# Game of Thrones 3.05 "Kissed by Fire" 4/28/13 No spoilers **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 29, 2013, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979 "2013-04-29T02:37:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/201 "2013-05-02T20:15:21Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Yes that would seem to be the case in series. But two episodes ago the blew an Astapor sized hole in that theory. Why would the Ben Kingsley knockoff agree to the dragon unsullied trade if that was the case? If that theory is true, then he would have known that only Targaryens can control dragons, because others did try to do so and failed. > > Also, there is a lot of Targaryen blood in other families, besides the King they have married out, Robert’s grandmother was Targaryen. I wasn’t saying that only Targayens could control dragons - I was saying that only Targaryens could \*hatch \*dragons. As for bloodlines - fantasy genetics don’t work the same way as real genetics. This is magic we’re talking about, and magic is big on the whole “true-blooded heir” thing. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/202 "2013-05-02T20:57:05Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > That’s… gonna get really weird. The showrunners seem to have a pretty good grasp on the story. I trust they can carry it off… Perhaps the slave trader in Astapor didn’t have a real grasp on the care & feeding of dragons. They’ve been considered extinct for a very long time… ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/203 "2013-05-02T21:01:33Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > You’re not going to notice when a child travels 100 miles, then has a beard next season? Bran’s actor is already getting a changed voice. Exactly my point. Nothing to do w/ the books, which I’ve not read. Note that you can’t just allow them to age w/o it affecting the plot as a whole. If they age three years because three years have passed in Westeros, the same three years pass for everyone else–during a span which in the book was maybe six months or a year. Regarding Dany, I think that all true Targaryens are linked to dragons; it’s not necessarily that all dragons are linked to Targaryens. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/204 "2013-05-02T21:01:52Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Here is the question. Why the hell has no one else attempted to get Dragons since Aegon Targaryen showed up.When the US/UK developed the Nuclear bomb, other nations did not just lie back and surrender, they developed their own. Surely Tywin Lannister’s ancestors, the Kings who got their armies toasted must have sent at least a query or two. And why is everyone so blase about Dany having dragons. Instead of, “oh well if she really has them, we are truly fucked”, why not “okay, somebody find where she got them from and get a squadron or three for ourselves.” I mean furthermore its not like they are fighting an enemy who can only be killed by dragons. You can’t just “invent” dragons, you either have them or you don’t. Where would anyone else get dragons? Dany’s eggs were fossilized and worth a massive fortune anyways, i can only imagine the price has gone up since then. ---
**Author:** ![Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bc8723/32.png) [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unauthorized_Cinnamon)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/205 "2013-05-02T21:21:41Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > Exactly my point. Nothing to do w/ the books, which I’ve not read. Note that you can’t just allow them to age w/o it affecting the plot as a whole. If they age three years because three years have passed in Westeros, the same three years pass for everyone else–during a span which in the book was maybe six months or a year. \ Well, Bran and Rickon are the only big problems I see. To the extent you’re OK with Sansa this season, you’re already suspending disbelief quite well. She’s supposed to be 13 or 14, but in every scene with another person, she towers over them like Xena: Warrior Princess. It’s not unknown for a 13 year old girl to be that tall and substantial, but it is a little odd. On the other hand, there’s the problem of Bran and Rickon being pre-pubescent characters, and male. It’s pretty hard to buy that even an 11 or 12-year-old Bran’s voice is already changing, there’s similar potential for Rickon’s actor to be too old (though they could recast pretty easily). Maisie Williams (Arya) has the babiest of baby faces. She’s already playing down in age, and it doesn’t seem unbelievable to me at all. Also, time in this world is mushy. Do we know how many days have passed since the first episode? Seasons are no guide, and a lot of shit has gone down, so they have some wiggle room. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/206 "2013-05-02T21:27:01Z")
> [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](#): > > Also, time in this world is mushy. Do we know how many days have passed since the first episode? Seasons are no guide, and a lot of shit has gone down, so they have some wiggle room. Yeah, it certainly seem like a lot of time has passed. The war must have taken months so far, if not years. Everyone is walking everywhere, and in just few episodes people traveled all the way from King’s Landing to Winterfell and back. ---
**Author:** ![Furious\_Marmot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dfb087/32.png) [@Furious\_Marmot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Furious_Marmot)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/207 "2013-05-02T21:28:47Z")
Distances are similarly unclear, particularly north of the Wall, where we have no opening credits map. How far are Castle Black, Craster’s house, the Fist of the First Men, or the big Wildling camp from each other? It’s hard to get a handle on just how much trouble Sam is in. Is he a couple days walk from safety? A month? Where is he relative to Jon? Who knows? ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/208 "2013-05-02T21:50:05Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > Regarding Dany, I think that **all true Targaryens** are linked to dragons; it’s not necessarily that all dragons are linked to Targaryens. Bolding mine. It’s clear that GRRM took from some real cultures, like the Starks and other Northmen are Viking-analogues. But are you saying that the Targaryens are Scotsmen analogues? 😃 Rickon could easily be recast. I barely even notice the character. The guy who plays Jojen is 22 (!) though, I wouldn’t have expected that. Distances: I don’t think anyone “civilized” even knows much of what’s beyond the Wall. In the last episode, they mention there are 20-odd castles along the Wall, Jon claims only 3 are occupied. