The death that the health care reform is going to create death panels and bankrupt the country (when the CBO says it’s money saving and… well, death panels are a complete fabrication), the idea that this is somehow now Obama’s recession (I bet in 5 years Iraq will be remembered by the right as Obama’s war) is silly. The idea that Obama/Pelosi/Reid are the prime movers behind the record-breaking deficit is [incorrect](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=558175), with new spending only making up less than 8% of the deficit. The idea that health care reform was “shoved down our throats” unilaterally when it was actually debated for weeks with republicans invited at every step of the process and even with 500 of their amendments accepted. The entire OMG HYPERLIBERAL SUPERCOMMUNIST hyperbole thrown at them is just silly. So even if I were to say it weren’t primarily the economy, but rather the belief the right has about the policies of the democrats, it’s still mostly based on lies. I’ll check out the Bennett-Wydett plan, but, before I do - are you talking about the 3 pages of platitudes without any specific proposals or actually laws that was trotted out as the republican’s health care plan in the middle of the debate? ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2010, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/304 "2010-11-06T20:53:19Z")
Here was an alternative plan that went [nowhere](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthy_Americans_Act). If this is true > [@](#): > > The performance of the economy is almost always the primary way to determine whether the incumbents will be elected or not, and the actual root causes for the bad economy seem irrelevant. Then it would have been a far more equal opportunity asswhuppin. It wasn’t. I don’t care how uberlib you or anyone else is, there really isn’t an alternative explaination that survives the laugh test. Go read Kraut’s article that I linked to. He is right- American politics is best played between the 40 yard lines. This administration, without a doubt, passed more legislation that increased the government footprint in our lives than any other. When your country is [a moderate-conservative](http://www.gallup.com/poll/120857/conservatives-single-largest-ideological-group.aspx) one, that’s a real bad idea, job security-wise. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/305 "2010-11-06T21:10:09Z")
Yeah, I feel much better about the Patriot Act than something designed to increase availability and decrease costs of medical care. This administration is the worst ever! Hell, nothing this administration has done yet can even touch medicare part D alone yet for long term cost. Your lies that this administration is omg super left and omg most intrusive government in history!!! may be part of the reason why the republicans regained so much ground in the mid-terms, but again, as I already covered, it’s mostly based on lies. So if you’re gloating about how widely the lies were believed, leading to the ascension of your favored political group, well kudos to you. I’m sure you’re doing God’s work. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2010, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/306 "2010-11-06T22:16:30Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > First of all, don’t say ‘you’ are hypocrites because I’m not a Republican, I’m an independent. I probably have more liberal positions than conservative ones, in fact. 😛 That’s the funniest thing you’ve posted since > [@](#): > > the social dystopia that is the European style nightmare The majority of this board’s Foxbots are at least honest enough to admit it. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2010, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/307 "2010-11-07T20:20:37Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > No problem. Keep fuckin’ that chicken, Clothy. Keep fuckin’ that chicken. Nah, I’ll do better than that. Rather than continuing to put up with your moronic bullshit and gratuitous insults, I’ll add you to my ignore list. Buh-bye, asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2010, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/308 "2010-11-07T21:02:13Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Nah, I’ll do better than that. Rather than continuing to put up with your moronic bullshit and gratuitous insults, I’ll add you to my ignore list. > > Buh-bye, asshole. Goodbye you cowardly retard punk. Sorry you can’t be man enough to deal with reality. ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2010, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/309 "2010-11-07T21:25:42Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Goodbye you cowardly retard punk. Sorry you can’t be man enough to deal with reality. Since he won’t see your post, I’ll help you out. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2010, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/310 "2010-11-07T22:01:04Z")
> [@Mr\_Smashy](#): > > And just so we are clear, you put NONE of the blame on the four years of Democratically controlled Congress. None, it was all Bush’s fault. > > Got it :rolleyes: Bush inherited no deficits, full employment and a robust economy. What did he leave, huge deficits, 2 unfunded wars, a deregulated economy that was crashing and a terrible redistribution of wealth. I suppose Obama should have hit the fix button. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/311 "2010-11-08T02:06:48Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Meh. 1994 pissed me off more. > > Mind you, I’m still plenty pissed off. I wanted my HOOCH, dammit. Hooch? I don’t understand, unless you were referring to legalized marijuana. FWIW, the pot measure may have been defeated, but the loss was far less of a rout than in the past. IIRC, there was a similar proposition once or twice in the 1970s, and it failed miserably. If anyone remembers what the proposition number and year were, I’d appreciate a PM, because I’ve been trying to research this and haven’t been able to Google it up. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/312 "2010-11-08T03:49:56Z")
