# Fucking Morons Still Trashing Buzz **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 22, 2015, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868 "2015-07-22T11:26:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2015, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/161 "2015-08-04T22:52:18Z")
Just because the government does lie about _something_, **John** , doesn’t means it _must_ lie about _everything._ Especially when the lie and coverup would be an unholy mess of hundreds of thousands of elements in utterly tangled connections across half a world, including both allies and enemies and extending across a half century. And one of the criteria for selection of the first few classes of astronaut was test pilots/fighter pilots educated as engineers. Cool customers whose jobs included filing a report to the effect of “At 16:32 while crossing 40,000 feet at Mach 0.8 the starboard wing departed. This had an adverse effect on attitude control response.” Who probably had been through a couple hundred hours of debriefing on top of the news conferences and were if anything exhausted. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Denning](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/53a042/32.png) [@John\_Denning](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Denning)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/162 "2015-08-05T00:54:30Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Okay, I’ll try that. (taking a stress pill) > > . > > . > > . > Nope. Didn’t work. You’re still an idiot. The stress pill comment, Miller, just so you know, was a quote from 2001 A Space Odyssey, it wasn’t an actual recommendation. Just thought I’d, you know, point that out. Anyway, you guys are are all entitled to your own beliefs, and if you want to believe that the moon landings happened and it makes you feel good, then that’s your choice. I just find it disturbing to see that so many of you are allowing yourselves to be controlled and manipulated by those whom you obviously admire so much, but then maybe that is the whole problem. Outa here. It’s been fun. Take care all. JD PS: It’s a good thing you didn’t get me started on 9/11 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/163 "2015-08-05T01:12:32Z")
> [@John\_Denning](#): > > The stress pill comment, Miller, just so you know, was a quote from 2001 A Space Odyssey, it wasn’t an actual recommendation. Just thought I’d, you know, point that out. > > Anyway, you guys are are all entitled to your own beliefs, and if you want to believe that the moon landings happened and it makes you feel good, then that’s your choice. I just find it disturbing to see that so many of you are allowing yourselves to be controlled and manipulated by those whom you obviously admire so much, but then maybe that is the whole problem. > > Outa here. It’s been fun. Take care all. > > JD > > PS:\*\* It’s a good thing you didn’t get me started on 9/11\*\* 🆒 I’m sure you’re just as forthcoming as you’ve been here. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/164 "2015-08-05T01:21:17Z")
> [@John\_Denning](#): > > Anyway, you guys are are all entitled to your own beliefs, and if you want to believe that the moon landings happened and it makes you feel good, then that’s your choice. I just find it disturbing to see that so many of you are allowing yourselves to be controlled and manipulated by those whom you obviously admire so much, but then maybe that is the whole problem. One can not know everything, so I do not rely on what the government tells me, I rely on groups that for a living do look at what is pseudo science and woo woo: > **[Moon landing hoax](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Moon_landing_hoax)** > > The Moon landing hoax refers to the belief of a small\[note 1\] but persistent number of people who think the Apollo Moon landings of the late 1960s and early 1970s were staged and faked propaganda films produced by NASA in an attempt to embarrass the... > [@](#): > > Given the overall context of the moon landings and that of the Space Race with the Soviet Union, there are many, many reasons why people would come forward to conclusively prove that the landings were faked: political gain, monetary gain, pure fame, and so on. Disproving the landings by a first-hand account, or evidence (such as a sneaky photograph of the studio used or something more concrete) would be relatively simple. However, this still flies in the face of what is known. Man-made objects are still on the moon and transmissions came from the moon, there is no “faking” this.