# Game of Thrones 3.05 "Kissed by Fire" 4/28/13 No spoilers **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 29, 2013, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979 "2013-04-29T02:37:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/81 "2013-04-30T00:04:36Z")
> [@Mogle](#): > > That doesn’t mean that there is an actual god behind it, it is possible that the religion was started by a magician or that the worshipers picked it up along the way. Just because Red Priests claim that their power comes from the Lord of Light doesn’t make it true, in particular when there are other magic users out there. > . I wasn’t really commenting about the validity of the various religious beliefs. Just joking. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/82 "2013-04-30T00:08:52Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > When Sandor tells Tyrion to fuck off during the battle of blackwater Tyrion specifically tells him “You can’t leave, you are Kingsguard”. [Here](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6aOZsJij2o), around 2:25. Jamie replaces Selmy as commander of the Kingsguard, but they would still be one member down since Jamie was already part of it. You’re right. He says so. However, I can’t remember a scene when the hound is appointed to the king’s guard. I’ll watch the episode again. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/83 "2013-04-30T00:26:45Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > You’re right. He says so. However, I can’t remember a scene when the hound is appointed to the king’s guard. I’ll watch the episode again. It doesn’t necessarily have to be the episode were Selmy gets fired, but it certainly happened at some point. ---
**Author:** ![Furious\_Marmot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dfb087/32.png) [@Furious\_Marmot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Furious_Marmot)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/84 "2013-04-30T01:17:53Z")
Didn’t he drape his white cloak over Sansa right after Joffrey had Ser Whathisname beat her? That would have been a Kingsguard’s cloak then, right? ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/85 "2013-04-30T02:07:27Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > The only person who picked his choice of a spouse so far is Robb, and it doesn’t look like it was the brightest move he did. Considering he was originally promised to the daughter of the one lord whose help he now needs again, I suspect not. > [@clairobscur](#): > > Also, it seems that being married to someone doesn’t exactly preclude having a love/sex affair on the side. We’ve seen numerous examples of that. In fact, nobody apart from Sansa seems to care much about whom they’re married to. Cercei seemed to have a lot of pent up resentment over her marriage to Robert. > [@clairobscur](#): > > The only one with a truly raw deal is Sansa (losing her new romantic dreams yet again), and even then, she probably would be better off with the Imp than with the other alternatives offered (marrying the gay knight or leaving with Littlefinger). Littlefinger might not be such a bad marriage, even though he’s much older. It’s not like Sansa has shown a lot of great judgment when it comes to men (psycho prince, lord Gaylord) ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/86 "2013-04-30T02:12:11Z")
I just read that it’s Tara Fitzgerald playing Stannis Baratheon’s wife. Wow, I didn’t recognize her. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/87 "2013-04-30T02:13:18Z")
I liked how Tywin’s reponse to Tyrions concerns that Sansa wouldn’t be happy with him was basically “why, were you planning on being a dick to her?”. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/88 "2013-04-30T02:45:19Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > I just read that it’s Tara Fitzgerald playing Stannis Baratheon’s wife. Wow, I didn’t recognize her. Wow, I didn’t realize it until you posted this. Never even occurred to me. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/89 "2013-04-30T02:56:15Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > I might be misremembering this but didn’t Selmy sit in the small council in season 1, contrary to what he told Jorah this episode? > [@SenorBeef](#): > > No, at least not in Ned’s first meeting of the small council in episode 3. It was Ned, Littlefinger, Renly, Pycelle, Varys. He might’ve shown up in a subsequent meeting but I’m pretty sure he didn’t. Selmy’s not on the council, but the question Jorah is clearly trying to suss out in their scene is whether Selmy knows Jorah is the source of the council’s information on Dany, specifically that she’s pregnant. If Selmy does know that, he can blow Mormont out of the water. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/90 "2013-04-30T03:12:40Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > If Selmy does know that, he can blow Mormont out of the water. Would he have a reason to do that, though? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/91 "2013-04-30T03:32:16Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Would he have a reason to do that, though? If he’s loyal to her, pointing out a spy seems like a pretty good move to me. ---
**Author:** ![gonzoron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a6a055/32.png) [@gonzoron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzoron)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/92 "2013-04-30T03:33:37Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Stannis is a Baratheon. Us TV-only viewers have absolutely no idea what family the mother comes from, it could very well be Targaryen as far as we know. Eagle-eyed TV-only viewers on another board have frame-by-framed the scenes in Season 1 where Ned reads the Big Boring Book of Westeros Geneology, and spotted a Targaryen a few generations back in the Baratheon Family tree. ---
**Author:** ![HazelNutCoffee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@HazelNutCoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HazelNutCoffee)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/93 "2013-04-30T04:12:02Z")
If he’s truly loyal to Danaerys, then it would make sense to tell her that her closest confidant sold her secrets to the enemy. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/94 "2013-04-30T04:42:28Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > …Cercei seemed to have a lot of pent up resentment over her marriage to Robert… That she does. On one hand Loras is very attractive and isn’t going to get drunk & try to force himself on her. On the other hand his orientation seems to be something of an open secret, which would make Cersei a laughingstock. And being Lady Cersei Tyrell is a big step down from being the Queen Mother & nominal Regent. It’s even more frustrating than her first marriage since in theory she outranks her father now, but he’s still treating like his property. And we still haven’t seen Tywin try to force Joffrey to do anything. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/95 "2013-04-30T06:18:06Z")
