# GAAH! Fucking dieting! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 30, 2003, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538 "2003-08-30T00:06:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ben\_Hicks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bbce88/32.png) [@Ben\_Hicks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben_Hicks)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/1 "2003-08-30T00:06:04Z")
I’ve recently been on a long holiday. I had to adhere to a strict budget so I couldn’t afford fancy restaurants or much by way of fruit and veg. Essentially I ligved solely on junk food for a month. As a result I gained a stone in weight. I’m currently 12[sup]1/2[/sup] stone. Not _drastically_ overweight but the extra 14lbs definately shows on my extremely small frame. I decided to lose it. Unfortunately due to a nasty groin strain I’ve not been able to use the gym to expedite my weight loss (Ive tried working out a couple of times but it’s just flared up again) so I’ve just been eating very little. And I mean _very_ little. If I’ve been taking on more than 1000-1200 per day calories for the past 2 weeks I’d be surprised. Some days I know it’s been less than 1000. I was feeling rather frustrated because after 2 weeks I’d lost absolutely no fucking weight. That changed this morning when I stepped on my (extremely accurate) scales and saw that I’d lost four lbs. Not a bad show, right? At this rate I’d be well on track to lose my extra stone by the end of next month, faster than I thought I’d lose it. However, early this afternoon I went to do some shopping and felt quite light headed and even a little dizzy. “Fuck it.” I thought “I’ve overdone it on the dieting.” Over the past two weeks I have eschewed all junk food but while in town I ate 2 small portions of chips, one small portion of scampi and a prawn baguette. Tonight I weigh myself and I’m back from 12st 4lb up to 12st 8lb. I ask you. **How in the FUCK is it possible to gain FOUR FUCKING POUNDS in one FUCKING day just because I indulged a LITTLE for the first time in TWO FUCKING WEEKS?!?!?** I mean, yeah. I ate the junk food but sweet mother of FUCK! It was only two SMALL portions of chips (one of which I didn’t even fucking FINISH), one SMALL portion of scampi and one fucking prawn baguette!!! And that’s ALL I’ve had today!!! Assuming that each portion of chips contained 1000 calories (I’m sure they don’t contain that much, they were small portions but let’s just play safe and assume that each portion contained as many calories as an average sized sunday roast) andthe scampi and the baguette contained 500 each I’d still only be 500 over my average daily intake for a normal, non dieting, adult male. HOW THE FUCK DOES THIS OUTWEIGH THE OTHER 14 DAYS WHEN I’VE BEEN LIVING ON 3 BOWLS OF CEREAL A DAY + A _ **SMALL** _ AND I EMPHASISE THAT MOTHERFUCKING CUNTING WORD SMALL DINNER?? And sometimes I have even less than that? How the fuck does that work? How can I undo all the HARD work I’ve been doing for the past fortnight so quickly and so EASILY??? If that’s de rigeur with diets then I’ll just give up and surrender to sticking with this extra stone because it’s just not worth giving up. But seriously, how does this work? ---
**Author:** ![j.c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/73ab20/32.png) [@j.c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j.c)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/2 "2003-08-30T00:40:42Z")
How does this work? Very well. Seriously, many diet programs discourage daily weigh-in because a woman’s weight can vary by as much as five pounds depending on bloating, having a full stomach, and other factors. Stick to it! How many calories in the those three bowls of cereal a day? Three bowels of Weetabix with a cup of non-fat milk is around 800 calolries. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/3 "2003-08-30T00:43:04Z")
You may have noticed you aren’t as active either. Fact is, low calorie intake temporarily can stop fat loss, because your body says: “Not enough food! Conserve energy!” ---
**Author:** ![Ben\_Hicks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bbce88/32.png) [@Ben\_Hicks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben_Hicks)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/4 "2003-08-30T00:44:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Seriously, many diet programs discourage daily weigh-in because a woman’s weight can vary by as much as five pounds depending on bloating, having a full stomach, and other factors. Well, that’s comforting. Thanks **j.c.**! As for the cereal, I eat bran flakes and 3 bowls a day + milk is about 600 calories a day. ---
**Author:** ![Ben\_Hicks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bbce88/32.png) [@Ben\_Hicks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben_Hicks)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/5 "2003-08-30T00:52:28Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by smiling bandit_ > Fact is, low calorie intake temporarily can stop fat loss, because your body says: “Not enough food! Conserve energy!” Really? I never knew that. I mean, I figure if you’re literally _starving_ then your metabolism slows right down but can the same effect really be triggered by a diet like mine too? ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/6 "2003-08-30T03:21:19Z")
I really wish I could get paid to smack some sense into people who insist on doing these sorts of diets. I could make so much money… Drop what you’re doing, take your calories up to 2000 daily (eat 1400 of them before 6 PM!), and read [this](http://www.testosterone.net/nation_articles/268rest.jsp) ([part 2](http://www.testosterone.net/nation_articles/269rest.jsp)). Short version: dropping your calories too low is really, really bad. Once you’ve sorted that out, take a gander [here](http://www.testosterone.net/nation_articles/271diet.jsp). There’s a bunch of diet plans, many of which have worked for a lot of people. Pick one you like, and stick with it. Any other thoughts I have on dieting should go in a separate thread. ---
**Author:** ![Joyfulgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f04885/32.png) [@Joyfulgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joyfulgirl)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/7 "2003-08-30T10:04:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ben Hicks \* > \*\*Really? I never knew that. I mean, I figure if you’re literally _starving_ then your metabolism slows right down but can the same effect really be triggered by a diet like mine too? \*\* You are literally starving. If you deny your body to that extent, it will start to store more fat. Also, by starving yourself on an extremely low calorite diet, you are really messing up your metabolism, which can end up causing you problems for your entire life. Ever hear the term yo-yo dieting? It’s when you starve yourself and then binge to make up for the deprivation. Only your body can no longer handle the binge, because it’s been running on almost no fuel. Some people gain massive amounts of weight by trying this over and over again. Also, how does it feel? It’s never fun to deny yourself at an extreme level. The dizzyness is a huge sign. Reduce your calories, but don’t reduce them past a safe level. If you maintain a healthier eating style, you’ll lose weight, but you’ll keep it off, rather than losing some and gaining more continually. ---
**Author:** ![Lesbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Lesbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lesbia)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/8 "2003-08-30T15:09:29Z")
Ben, everything that everyone’s said here is true. Your body’s metabolism will slow down quite a bit and conserve every single calorie you eat if it thinks it’s in trouble. You won’t lose a thing, and even if you do, once you begin eating normally again (and you will; you won’t be able to stay on this starvation diet forever), your body will just suck up every calorie you eat (whether it’s from a carrot or a donut) and “store” it for the next starvation cycle it thinks will come. Self-preservation, so to speak. You must eat. Just eat smart. The links **ultrafilter** provided are quite good. Diets aren’t supposed to be a bad thing; they aren’t supposed to be a time we deprive ourselves. I don’t know why people think that. Slimfast ads, I guess. One thing more and I’ll shut up: you had been starving yourself for days. When you finally allowed yourself to eat, you mostly ate sugar. The chips, the coating on the prawns (I’m assuming here), and the baguette are nothing but starch and sugar. The body will store sugar first. Always. It’s the first thing the body goes for, _especially_ when it’s been starving. Try eating more protein than sugar and see if you have more luck. Peace to you. And I hope I haven’t overstepped and sounded all “lecture-y.” ---
**Author:** ![Ben\_Hicks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bbce88/32.png) [@Ben\_Hicks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben_Hicks)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/9 "2003-08-30T19:24:22Z")
Thanks a lot for the info guys (especially **Ultrafilter** for the links). I spent much of last night reading through Testosterone Magazine’s site and from what I read I felt that the **Cheater’s Diet** would probably fit me best. Now, wipe that smirk off yer face, turns out the so called “Cheater’s diet” is one of the more difficult ones to choose from. I’m just lucky I renewed my gym membership this week 'cos it looks like I’ll be using it a _lot_. Here’s a synopsis of it. If you want all the details go to [This page](http://www.testosterone.net/nation_articles/271diet.jsp) and scroll down about a third of the way down the page until you see **The Cheaters Diet** heading in blue. Click the link at the end of it (It opens in a popup window so I can’t link to it) > [@](#): > > \*\*Synopsis of the “Cheaters diet” > > Here’s