[41] > > If we assume a conspiracy exists, we need to know what it involves. Given the number of people that would need to be paid off (or killed[42]) to stay silent, the effort required to pull the wool over the USSR’s eyes, the ground based fakery – rockets, launches, control rooms – fakery such as moon rocks and the photography and video taken from the moon… wouldn’t it seem more logical and far simpler to just go to the moon? > [edit] > [@John\_Denning](#): > > Outa here. It’s been fun. Take care all. > > JD > > PS: It’s a good thing you didn’t get me started on 9/11 🆒 About that: > **[9/11](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/9-11_conspiracy_theories)** > > On September 11, 2001, the Islamist terrorist organization al-Qaeda, led by Osama bin Laden, executed a plan in which a group of nineteen men,\[note 1\] mainly from Saudi Arabia, hijacked four passenger airplanes to crash two into the Twin Towers of... Well, sucks to be you, 🙂 too bad that we will not see your jumps though hoops miserably explaining away how is it that groups that do look at pseudo science and woo woo also find how dumb the moon hoax and 9/11 conspiracy theories are. And they are not the only ones that get to ask the experts about what it is the most likely explanation for CTs. [http://skepdic.com/apollo.html](http://skepdic.com/apollo.html) ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/165 "2015-08-05T01:54:10Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > I think a lot of this nonsense comes from the fact that we stopped after Apollo 17, didn’t create a permanent manned base, and didn’t continue on to Mars. They’d all be faked, dontcha know. > [@Hampshire](#): > > My take away from that- > Gawd, what a bunch of stiffs. Can you make going to the moon any less exciting? Maybe next time we send someone who can act like it was a life changing experience. > But alas, it doesn’t mean these guys didn’t go to the moon. Just means their personalities are dry as hell and NASA wasn’t focusing on their PR at the time. Oh gods, ALL the NASA people were boring. Watching them I would have to remind myself that at least what they were talking about was interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/166 "2015-08-05T04:40:53Z")
> [@John\_Denning](#): > > It’s a good thing you didn’t get me started on 9/11 🆒 No doubt you’d trot out just as much information as you did here: zero. And, of course, you’d trot out the usual lame accusations with no basis. Good riddance. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/167 "2015-08-05T04:47:58Z")
I tried to get him started on 9/11. Guess I didn’t bait him well enough. (shouldn’t have included the :D) Don’t ban him! I wanna hear all about the Sandy Hook hoax and how all the kids are raised by Obama’s relatives in Haiti/Kenya and denied Internet and Captain Crunch due to the formaldehyde in each of the crunch berries. He’s no different than any bible basher that runs away when we say snakes don’t have legs. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/168 "2015-08-05T09:42:19Z")
> [@John\_Denning](#): > > The stress pill comment, Miller, just so you know, was a quote from 2001 A Space Odyssey, it wasn’t an actual recommendation. Just thought I’d, you know, point that out. > > Anyway, you guys are are all entitled to your own beliefs, and if you want to believe that the moon landings happened and it makes you feel good, then that’s your choice. I just find it disturbing to see that so many of you are allowing yourselves to be controlled and manipulated by those whom you obviously admire so much, but then maybe that is the whole problem. > > Outa here. It’s been fun. Take care all. > > JD > > PS: It’s a good thing you didn’t get me started on 9/11 🆒 You’ve offered nothing as to why the government would risk a huge secret and scandal rather than just _send people to the moon_ (which is actually possible, if very difficult). ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/169 "2015-08-05T10:33:38Z")
Personally, I don’t believe **John Denning** actually exists. These posts are just a government conspiracy to make us _think_ he exists. ---
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/170 "2015-08-05T14:52:53Z")
Note that he hasn’t posted a single fact, just repeated over and over the CT Creed - “I believe…” There’s no point arguing with someone about his religious beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/171 "2015-08-05T14:53:06Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Not Tang!!! It was those zero-G space pens. This is what made it all worthwhile. Stupid Russians and their pencils. I’m sure they faked their space stuff, too. As an aside, Buzz Aldrin attended my high school. His address and phone number were listed in the alumni directory. I wonder if he would punch me in the face if I go to his house and tell him **John Denning** says he’s full of it. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/172 "2015-08-05T14:55:44Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Personally, I don’t believe **John Denning** actually exists. These posts are just a government conspiracy to make us _think_ he exists. And they do this in order to discredit those who believe in the _real_ conspiracies (big foot, the suppression of perpetual motion machines, and suppression of the truth about aether and phlogiston)! I know this is true because there’s no evidence of it, which proves that the government hides the evidence. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/173 "2015-08-05T15:07:51Z")
> [@Bookkeeper](#): > > Note that he hasn’t posted a single fact, just repeated over and over the CT Creed - “I believe…” > > There’s no point arguing with someone about his religious beliefs. _Claimed_ fact. Because anything he posted as fact would not be, in fact, a fact. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/174 "2015-08-05T15:43:49Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > _Claimed_ fact. Because anything he posted as fact would not be, in fact, a fact. Ahem… To paraphrase Colbert: Facts and reality has a well-known liberal bias. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/175 "2015-08-05T18:14:26Z")
