# Game of Thrones 3.09 "The Rains of Castamere" 6/2/13 No book spoilers **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 2, 2013, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972 "2013-06-02T20:55:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/381 "2013-06-05T19:18:14Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > (Kat murdering the innocent Mrs. Frey as her last act on earth was a total dick move) Eh. She did give her word. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/382 "2013-06-05T19:22:21Z")
I’m not sure why was Robb was attacked for not stopping Cat from killing the young wife. He wasn’t in a position to do so. Beyond that, people need to remember that people in Westeros had different ideas asto who is and isn’t a child. Margery Tyrell and Robb for instance were both 14. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/383 "2013-06-05T19:38:39Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > . > > Does Grey Worm understand the common tongue? He acts as if he does -. I hadn’t paid attention to that. The simplest explanation would be that he does understand it, but Dany wanted him to give his opinion but didn’t want Daario to understand. By the way, I know they don’t have a sufficient budget (and also maybe not enough time) but this what really cheap (“we’re back, we took it”). At least they could have shown some street fights, or the slave revolting, or the city’s lords being overwhelmed, etc… After making a big deal about that for two épisodes, WTF??? Imagine them doing the same thing with the red marriage. “Oh! And by the way, we had them killed during the marriage”. > [@Lemur866](#): > > Speaking as someone who [read the fucking books](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CLCOvZOh1o): :smack: :rolleyes: Note : this is a safe link (besides being fun). No spoilers (In the video. Comments probably aren’t safe). Listening to it might remind you of a certain poster… ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/384 "2013-06-05T19:40:36Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > In the books, it has been discovered who was responsible. I suspect we’ll learn next season. Why is “the books don’t exist” such a difficult concept to grasp? Not cool. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/385 "2013-06-05T19:42:54Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Not “possibly”, Cersei and Jamies incest getting out would have got both their heads and their childrens heads immediately chopped off. **I don’t think either killing is right but they are completely different situations.** Right, different situations. Cat’s son just died in front of her, she had a few arrows sticking out of her and was dying herself “arrrggggghhhcrazygriedmadnessangermustkillsomething!” was about all that was going through her head. Not “Oh well, we’re fucked. May as well let this sweet innocent girl go free since killing her now isn’t logical and continuing to have sex with that disgusting man is punishment enough for her.” I don’t think you can expect logical thought from someone in Cat’s situation, death was happening right then and there. She didn’t have time to think about it like Jamie did. Also, I think the creative decision to have Cat lash out like that punctuated the brutally and hopelessness of the whole situation. I don’t think Cat was ever meant to be a likable character but I think we were supposed to understand that her children were everything to her. Everything. Once they were gone nothing else mattered to her. She killed the girl because she just didn’t care anymore about anything. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/386 "2013-06-05T19:44:08Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > I’m not sure why was Robb was attacked for not stopping Cat from killing the young wife. > > He wasn’t in a position to do so. He could’ve asked her not to kill the wife. But he showed zero concern about her. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/387 "2013-06-05T19:46:17Z")
> [@Wile\_E](#): > > Right, different situations. > > Cat’s son just died in front of her, she had a few arrows sticking out of her and was dying herself “arrrggggghhhcrazygriedmadnessangermustkillsomething!” was about all that was going through her head. Not “Oh well, we’re fucked. May as well let this sweet innocent girl go free since killing her now isn’t logical and continuing to have sex with that disgusting man is punishment enough for her.” > > I don’t think you can expect logical thought from someone in Cat’s situation, death was happening right then and there. She didn’t have time to think about it like Jamie did. > > Also, I think the creative decision to have Cat lash out like that punctuated the brutally and hopelessness of the whole situation. I don’t think Cat was ever meant to be a likable character but I think we were supposed to understand that her children were everything to her. Everything. Once they were gone nothing else mattered to her. She killed the girl because she just didn’t care anymore about anything. At the same time Cat would’ve happily thrown Tomnen out of a window if it meant the lives of her children also. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/388 "2013-06-05T19:52:05Z")
