# Game of Thrones 4.09 "The Watchers on the Wall" 6/8/14 \[no spoilers\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 8, 2014, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348 "2014-06-08T20:28:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![LouisMasure](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e9a140/32.png) [@LouisMasure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisMasure)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/21 "2014-06-09T05:17:40Z")
Now that John is apparently in charge, he could freeze the tunnel as he wanted to, and that would seriously complicate the mater for the wildlings, as most of his camp probably isn’t fit to climb the wall (children, old people etc). I think this is why they are attacking Castle Black in the first place, otherwise they could all climb the wall along the hundreds of miles of the wall completely undetected. But anyway, the episode wasn’t bad, but all I could think was: “WTF is happening in King’s Landing !? They can’t possibly do a full hour at the wall ?!” but they did … ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4bbf92/32.png) [@Charlie\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/22 "2014-06-09T05:18:40Z")
They can only have a few of those pendulums and can only position them in a few places. So, if this happened in a realistic situation, … Well, I guess it’s silly to pursue that line of thought. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4bbf92/32.png) [@Charlie\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/23 "2014-06-09T05:20:39Z")
> [@Rachellelogram](#): > > What a boring episode. And it was all shot in shitty darkness. A kingdom for a sunbeam! > > I just \*really \*do not care about anything wall-related on this show. Not one of the characters (except maybe Jon Snow) has a modicum of depth. Bravo! I second that. You are right on! ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/24 "2014-06-09T05:21:19Z")
I can just imagine the nerdrage (that I would share) if during this episode Tyrion’s death sentence had been carried out off camera, and next week there’s only a couple brief scenes in King’s Landing at the end of which it’s mentioned in passing that Tyrion’s dead. Then the bulk of the episode is Dany doing paperwork. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/25 "2014-06-09T05:28:03Z")
At least it was also an episode without Dragongirl and her 8,000 Strong NoNut Chorus. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/26 "2014-06-09T06:05:14Z")
> [@LouisMasure](#): > > Now that John is apparently in charge, he could freeze the tunnel as he wanted to I assume that it takes a while to freeze the tunnels solid, there might not be time any more. I agree it was a bit weird in terms of season-length tempo to have an entire episode devoted to just one battle, and just to one day of one battle, but the battle action was so compelling that I basically didn’t notice. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/27 "2014-06-09T06:12:33Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > They had some warning that Mance’s army was coming, so why didn’t they send ravens to King’s Landing and the other castles requesting backup? The north has been gutted, as they would have been the first to reinforce in the event of an attack, by the war and I dont think Bolton was interested in hearing about fairy tales of giants and stuff. I think in the opening episode in season one, they said it took 4 months to go from KL to WF, so I cant see them having troops to spare , even if Tywin wanted to. Declan ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/28 "2014-06-09T08:57:19Z")
You know thinking on it this whole battle was a giant waste of time. What do the wildlings want? Unless I’m forgetting shit I think it was to get away from the white walkers, that is it. Seems they could work out something, and gain the giants too. The Then tribe will probably not work out, couldn’t he get Mance to turn on those cannibals? Also the battle went on so long it looked silly, like everyone was running around playing sword fighting. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/29 "2014-06-09T11:25:59Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > Which reminds me: Just as a shotgun blast to the chest is not going to send you flying through a plate glass window, an arrow, even if fired by a giant, is not going to send you flying dozens of feet through the air. So which is less believable: an arrow lifting someone off the ground, or the fact **it was fired by a giant?** :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/30 "2014-06-09T11:28:34Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > I have a logistical question regarding this siege. The wildlings made a fire bigger than anyone in the north has ever seen. And they’re attacking a wall made of ice. > > So, um, yeah…maybe build a bonfire at the base of the wall and melt it? It’s hundreds of miles long, as msmith points out. How hard could it be to stockpile a ton of wood in, say, 5 different locations 10 miles apart and light them all? > > Keeping in mind that this is a siege. Sieges could easily take months. Plenty of time to burn a sizable tunnel in a wall made of ice. They want the wall intact so they can use it against to stop the White Walkers. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/31 "2014-06-09T11:31:05Z")
> [@grude](#): > > What do the wildlings want? Unless I’m forgetting shit I think it was to get away from the white walkers, that is it. Seems they could work out something, and gain the giants too. I think that is what Jon went to see Mance Rayder about. ---