I voted for Prell to go back to the old glass bottle. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/313 "2010-11-08T13:10:03Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Bush inherited no deficits, full employment and a robust economy. What did he leave, huge deficits, 2 unfunded wars, a deregulated economy that was crashing and a terrible redistribution of wealth. I suppose Obama should have hit the fix button. Again, I’ll ask - it’s all Bush’s fault. None of it was the fault of Congress, which was controlled (pretty handily, I might add) by Democrats. By the way, you uberlefties need to stop talking about unfunded wars. When you’re deficit spending, everything is unfunded to an extent - if you feel the war is needed, then it’s no more or less unfunded than any goverment program. Assuming you want to be taken seriously, that is. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/314 "2010-11-08T15:27:41Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > Hooch? I don’t understand, unless you were referring to legalized marijuana. FWIW, the pot measure may have been defeated, but the loss was far less of a rout than in the past. IIRC, there was a similar proposition once or twice in the 1970s, and it failed miserably. If anyone remembers what the proposition number and year were, I’d appreciate a PM, because I’ve been trying to research this and haven’t been able to Google it up. FWIW, the pot measure wasn’t very popular with the pot-growing ‘establishment’ in California. Apparently the measure put some specific regulations on how pot could be grown (like 25 sq ft plots max) which pot growers worried would decrease the variety of strains available to be grown… somehow. I don’t fully understand the details, but the impression I got was that the pot chiefs were not pleased and told their indians to vote against the measure and wait for a better one. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/315 "2010-11-08T17:11:46Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > According to the 10th Amendment, then, any and all government involvement in healthcare must be done at the state and local levels. (Please don’t bore me by playing the “general welfare clause” card. In which case, please explain: 1.) What you feel “general welfare” means, along with some examples of things you believe fall under this heading that are current federal powers; and 2.) How health care is different from these other, accepted forms of “general welfare.” > [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Ya know, I disappeared from the 'dope for a week for the sake of Get Out The Vote activities, and my guys won. 1.) \*My \*county voted overwhelmingly (~75%) for Barrett and Feingold. I have no means of easily traveling to other counties in Wisconsin, since I don’t drive. 2.) I had no idea that attitudes had shifted so far in other areas of the state or I would have tried to find some time to volunteer if I thought it would have made a difference. 3.) Disappearing from the SDMB wouldn’t do shit for my ability to volunteer, since I work a typical 9-to-5 office job and post from there. > [@gonzomax](#): > > Bush inherited no deficits, full employment and a robust economy. What did he leave, huge deficits, 2 unfunded wars, a deregulated economy that was crashing and a terrible redistribution of wealth. I suppose Obama should have hit the fix button. Well, yeah, they cost like _ **$5** _ at Staples. What kind of fucking slacker is he, anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/316 "2010-11-08T17:25:58Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > 2.) How health care is different from these other, accepted forms of “general welfare.” I missed **CM** ’s post the first time around. It certainly seems to me that, no matter how narrowly one would define “general welfare,” healthcare qualifies. “If X qualifies as welfare, anything does” certainly counts when you’re trying to make the argument that, say, everyone needs a 4-door sedan to survive, but it kind of baffles me that healthcare would _not_ be considered general welfare. Just when I was starting to think “if you get sick, die quickly” really was a distorted strawman… ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/317 "2010-11-08T17:48:16Z")
> [@descamisado](#): > > Since he won’t see your post, I’ll help you out. You didn’t accomplish anything other than broadcasting Lobo’s shortcomings one more time. If he wants to make a fool of himself in public, he’s free to do so. I personally don’t feel the need to put up with his childish insults any longer, but if you want to play in his sandbox, knock yourself out. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/318 "2010-11-08T18:16:56Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > In which case, please explain: > > 1.) What you feel “general welfare” means, along with some examples of things you believe fall under this heading that are current federal powers; and > 2.) How health care is different from these other, accepted forms of “general welfare.” General welfare is an issue of intent rather than of power granting. It means you’re supposed to create laws in the interest of the general welfare and not specific interests. You can’t pass a law taxing everyone to give money to guys whose last name start with the letter A - laws have to be written in the internest of the general welfare. If you interpret the general welfare clause to mean “the government can do whatever it wants so long as it says it’s in the interest of the general welfare”, the ENTIRE REST OF THE CONSTITUTION IS RENDERED MOOT. The modern (especially liberal) interpretation of the constitution is exactly what the constitution was designed to prevent. It has turned from “here are your specific powers, this is what you can do” into “well, if it’s not against the first fourth fifth and six amendments, go nuts” Edit: Really, further discussion of this should probably go into another thread since it’s clearly a seperate argument. But I wanted to clarify what **Crafter Man** is getting at. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/319 "2010-11-08T18:17:55Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Lobo, I have shit out turds that have more brains and common sense than you do. > [@Lobohan](#): > > I imagine you must have shit out quite a bit of your brains in order to get to the state you’re currently in. > > 😃 > [@Clothahump](#): > > Thanks for showing your ignorance once again. You are obviously severely challenged in reading comprehension. > [@Lobohan](#): > > No problem. Keep fuckin’ that chicken, Clothy. Keep fuckin’ that chicken. > [@Clothahump](#): > > Nah, I’ll do better than that. Rather than continuing to put up with your moronic bullshit and gratuitous insults, I’ll add you to my ignore list. > > Buh-bye, asshole. > [@Lobohan](#): > > Goodbye you cowardly retard punk. Sorry you can’t be man enough to deal with reality. > [@Clothahump](#): > > You didn’t accomplish anything other than broadcasting Lobo’s shortcomings one more time. If he wants to make a fool of himself in public, he’s free to do so. I personally don’t feel the need to put up with his childish insults any longer, but if you want to play in his sandbox, knock yourself out. I wish you two would just make out already and get it over with. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326/320 "2010-11-08T18:23:57Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > I wish you two would just make out already and get it over with. I imagine Clothy’s mouth tastes like denture cream and Jack, so I’m not really excited about that prospect. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fuck-you-voters/559326.md?page=17)