something bodybuilders and fitness fanatics have noticed over the years: if you’re “good” most of the time on your diet, you can be “bad” occasionally and still make progress. In fact, sometimes it seems that an occasional cheat meal will even speed up your fat loss, or at the very least keep you sane and make you feel better in the gym. I first read about this back in the mid-90’s and tried it out. Much to my surprise it worked! I stayed strict all week, satisfied every craving on the weekend, and still leaned up for summer. > > Now along comes The Cheater’s Diet and the “Cheat to Win” plan, both of which summarize why a scheduled overfeeding period works and explain all the science behind it. Each plan differs in the details, but the essence is the same: use strategically planned cheat meals to speed up fat loss. > > Reader Feedback: Those who’ve tried the diets and followed them correctly are reporting great results. This is really no surprise. If you eat clean most of the time, a “re-feed” or two isn’t going to hurt you and may even help. > > Conclusion: The Cheater’s Diet and the Cheat to Win plan work, but you have to follow them closely. You can’t just cheat randomly and eat normally at other times and expect to lose fat. The stricter your diet, the more helpful a cheat meal or two can be. That being said, these approaches to fat loss are not great for those with a lot of fat to lose. They’re really designed to help those who are already pretty lean to get even leaner. If it’s okay, I’d like to pester you guys some more with a quick Q&A on the new diet because, this being a pro bodybuilders site and I being an obvious metabolic moron, some of the details of this diet went over my head. Q: The author of the new diet says: > [@](#): > > Increased 24-hour energy expenditure (24-EE) and basal metabolic rate (BMR). The shock of a caloric surplus will always cause the body to upregulate its metabolic rate. Wouldn’t this have, as **Joyfulgirl** says, a dangerous effect on my metabolism? Q: The author says: > [@](#): > > It’s important to note, however, that the physiological benefits mentioned above are only noticeable when an abundance of carbohydrate is taken in during the “cheat.” In one particular study, ten healthy females were overfed on either fat or carbohydrates. In the carb group, there was an acute 28% increase in serum leptin levels. (Again, these are increased levels from baseline; leptin levels associated with severe dieting are far below baseline.) However, the Fat group didn’t experience any significant change in plasma leptin Just to clarify, what the author is saying is that if I’m going to have a “cheat meal” it’s best to have one loaded with carbs like pasta or rice as opposed to a big assed sponge cake and a KFC bargain bucket, right? Q: The author lays out a diet plan in which he advocates ingesting: > [@](#): > > 5 grams each of L-glutamine and BCAA’s. What are L-glutamine and BCAA’s? Are they supplements? If so, do they have a brand name or should I just pop into my local chemists and ask for a bottle of L-glutamine? Can you find L-glutamine and BCAA’s in normal food? If so, what foods should I eat? > [@](#): > > Consume half a serving of Biotest Surge or similar drink immediately prior to or during training. I don’t know if you can get Biotest surge in the UK. Can any UK dopers suggest an equivalent I can buy? > [@](#): > > Supplement with an ephedrine-caffeine (EC) stack 30 minutes prior to training. What on earth is an ephedrine-caffeine stack? > [@](#): > > Consume maltodextrin and whey protein in a 2:1 ratio (.2-.4g/lb of LBM and .1-.2g/lb of LBM respectively; the amount is dependent upon your caloric needs), along with 5 grams each of L-glutamine and BCAA’s. Wha?!? Maltodextrin? Sounds like a friggin’ bioweapon. I would _really_ appreciate it if someone could dumb this down a little for me, please? > [@](#): > > 10 minutes of sprint intervals with a max effort to rest ratio of 1:1 (sprint 20 seconds, rest 20 seconds). Could someone put this in laymans terms? That’s about it. I’d really appreciate any help I can get. ---
**Author:** ![Ben\_Hicks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bbce88/32.png) [@Ben\_Hicks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben_Hicks)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/10 "2003-08-30T19:26:38Z")
BAH@Coding ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Joyfulgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f04885/32.png) [@Joyfulgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joyfulgirl)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/11 "2003-08-30T19:52:54Z")