I think the wife of Stannis won the “Creepiest Mom in Westeros” title. Having your brother father your children mom and overly attached breast-feeding mom were blown out of the water by Mrs. “Keeps My Miscarried/Stillborn Fetuses in Jars” Baratheon. The locking her daughter up and ignoring her was just the icing on the Crazy Mom cake. ---
**Author:** ![Mogle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mogle/32/12021_2.png) [@Mogle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mogle)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/96 "2013-04-30T08:06:37Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > I wasn’t really commenting about the validity of the various religious beliefs. Just joking. Remember Poe’s Law? 🙂 My original comment was specifically about a question regarding the validity of worship of the Lord of Light and what it meant for Stannis’s destiny. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/97 "2013-04-30T08:48:46Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > Selmy[wasn’t] on the council, but the question Jorah is clearly trying to suss out in their scene is whether Selmy knows Jorah is the source of the council’s information on Dany, specifically that she[was] pregnant. If Selmy does know that, he can blow Mormont out of the water. > [@Acsenray](#): > > Would he have a reason to do that, though? He gave the reason in that scene. Selmy thinks Jorah’s reputation is too sullied (heh) in Westeros to sit on Dany’s advisory council once Dany takes the throne, implying rather strongly that Jorah should voluntarily decline any such position. After Jorah sussed out that Selmy didn’t sit on Robert’s council (so likely doesn’t know that Jorah was the traitor) he gave him the “You don’t give orders here” retort. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/98 "2013-04-30T09:05:01Z")
> [@Mogle](#): > > Remember Poe’s Law? 🙂 > My original comment was specifically about a question regarding the validity of worship of the Lord of Light and what it meant for Stannis’s destiny. Well, I won’t answer about that seriously since I’ve read the books. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/99 "2013-04-30T13:54:21Z")
For those also wondering about Stannis’s daughter, I can’t help but think of the title and make assumptions that Stannis offered her up in some sort of Lord-of-light power grab ceremony earlier either for military gains or to produce a male heir. It further begs the question how long Stannis’s family has been acolytes for the lord of light. The narrative made it seem like Stannis was a little pissed that he had to stay at home in the rock fortress instead of being promoted and living in the city as the Hand, but generally took it in stride. That means he sought out this magic solely for an heir and then when the opportunity presented itself Melissandre switched gears from heir-rearing to kingdom-conquering? My second question is why are the Tyrells so keen on Sansa marrying Loras? I don’t think they would object too strongly to Cersei marrying Loras. If anything Cersei marrying Loras only strengthens the Tyrell ties to the crown. Marrying Sansa will give the Tyrells the North but it seems like it would be a lateral move for the Tyrells though a huge coup for the Lannisters. The Tyrells would gain influence but have weaker ties to the throne. The Lannisters unify their fractured kingdom through political marriages. I don’t like how painfully naive Sansa is. She’s already been burned once at falling too quickly in love at the prospect of being in love. Now she’s head-over-heels again. She’s learned nothing in her 2 years of being at the center of political intrigue and it’s a wonder she’s still alive let alone making the same rookie mistakes. How she and Arya come from the same genetic makeup is a wonder. One definitely takes after Cat and the other Ned as far as judgement genes go. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2013, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979/100 "2013-04-30T14:39:45Z")
> [@pancakes3](#): > > ? > > My second question is why are the Tyrells so keen on Sansa marrying Loras? I don’t think they would object too strongly to Cersei marrying Loras. If anything Cersei marrying Loras only strengthens the Tyrell ties to the crown. Marrying Sansa will give the Tyrells the North but it seems like it would be a lateral move for the Tyrells though a huge coup for the Lannisters. The Tyrells would gain influence but have weaker ties to the throne. The Lannisters unify their fractured kingdom through political marriages. Since the Tyrells are going to be married to the King himself, it would seem to be relatively much less important that their heir be married to Cersei. (Assuming he is the heir–he is isn’t he? If not it’s even less important.) But don’t mind me–I’ve never wrapped my mind around exactly what these “ties” consist in really. So one of our kids married one of your kids–what does that mean in practical terms? Just the same as in any family? (We care about your family because our daughter’s/son’s welfare is tied up with your welfare?) Or is there something more straightforwardly political to it? Iunno. Like, why should the Tyrell’s think it’s any big whoop to have Cersei married to Loras? This is why I’m terrible at Crusader Kings. 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-05-kissed-by-fire-4-28-13-no-spoilers/656979.md?page=6)