> [@mr.jp](#): > > He could’ve asked her not to kill the wife. But he showed zero concern about her. C’mon. The guy’s wife and unborn child had just been slaughtered, he had arrows sticking out of him. I’d have to rewatch but I think all he had time to say is “mother” before Bolton stuck a dagger through his ribcage. It’s not like he was really able to do much to help the girl. Again, I was never much of a fan of Robb, except he’s nice to look at, and I never liked Cat much either, but you seem to be expecting a lot of morality and logic from people being brutally murdered. I don’t think that happens even in reality, let alone fiction. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/389 "2013-06-05T19:53:59Z")
**Ibn Warraq** , please don’t mention things about the books. We’ve had enough heads explode for one week. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/390 "2013-06-05T20:03:20Z")
> [@Wile\_E](#): > > C’mon. The guy’s wife and unborn child had just been slaughtered, he had arrows sticking out of him. I’d have to rewatch but I think all he had time to say is “mother” before Bolton stuck a dagger through his ribcage. It’s not like he was really able to do much to help the girl. > > Again, I was never much of a fan of Robb, except he’s nice to look at, and I never liked Cat much either, but you seem to be expecting a lot of morality and logic from people being brutally murdered. I don’t think that happens even in reality, let alone fiction. Fair enough. My problem isnt so much that he didnt do anything, as that I think he doesnt care. Its just some kid he doesnt know, being killed to help his family, same as Jaime / Cersei viewed the killing of Bran. If he really does care, here was a chance to show it, and that didnt happen. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/391 "2013-06-05T20:06:00Z")
That’s silly, Robb was riddled with arrows and pretty out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/392 "2013-06-05T20:16:49Z")
His pregnant wife had just been murdered in front of him (along with many family and friends) and you think he should have been thinking about this woman whom he doesn’t know? Even if he wasn’t bleeding to death from arrows, he was in emotional shock. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/393 "2013-06-05T20:20:52Z")
No, I dont think so. I did say “fair enough”. But I dont think he wouldve cared about the bride even if his wife hadnt just died, and he wasnt hit with arrows. I think that if the bride could be used as a token in an attempt to help save his family, he would do this, or let it happen. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/394 "2013-06-05T20:24:17Z")
BTW, does anyone think Cat had any chance of killing Walder Frey (who really did deserve it)? (And was his child bride the one crawling around under his table? ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/395 "2013-06-05T20:26:04Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > BTW, does anyone think Cat had any chance of killing Walder Frey (who really did deserve it)? (And was his child bride the one crawling around under his table? No- the crossbowmen would have taken her down if Bolton hadn’t bolted to her first- and Yes, that was the unfortunate Lady Frey. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/396 "2013-06-05T20:32:18Z")
> [@mr.jp](#): > > He could’ve asked her not to kill the wife. But he showed zero concern about her. Have you noticed he was dying, had his wife (and unborn child) killed brutally before his eyes minutes ago, etc..? I’m baffled by posters expecting well thought, honorable and sensible reactions by people in such a situation. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/397 "2013-06-05T20:38:32Z")
He’s just being contrary. The world might be grey, but that anyone could think the Lannisters haven’t shown themselves to be a much darker shade than the Starks is ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/398 "2013-06-05T20:39:51Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > BTW, does anyone think Cat had any chance of killing Walder Frey (who really did deserve it)? (And was his child bride the one crawling around under his table? If she was really good at throwing a knife maybe, but she would’ve been easily cut down if she tried to get to him. Robb on the other hand should’ve rushed him the second The Rains of Castamere started playing and the doors got locked, but only Cat was paying attention. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/399 "2013-06-05T20:48:28Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > We didnt NEED to see things like that from the Starks because I think most of us assume that they already were a more engaged and we’ll say ‘benevolent’ ruling family based on their reputation. That’s my point. We are judging the Stark clan based on their reputation, but I think that their reputation is not deserved, and that we should instead judge them on the actions we actually see. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2013, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972/400 "2013-06-05T21:05:11Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Have you noticed he was dying, had his wife (and unborn child) killed brutally before his eyes minutes ago, etc..? > > I’m baffled by posters expecting well thought, honorable and sensible reactions by people in such a situation. I have noticed that, and I didn’t expect that. I also didn’t expect a captured Jaime, weak after months of captivity, going out of his way to help Brienne, and thinking of a clever way to do this. But he did. I have seen no such act of compassion from the Starks. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-3-09-the-rains-of-castamere-6-2-13-no-book-spoilers/659972.md?page=21)