# Fucking Bullshit - Enron **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 25, 2006, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190 "2006-05-25T16:30:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/41 "2006-05-25T18:26:42Z")
[QUOTE=adam yax] I’m siding with **Jebus** here. I mean if you can’t screw your employees and small investors, what is the point of living in America? How is a guy supposed to make a buck? [/QUOTE] Or a bazillion bucks, in the Enron case. ---
**Author:** ![BMax](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bmax/32/4267_2.png) [@BMax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMax)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/42 "2006-05-25T18:33:28Z")
[QUOTE=adam yax] I’m siding with **Jebus** here. I mean if you can’t screw your employees and small investors, what is the point of living in America? How is a guy supposed to make a buck? [/QUOTE] You forgot about screwing the customers too. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/43 "2006-05-25T18:33:33Z")
Too bad Lay and Skilling couldn’t afford to hire decent lawyers to get them acquitted of these obvioulsy trumped charges. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/44 "2006-05-25T18:35:58Z")
[QUOTE=Jebus H. Christ] The government just went after them to take away coverage from the war. It had nothing to do with racism. [/QUOTE] No, no, the government went after _Barry Bonds_ to take away coverage from the war. _The media_ went after the Enron execs because of racism. It’s just as plausible as your theory. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/45 "2006-05-25T18:37:34Z")
Jebus, you are so fucking stupid it is pathetic. That you’ve figured how to actually power on a computer and operate a keyboard is astonishing. Do the world a favor. Find an isolated cave in the Himalayas, and hold yourself out as some kind of prophet. Let all who wish to receive your wisdom come to you and exchange food and other gratuities. June can’t come fast enough. ---
**Author:** ![vibrotronica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@vibrotronica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vibrotronica)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/46 "2006-05-25T18:41:31Z")
Where is Iraw, again? ---
**Author:** ![Jebus\_H.Christ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Jebus\_H.Christ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jebus_H.Christ)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/47 "2006-05-25T18:43:06Z")
[QUOTE=vibrotronica] Where is Iraw, again? [/QUOTE] Sorry typo. I meant Iraq. ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/48 "2006-05-25T18:45:16Z")
[QUOTE=D\_Odds] Jebus, you are so fucking stupid it is pathetic. \ Find an isolated cave in the Himalayas, and hold yourself out as some kind of prophet. [/QUOTE] Why do you hate the Himalayas? Why do you hate freedom? > [@vibrotronica](#): > > Where is Iraw, again? I don’t know about you, but Iraw a little between my buttcheeks. Heat rash I guess. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/49 "2006-05-25T18:47:02Z")
[QUOTE=NurseCarmen] Like the color of the sky on his planet is 9. [/QUOTE] Or 42. ---
**Author:** ![Missy2U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@Missy2U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Missy2U)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/50 "2006-05-25T18:47:11Z")
[QUOTE=Mr Bus Guy] Monkeys ate **Jebus’s** cranium. Scooped it clean out it appears. [/QUOTE] _snerk_ This is some funny stuff, MBG. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/51 "2006-05-25T18:50:14Z")
[QUOTE=Jebus H. Christ] Kay was indicted on July 7, 2004. Iraw War started in March 2003. It was only after the war he was indicted. [/QUOTE] Yes, but the investigations and early indictments all happened before that. From > [@](#): > > Oct. 16, 2001 > Enron reports $638 million third-quarter loss and discloses $1.2 billion reduction in stock value, partly related to partnerships run by chief financial officer Andrew Fastow. > > Oct. 31, 2001 > Enron announces SEC inquiry has been upgraded to a formal investigation. > > Jan. 9, 2002 > Justice Department confirms it has begun a criminal investigation. > > Aug. 21, 2002 > Kopper pleads guilty to conspiracy, agrees to cooperate with investigators. > > Oct. 31, 2002 > Fastow indicted on 78 charges of conspiracy, fraud, money laundering and other counts. I venture to say that the reason Lay and Skilling weren’t indicted earlier is that the government was building up its case. Not some fantastical plot to distract from the Iraq War. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/52 "2006-05-25T18:51:23Z")
Dammit. That timeline is excerpted from MSN [here.](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11700762/) ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/53 "2006-05-25T18:56:24Z")
Does the OP understand precisely what laws they were accused of breaking? Can you, **jebus** , offer a brief outline of what the accused actually did, and why it’s not illegal? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/54 "2006-05-25T18:58:42Z")
[QUOTE=Jebus H. Christ] Sorry typo. I meant Iraq. [/QUOTE] Oh! Thanks for clearing that up. I was wondering. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Plynck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Plynck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plynck)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/55 "2006-05-25T19:06:04Z")
[QUOTE=NurseCarmen] What color is the sky on your planet? [/QUOTE] I think it’s that awful pea green that the Highway Departments use to paint the bottoms of bridges. Just sayin’… ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/56 "2006-05-25T19:11:12Z")
[QUOTE=gigi] Or 42. [/QUOTE] Not a chance. If it was 42 then he’d at least have _one_ answer correct. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/57 "2006-05-25T19:11:50Z")
[QUOTE=Bricker] Does the OP understand precisely what laws they were accused of breaking? Can you, **jebus** , offer a brief outline of what the accused actually did, and why it’s not illegal? [/QUOTE] Lawyerball… go! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/58 "2006-05-25T19:16:10Z")
If it’s of any help: Kenneth Lay and Jeffrey Skilling were accused generally of fraud. This accusation arose because they actively created false accounting information that showed Enron to be in good financial straits when it was actually not. This is illegal: you cannot lie in your required accounting statements, especially if you then personally profit as a reesult of the lies. It’s perfectly legal to speculate – “I think this company will turn things around!” or “I’m sure our stock will be worth ten times what it is now!” But it’s not legal to falsify the actual reports showing what the financial condition of the company is. ---
**Author:** ![Hippy\_Hollow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hippy_hollow/32/4841_2.png) [@Hippy\_Hollow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hippy_Hollow)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/59 "2006-05-25T19:26:34Z")
I saw The Smartest Guys in the Room. As I remember: [ul] [li]The books were definitely cooked. False reports, imaginary holding companies, etc.[/li][li]The person responsible for the cooking was Andy Fastow, the CFO of Enron, I believe.[/li][li]The question at hand regarding guilt was regarding how much Lay and Skilling knew about what Fastow was doing.[/li][/ul] Either Lay and Skilling were remarkably hands-off in their management style (highly unlikely considering their success in the business world) or one or both were fully aware of Fastow’s doings. Fastow cooperated with the government in exchange for a lesser sentence, so it sounds as if they were able to make the case that they did indeed know what was going on. ---
**Author:** ![Jebus\_H.Christ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Jebus\_H.Christ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jebus_H.Christ)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2006, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190/60 "2006-05-25T19:33:50Z")
[QUOTE=Hippy Hollow] The question at hand regarding guilt was regarding how much Lay and Skilling knew about what Fastow was doing. [/QUOTE] And there is totally reasonable doubt about this. They were framed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-bullshit-enron/358190.md?page=4)