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/209 "2013-05-02T21:54:15Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > The guy who plays Jojen is 22 (!) though, I wouldn’t have expected that. Why does it even matter that the guy playing Jojen is 22? I don’t think we were ever given any info as to the character’s age, aside from the appearance of the actor. ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/210 "2013-05-02T22:02:27Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > Bolding mine. It’s clear that GRRM took from some real cultures, like the Starks and other Northmen are Viking-analogues. But are you saying that the Targaryens are Scotsmen analogues? 😃 > > Rickon could easily be recast. I barely even notice the character. The guy who plays Jojen is 22 (!) though, I wouldn’t have expected that. > > Distances: I don’t think anyone “civilized” even knows much of what’s beyond the Wall. In the last episode, they mention there are 20-odd castles along the Wall, Jon claims only 3 are occupied. Of course. It’s clear that whatsizname, Dany’s brother, was no true Targaryen because he wasn’t immune to heat. 😃 Also, the Iron Islanders are really the Viking analogues; the Starks are more like “generic Roman-era Germanic barbarians”, or even generic medieval Englishman, really. All this talk of mushy distances has me wondering if Westeros has moved on. Perhaps Dany is following the path of the Beam. 😉 Incidentally, is the wall a natural feature or man-made? I’ve always thought the former, and that it’s not really a wall so much as it is a cliff at the edge of a plateau, but I’ve heard some folks talk about it like it’s, y’know. A _ **wall** _. Built by human hands, with men on one side and white walkers on the other. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/211 "2013-05-02T22:04:34Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > Incidentally, is the wall a natural feature or man-made? I’ve always thought the former, and that it’s not really a wall so much as it is a cliff at the edge of a plateau, but I’ve heard some folks talk about it like it’s, y’know. A _ **wall** _. Built by human hands, with men on one side and white walkers on the other. I assumed it was magically created. I think they’ve mentioned that it was put in place to protect the realm from the White Walkers. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/212 "2013-05-02T22:05:30Z")
> [@](#): > > Incidentally, is the wall a natural feature or man-made? I’ve always thought the former, and that it’s not really a wall so much as it is a cliff at the edge of a plateau, but I’ve heard some folks talk about it like it’s, y’know. A _ **wall** _. Built by human hands, with men on one side and white walkers on the other. It’s man-made. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/213 "2013-05-02T22:06:54Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > Of course. It’s clear that whatsizname, Dany’s brother, was no true Targaryen because he wasn’t immune to heat. 😃 Also, the Iron Islanders are really the Viking analogues; the Starks are more like “generic Roman-era Germanic barbarians”, or even generic medieval Englishman, really. I was thinking about that. Can we think of Westeros as sort of like England or Great Britain, with King’s Landing instead of London, and perhaps the Starks as northern Englishmen or even Scotsmen? ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/214 "2013-05-02T22:52:55Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Why does it even matter that the guy playing Jojen is 22? I don’t think we were ever given any info as to the character’s age, aside from the appearance of the actor. Ummm, simply because it’s surprising? There doesn’t have to be justification. I haven’t read the books so I’m not one of the people who would freak out because Jon Snow is really 12 or something. I’m not sure how close this gets to minor book spoilers (haven’t read them), and I think the show does mention it: the ancestors of the more southern families (Baratheons, Lannisters) are descended from an ethnic group which brought all the knight stuff. The northern folks (Stark, Karstark) are mostly descended from the rune-making, nature religion First Men. ---
**Author:** ![sidhechaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e47c2d/32.png) [@sidhechaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sidhechaos)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/215 "2013-05-03T01:21:36Z")
> [@Kasper1014](#): > > The little princess who was locked in the tower, with what appears to be scales on her face…what do you think her story is going to be? Any relation to the Targaryans? The episode revealed that was stannis daughter (the fetii? in jars were stillborn sons.) if you read the books you’ll no more about the girl, since we can’t talk about the books here…can’t help you more than that ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/216 "2013-05-03T01:40:42Z")
> [@sidhechaos](#): > > if you read the books you’ll no more about the girl, since we can’t talk about the books here…can’t help you more than that If you can’t talk about it here, just don’t mention it at all, then. In these no spoiler threads, the books don’t exist, so just don’t even say “book.” ---
**Author:** ![sidhechaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e47c2d/32.png) [@sidhechaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sidhechaos)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/217 "2013-05-03T01:43:11Z")
> [@Just\_Ed](#): > > If Stannis was married to a Targaryen, wouldn’t you think Viserys and Dany would have known they not only had surviving kin, but _in the royal family_ back in Westeros? not to mention Roberts absolute desire to wipe every Targaryen, of the planet. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/218 "2013-05-03T01:44:41Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > > [@sidhechaos](#): > > > > if you read the books you’ll no more about the girl, since we can’t talk about the books here…can’t help you more than that > > If you can’t talk about it here, just don’t mention it at all, then. In these no spoiler threads, the books don’t exist, so just don’t even say “book.” Personally, I’d prefer it if those who have read the books just stayed out of these threads entirely. ---
**Author:** ![fubbleskag](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fubbleskag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fubbleskag)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/219 "2013-05-03T01:54:42Z")
book book book! ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/220 "2013-05-03T01:55:41Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Personally, I’d prefer it if those who have read the books just stayed out of these threads entirely. How about no, does no work for you? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979.md?page=12)