**Author:** ![Garula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ea666f/32.png) [@Garula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Garula)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/32 "2014-06-09T11:33:44Z")
I’m having difficulty making logistical and strategic sense of the wall. Couldn’t Mance just build some boats and go around it? Probably not a fun voyage, but a helluva lot safer than a frontal assault on the single most defensible point on the continent. Or, if the sea is too far, wouldn’t it make sense to saunter off a few miles away from Castle Black and attempt to climb it there, where there aren’t many Crows waiting? After establishing a base at the top of the wall, it should be possible to toss ropes down and bring a lot of the army over that way. I get that Mance thought there were far, far more Crows stationed along the wall, but Ygritte’s advance party must have figured out how few people there were, right? And they have a warg, so shouldn’t it be a simple matter of tying a message to a bird and sending a letter to Mance letting him know the actual castle strength? I dunno, the whole situation really just doesn’t make much sense to me. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/33 "2014-06-09T11:51:07Z")
What was the point of that giant fire anyway? It wasn’t to signal the small party over the wall, they had the warg for that. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/34 "2014-06-09T11:55:09Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > There was a very cool long tracking shot when Jon gets off the lift to join the battle at the castle (after Sam went up the Wall to get him). That was a good shot! It reminded me of the shot in The Avengers when it panned from Hero to Hero fighting in New York. Re: The White Walkers. Early on I was expecting the battle to end because the White Walkers arrived to mow down the Wildlings. The crows would be like, “Yay!” until they now realize they have an army of White Walkers to contend with. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_Prize](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sir\_Prize](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_Prize)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/35 "2014-06-09T12:03:35Z")
Why were the wildings climbing the wall at the gate to castle Black when there are miles of wall that could be climbed without archers looking down at you? Just go down a few miles. Climb there and then attack. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/36 "2014-06-09T12:09:14Z")
> [@Sir\_Prize](#): > > Why were the wildings climbing the wall at the gate to castle Black when there are miles of wall that could be climbed without archers looking down at you? Just go down a few miles. Climb there and then attack. No gate, I presume. They could probably climb over anywhere, but remember that this is nearly a whole civilization – horses, mammoths, giants (presumably), and children are not going to be able to climb the wall. They need to open the gate to let through those who can’t climb, which may be half their numbers. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/37 "2014-06-09T12:18:38Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > That was a good shot! It reminded me of the shot in The Avengers when it panned from Hero to Hero fighting in New York. > Re: The White Walkers. Early on I was expecting the battle to end because the White Walkers arrived to mow down the Wildlings. The crows would be like, “Yay!” until they now realize they have an army of White Walkers to contend with. I actually thought this was going to happen when they blew the horn three times, I thought right when the battle was going to start the walkers had showed up again. ---
**Author:** ![Mekhazzio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b38774/32.png) [@Mekhazzio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mekhazzio)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/38 "2014-06-09T12:26:45Z")
Chalk me up as another one disappointed with the episode. Cool battle and all, but for the most part, the status quo is maintained and all the other story threads got put on pause for it. > [@grude](#): > > What was the point of that giant fire anyway?. To secure their rear against zombie attacks for the duration of the siege? > [@LawMonkey](#): > > Which reminds me: Just as a shotgun blast to the chest is not going to send you flying through a plate glass window, an arrow, even if fired by a giant, is not going to send you flying dozens of feet through the air. Well, a shotgun blast doesn’t send a human flying because the shooter is of equivalent mass. Equal and opposite reaction and all that, the shooter of such a weapon would necessarily be sent flying too, so that’s not deemed practical. It’s rather more practical when your shooter has the mass of a construction vehicle. That said, I’d still be expecting a messy punch-through, rather than entire-man-flying. ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/39 "2014-06-09T13:11:35Z")
The strategic value of the wall is compromised by there being a tunnel through it. Snow was right to want to close it off. Now he’s in charge and, still, he leaves it open? Decides to go on a suicide mission to maybe strike a deal with the Wildings? Plug the hole first, then negotiate, I say. And, again, how do you f-ing feed 100000 men and their entourage? Do they eat trees? Does anything else grow up North? Dried fish, I suppose, but a siege for the wall would be harder on the Wildings than the Watch, I’d say. It has to be an attack that succeeds quickly, or nothing. Wasn’t there a scene in the previous show where the father showed his son the extent of his potentially fertile kingdom? Like the vikings, let them settle there and become farmers! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348/40 "2014-06-09T13:25:47Z")
Elves or no elves, I always enjoy the Battle of Helm’s Deep. It was actually nice to follow just one story line for a change. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-4-09-the-watchers-on-the-wall-6-8-14-no-spoilers/690348.md?page=3)