# "Galloway was in Saddam's pay" -- Is this the tip of the iceberg? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 22, 2003, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202 "2003-04-22T01:57:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/21 "2003-04-22T13:46:09Z")
BTW the second letter seems to match their translation, although I just skimmed it . ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/22 "2003-04-22T14:06:03Z")
In his denial, Gallaway challenged, “Find me the UN cheques with my name on them.” He sounds secure that he did not directly receive any UN checks. However, it may be that Gallaway did receive money, but via some route other than the UN. An audit of Gallaway’s finances would be a more direct way to check the story. _Will anyone do so?_ **jjimm, kabbes** , would these allegations amount to a crime under British law? Do you think there will be a formal investigation? Who would do such an investigation? Scotland Yard? A committee of the House of Commons? Also, if Gallaway follows through on his threat to sue the\* Telegraph\*, would the defendant then have the right to audit Gallaway’s finances in an effort to validate the story? I’m fairly sure they would have that right under US law. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/23 "2003-04-22T14:13:01Z")
I’d first like to see a fascimile of the letters that prove the case. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/24 "2003-04-22T14:44:02Z")
This [BBC article from March of last year](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/1862579.stm) provides some interesting background on another Gallaway case. > [@](#): > > **Bin Laden connected to London dissident** > > The programme provides evidence that Saad Al-Fagih, a key figure in the London-based campaign opposed to the Saudi regime, bought a satellite phone that was later used by Osama Bin Laden’s al-Qaeda organisation… > > Al-Fagih was also involved in a campaign to stop the deportation of another Saudi dissident, Mohammed Al-Masari, from Britain. > > The campaign to stop Al-Masari’s removal by then Conservative Home Secretary Michael Howard finally succeeded in early 1996. > > Al-Masari admits he has talked with and helped Osama Bin Laden in the past and would do so again, telling Five Live Report: “Yes, why not?” > > The programme asked Al-Masari why he had helped Osama Bin Laden in the past, he said: 'It’s the same cause." When asked if he would still help him he replied: “Yeah, if we can help anything, why not?”… > > Labour MP George Galloway was also part of the campaign to keep Al-Masari from being deported to the Caribbean island of Dominica in 1995. > > The MP - who had a blazing row at Westminster this week after he was called an apologist for Saddam Hussein by a government minister - told the programme: "I have never seen any evidence that either Al-Masari or Al-Fagih were in any way connected to violence and if you have uncovered any I will listen to your programme with interest.’ > > …In 1997 the Select Committee on Standards and Privileges investigated a complaint that George Galloway had not declared an interest when speaking on Saudi Arabia the year before. > > MPs threw out the complaint but looked more closely into the question of Galloway acting as a financial intermediary. > > Mr Galloway was paid £5,000 in cash by Al-Fagih in late 1995 to early 1996 to repay costs incurred on behalf of others during the campaign to prevent Al-Masari’s deportation. > > He was also given £1800 in cash by Al-Fagih to pass on to academics to help with the same campaign. Mr Galloway has never identified the academics. That last sentence leads back to the “tip of the iceberg” question. Which academics received Al-Fagih money? Did any of them later receive Saddam Hussein money? Inquiring minds want to know. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/25 "2003-04-22T14:45:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > **In his denial, Gallaway challenged, “Find me the UN cheques with my name on them.” He sounds secure that he did not directly receive any UN checks. However, it may be that Gallaway did receive money, but via some route other than the UN.** Perhaps, but that’s not what the Telegraph article in your OP says. > [@](#): > > \*\*An audit of Gallaway’s finances would be a more direct way to check the story. _Will anyone do so?_ > > **jjimm, kabbes** , would these allegations amount to a crime under British law? Do you think there will be a formal investigation? Who would do such an investigation? Scotland Yard? A committee of the House of Commons?\*\* I suspect it would be illegal if it contravenes the UN sanctions (UK dopers - remember Mark Thomas sending teddybears to Iraqi children a couple of years ago in direct contradiction of sanctions?). Though since the allegations concern UN oil-for-food, if true, then it might be legal - it’s not clear exactly how he is meant to be profiting from this. Even if not illegal, if proven, then Galloway would almost certainly resign, and his career and name would be ruined. > [@](#): > > _Also, if Gallaway follows through on his threat to sue the Telegraph_, would the defendant then have the right to audit Gallaway’s finances in an effort to validate the story? I’m fairly sure they would have that right under US law. \*\* I am not a lawyer, but if not the defendant, then I suspect the courts would be able to do this, and they’re pretty stringent. (Not strictly related, but Lord Jeffrey Archer’s currently in jail for committing perjury in a libel case that he himself launched). I shall be keeping a close eye on this. Something smells fishy… ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/26 "2003-04-22T14:48:59Z")
> [@](#): > > **december** : I’m fairly sure they would have that right under US law. During the discovery process the plaintiff must reveal a great deal that is ordinarily private. Things which _are reasonably calculated to lead to the discovery of admissible evidence_ being discoverable is one rule of thumb. That’s pretty broad. I’m not surprised Gallaway is suing for defamation. Given the nature of the charges, he must act innocent (however you do that, BTW). An innocent man would sue, presumably. Who cares about paying the legal fees when you face total disgrace and potentially criminal charges? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/27 "2003-04-22T14:54:48Z")
Personally, I hope these accusations are true. He’s an objectionable worm, and one of the smarmiest people I’ve ever met. As regards the OP, it really is unlikely that any other MP’s could be in a similar position. Galloway has long been an outspoken defender of Iraq, and certainly their most ardent supporter in British politics. ---
**Author:** ![London\_Calling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@London\_Calling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/London_Calling)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/28 "2003-04-22T15:17:31Z")
Everyone wants Galloway’s bollocks, from his own political party to the security services. Have done for years. Personally, I’d give it at least a few days and see what else emerges. IMHO, his best hope at the moment would seem to be someone like the Guardian being sent counter information from inside – so many people want Galloway, I suspect I’d only be happy if the money trail is proven to lead directly to him (making withdrawals). Fwiw, I think it’s possible he received money but isn’t that like everyone else including the UK doing business with the regime up until last year – dammit, the French and Germans (as well as the UK) thought that policy the best way to bring Iraq into the ‘world community’ … am I suffering from a ‘1984’ reality slip again ? ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/29 "2003-04-22T15:57:41Z")