Let me see if I get **John Denning’s** argument: 1. Rockets did take off into space, but they were unmanned. 2. We know those rockets were unmanned because the astronauts were not visibly excited when they talked about the mission to reporters. 3. Stanley Kubrick filmed the moon landings. 4. We know Kubrick filed the moon landings because he left clues. 5. You must be a religious zealot, or a jingoistic fanatic, to believe otherwise. Well, kids, this seems to be about as airtight as you can get. I’d argue to the contrary, but how can you beat this layer upon layer of historical analysis, scientific rigor, and careful elucidation. I, for one, no longer believe that any astronauts went to the moon. Mine eyes have seen the light! Now, **JD** , can you please tell me why I shouldn’t believe that the twin towers were destroyed by a plane. I’m all ears. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/176 "2015-08-05T18:47:36Z")
Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord. He left a hell of a mess! ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/177 "2015-08-05T18:53:34Z")
> [@John\_Denning](#): > > I just find it disturbing to see that so many of you are allowing yourselves to be controlled and manipulated by those whom you obviously admire so much, but then maybe that is the whole problem. I know the guy’s not coming back, but goddammit I still want to know how trusting that man went to the Moon (once, in the 1960s, for about 20 minutes) is a factor of control and/or manipulation. Well, OK, I suppose making people believe man went to the Moon (and back) is, in itself, a manipulation. I just don’t quite see to what end. Unless the Shadow Conspiracy is working off the Underpants Gnomes business model. And even in that case, I’m _still_ not seeing the control part ! ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/178 "2015-08-05T20:13:33Z")
Can anyone recommend a good book or two on the science of the Apollo projects? Described at or below college 101 physics? What kind of calcualtions they had to do hurl a rocket off the rotating earth and catch itself into the moons orbit without hitting or passing the moon? How wide were the margins for error? How correctable was the trajectory if they strayed from the set course? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/179 "2015-08-05T21:40:44Z")
**Hampshire** : the math really is pretty easy. The impressive part is that they could update the math in real-time. That takes computers. What’s massively impressive is that they could change the programs around, for Apollo 13, to re-calculate the orbits as everything changed. Drastically. The equations themselves are a tad beyond high-school algebra…but not all that far beyond. There is a lovely book, “Fundamentals of Astrodynamics” by Mueller, Bate, and White – Dover books – that’s a tad math heavy, but a schlub like me can get right through it without a math degree. As for accuracy, the plan was broken into parts. They had mid-course corrections, so the math didn’t have to be accurate to twelve decimal places, just “close enough.” Armstrong did the final piloting partly by radar and partly by naked eyes and the seat of his pants. Also, the math modeling changes from phase to phase. When you’re launching, you pretend the earth does not rotate. When you’re on your way to the moon, you pretend the Moon isn’t moving. This lets you simplify the equations. (We do the same thing instinctively when driving. You and that big truck might both be going 65 mph, but when you “slowly overtake him” you treat him, in some ways, as stationary.) ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2015, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868/180 "2015-08-05T22:30:20Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > There is a lovely book, “Fundamentals of Astrodynamics” by Mueller, Bate, and White – Dover books You missed the other clues: [ul][li]_Mueller_. Obviously an intentional misspelling of _Muller_ from _X-Files_. And don’t pretend for a minute, not even a second, that program is fiction. That’s what _they_ want you to think.[/li][li]_Bate_. Another intentional misspelling. The book is just to bait the “sheeple” into believing the nasty evil government.[/li][li]This is “twofer”.[list][\*]_White_. Well you know what that means.[/li][li]_Dover_. This is alluding to the White Cliffs of Dover.[/ul][/li]Obviously this is reinforcing the fact that the government, the White man’s government, is keeping the Black man down![/list] Seriously, **Trinopus**. I’m disappointed that you missed those oh so obvious clues. You’re slipping in your old age, friend. Just a pale [shadow](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPazGVuBXmY&spfreload=10) of your old self. Come back [John Denning](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_J._Denning). We need you to ensure power to the people! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fucking-morons-still-trashing-buzz/725868.md?page=10)