It sounds to me like they’re talking about a dieting plan I’ve actually tried in the past. You stay on your diet for, say, a week and then have a cheat day to speed up your metabolism. This is actually a good idea to some extent. Basically, you restrict your calories, and then before your body slows down your metabolism to conserve, you increase your calories. The cheat day also helps you feel as if you’re not depriving yourself, because you can eat whatever you want while you’re cheating. Mixing up your calorie intake is a good way to keep your metabolism high. The problem with your previous diet was that you were restricting yourself too much, and it’s hard to reprogram your metabolism once it thinks it’s starving. Find the calorie range for your size/weight, and don’t go too far below that. Weight loss is a very complicated issue, and nothing works for everyone of course, but it’s very easy to destroy your health by dieting without having safe guidlines. The “cheat diet” could work for you, but you should up your calorie intake now so that your body has a chance to recover. Then slowly restrict your calories, and stick with whatever plan you have. This way, if you cheat when you’re not supposed to, you can still pick it back up and try again without doing any damage. I have no idea what all those terms mean either, but the basic premise of the diet sounds pretty good, as long as you don’t take it to an extreme. Good luck! ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/12 "2003-08-30T21:53:59Z")
The Cheater’s Diet is really aimed at people who already have pretty low bodyfat levels (around 10%) and are looking to get into contest shape (down around 5%). It’s not recommended for people who are much less lean than that. I’ll address the rest of your post shortly, but I’ve got to go eat. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2003, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaah-fucking-dieting/198538/13 "2003-08-30T22:13:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ben Hicks \* > \*\*Q: The author of the new diet says: > > > [@](#): > > > > Increased 24-hour energy expenditure (24-EE) and basal metabolic rate (BMR). The shock of a caloric surplus will always cause the body to upregulate its metabolic rate. \*\* > > Wouldn’t this have, as **Joyfulgirl** says, a dangerous effect on my metabolism? \*\* No, because you should be eating reasonably the rest of the time. I don’t know your stats all that well, but I’d guess that you’d want to aim for 2400 calories or so on a normal day, and 3600 or so on a cheat day. \*\* > [@](#): > > Q: The author says: > > > [@](#): > > > > It’s important to note, however, that the physiological benefits mentioned above are only noticeable when an abundance of carbohydrate is taken in during the “cheat.” In one particular study, ten healthy females were overfed on either fat or carbohydrates. In the carb group, there was an acute 28% increase in serum leptin levels. (Again, these are increased levels from baseline; leptin levels associated with severe dieting are far below baseline.) However, the Fat group didn’t experience any significant change in plasma leptin > > Just to clarify, what the author is saying is that if I’m going to have a “cheat meal” it’s best to have one loaded with carbs like pasta or rice as opposed to a big assed sponge cake and a KFC bargain bucket, right?\*\* Yes, and it’s not covered in that article, but you want to take in slow-digesting carbs with a fair amount of protein and low fat. It all has to do with insulin levels. There’s a two-part article ending in the [current issue](http://www.testosterone.net) that will explain why insulin is important. \*\* > [@](#): > > What are L-glutamine and BCAA’s? Are they supplements? If so, do they have a brand name or should I just pop into my local chemists and ask for a bottle of L-glutamine? Can you find L-glutamine and BCAA’s in normal food? If so, what foods should I eat?\*\* Those are supplements, and there are a bunch of different brands. BCAAs are branched-chain amino acids. \*\* > [@](#): > > I don’t know if you can get Biotest surge in the UK. Can any UK dopers suggest an equivalent I can buy?\*\* I’m pretty sure you can order Surge in the UK. If not, or if you think it’s too expensive, take some whey protein, some maltodextrin (a sugar, which shouldn’t be too hard to find), some glutamine and some BCAAs, and mix them together. For cheap Surge, try [Body Building Discount](http://www.bodybuildingdiscount.com). \*\* > [@](#): > > What on earth is an ephedrine-caffeine stack?\*\* Ephedrine and caffeine. Maybe not that important. Your call. \*\* > [@](#): > > Wha?!? Maltodextrin? Sounds like a friggin’ bioweapon. I would _really_ appreciate it if someone could dumb this down a little for me, please?\*\* Maltodextrin’s just sugar. You can probably buy it by that name online. \*\* > [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > 10 minutes of sprint intervals with a max effort to rest ratio of 1:1 (sprint 20 seconds, rest 20 seconds). > > Could someone put this in laymans terms?\*\* Basically, run like your life depends on it for 20 seconds, and don’t move for the next 20 seconds. It’s brutal, but it works. There’s something to be said for following that with 20 minutes of low-intensity cardio (maybe fast walking). Make sure to drink plenty of water.