Just wait until the Saudi Arabian allegations emerge. When/if they find the audiotapes. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/30 "2003-04-22T16:03:03Z")
Sorry, could you elaborate istara? ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2003, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/31 "2003-04-22T16:56:30Z")
I always found it strange how a backbench MP from a working-class constituency in Glasgow had such incredible access to the inner workings of _any_ foreign government, Iraqi or other. Knowing the workings of the Labour party in Glasgow (see: the Mohammed Sarwar bribery case) I wouldn’t be surprised if these allegations are found to be true. ---
**Author:** ![bbonden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecb155/32.png) [@bbonden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bbonden)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/32 "2003-04-23T00:11:17Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by jjimm \* > \*\* > Galloway will be [suing the Telegraph for libel](http://media.guardian.co.uk/presspublishing/story/0,7495,941140,00.html), BTW. Anyone who knows about British libel law will know that these trials are fairly stringent, and have caused the downfall of several prominent plaintiffs - he’d therefore have to be pretty sure of his innocence._\* **jjimm** , Galloway has been accused of treason or something very close. He has to sue for libel. He doesn’t really have much of an alternative. **kabbes** , there is nothing “fairly obscure” about Galloway. ---
**Author:** ![X\_Slayer\_ALE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/bbe5ce/32.png) [@X\_Slayer\_ALE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/X_Slayer_ALE)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/33 "2003-04-23T00:35:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Urban Ranger \* > \*\*Of course, the money the US is paying the “coalition of the willing” from the US$7.6b are not bribes. No sir, the US is incapable of committing crimes by definition. \*\* For technicality sake I would like to point out that **bribes** are the exchange of monies, services or items for the performance of an illegal act by an official (or govt). What the US did to form the coalition of the willing is the exchange or promise to exchange for monies, goods and services for the unscrupulous use of one’s position by an official (or govt) in favor of the US. Thats called **graft** not bribery. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Celyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9dc877/32.png) [@Celyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Celyn)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/34 "2003-04-23T00:58:48Z")
Oddly it does not surprise me to find that the “Telegraph” dislikes George Galloway. Incidentally, Glasgow Kelvin is more of a student/academic constituency than the classic meaning of “working class.” ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/35 "2003-04-23T01:22:43Z")
[Investigation begins.](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030423/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_british_lawmaker&cid=540&ncid=1478) ---
**Author:** ![Urban\_Ranger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Urban\_Ranger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urban_Ranger)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/36 "2003-04-23T03:00:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SuaSponte \* > Butcher the English language much, **Urban Ranger**? Beat your wife much? > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SuaSponte \* > “Alleged” does not mean “without basis;” it means an accusation has been made, and the accusation has not yet been proven. In other words, without basis. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SuaSponte \* > There sure as hell is a basis for the allegation here, hun. It’s called “Iraqi intelligence documents.” That basis may later turn out to be faulty, but a freaking basis exists. Ah. Are they as accurate as those CIA reports on Iraqi NBC weapons? ---
**Author:** ![Fang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/96bed5/32.png) [@Fang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fang)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/37 "2003-04-23T03:40:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Urban Ranger \* > \*\*In other words, without basis. \*\* I don’t know how you can possibly equate “unproven” with “without basis”. It has not been proven that OJ Simpson murdered his ex-wife, but that does not mean there is no basis to think he did. It is not proven that there is life on other planets, but that does not mean there is no basis to think there is (in the first case the basis would be inductive, in the second deductive, and in the present case once again inductive, but I think the point is clear). ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/38 "2003-04-23T08:10:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Beagle \* > \*\*[Investigation begins.](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030423/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_british_lawmaker&cid=540&ncid=1478) \*\* I should point out that this investigation is into _another_ allegation: that he used charity money from a fund he’d helped set up for Iraqi children as his travelling expenses. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/39 "2003-04-23T08:20:20Z")
Sorry, shoulda read the cite better. There’s an internal Labour investigation, not a criminal one, on the Galloway/Saddam kickback allegations. The investigation into Galloway’s alleged misuse of charity funds is by “officials”, whatever that means. ---
**Author:** ![kabbes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e99b99/32.png) [@kabbes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kabbes)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 10:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202/40 "2003-04-23T10:08:10Z")
The backlash has started. There have been murmurings in the media that this whiffs of the Scargill smear where he was claimed to be in the pay of Lybia in the 1980s - a smear which seriously damaged him but was subsequently shown to be complete fabrication. Some are suggesting that the intelligence service, who have good reason to dislike Galloway, may have planted that document. After all it is pretty bloody convenient that in an otherwised burned down building with virtually every other folder being no more than white ash, this one was there unharmed at the top of the pile ready to be discovered. pan [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/galloway-was-in-saddams-pay-is-this-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/170202.md?page=3)