# Game of Thrones 5.01 "The Wars to Come" 4/12/15 \[Show discussion\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 12, 2015, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486 "2015-04-12T14:37:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![theR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@theR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theR)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/201 "2015-04-17T01:37:09Z")
> [@theR](#): > > Wargs, including at least the Stark children and some Wildlings, can enter the minds of and control animals. We’ve seen Bran enter his wolf’s and Hodor’s minds, plus the Wildling that controlled the hawk. Jon and Rob clearly have/had some measure of understanding with their wolves even if they didn’t explicitly “warg” into the wolves’ minds. > > It seems like some fairly blatant foreshadowing about the possibility of controlling or at least communicating with dragons instead of traditional animal training, particularly when they’re having so much trouble with the dragons right now. > > It’s possible Dany is a warg or otherwise has some magical connection but just doesn’t really know it yet. It’s also possible she’ll eventually get the help of others to magically control the dragons. > > It could also just be misdirection since it’s so obvious. Sorry, I guess the wildling controlled an eagle not a hawk. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/202 "2015-04-17T02:17:56Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > She’s right too, it ain’t what you know it’s what you can prove. And didn’t Joffrey put a death penalty on gaying at some point? No, that was something he promised Margaery he’d do when she was pretending be hurt and confused her first husband not liking women; there’s no evidence he actually did so. I for one greatly enjoyed the scene with Loras and Olyvar; the latter’s caressing birthmarks on his lover’s body was particularly erotic. It’s about time Finn Jones finally showed some skin. It’s almost a shame Olyvar is just seducing him at Littlefinger’s bidding. > [@Gothic](#): > > …Robin’s weakness seemed less realistic to me because he is a young boy in a castle with lots of stairs. Was he locked in his room for twenty hours a day, or just lactose intolerant? Knowing Lysa she probably assigned servants to carry him around the castle. She sure as hell didn’t allow him to even tough a sword let alone train for combat. > [@DigitalC](#): > > Well he sure didn’t go easy on him. > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I think the basic problem for Daenerys that her family hasn’t had dragons in many generations, so no one is alive with first-hand knowledge of how to work with and train them. The family ruled for so long that I’ll bet any written books on dragon training are probably still at King’s Landing. Bingo; dragons have been extinct for a at least a century, and even before that they kept getting smaller and more deformed with each generation. The last one only grew to be the size of a dog. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/203 "2015-04-17T07:32:11Z")
It seems to me that Daenerys does have some instinctual or intuitive connection to the dragons. As the finale of season 1 showed, Daenerys seems to have expected that she would survive the funeral pyre unscathed, and that the intense heat would cause the dormant dragon eggs to hatch. We saw her in earlier episodes experimenting with the eggs and a fire, and not suffering burns from handling the hot eggs. Did she intuit it? Certainly looks that way, as it was stated a couple of times by various characters that the secrets of dragon husbandry were lost. Even if the Targaryen dragon training manual still existed somewhere, it’d be in King’s Landing; Dany wouldn’t have it because she and her brother were child refugees who fled with whatever their retainers could carry. So, Dany knows more than anyone alive, probably, how to wrangle dragons, because the “part-dragon” Targaryen thing is strong in her. She’s a throwback to her dragon riding ancestors. So, I expect that she will, in time, start to figure out how to make her dragons do her bidding. At which point, her enemies are toast. Literally. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/204 "2015-04-17T08:14:24Z")
RE: the dragon thing, I just hope this isn’t leading up to one multiple season case of blue balls. Yeah, yeah, characters, themes, arcs, whatever, if you’re gonna tease dragon power this long there better be a payoff. I expect to see hundreds of dudes getting roasted in a hopeless charge, or a town wrecked, or hell if warging can work on dragons then bring on a dragon on dragon fight. But I kinda doubt the show has the budget for something like that, at least not without a lot of cutaway shots, so I try not to get too excited. Then again, the Blackwater Bay battle was pretty sexy, so I’m cautiously optimistic. I just hope it doesn’t end with something lame like “lol we poisoned your dragons before the big battle you dun got fooled.” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/205 "2015-04-17T22:11:50Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I don’t know which one is the case, which is why I posed it as a question. You have posed a interesting question, my friend. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/206 "2015-04-17T22:56:48Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > > > I think the basic problem for Daenerys that her family hasn’t had dragons in many generations, so no one is alive with first-hand knowledge of how to work with and train them. The family ruled for so long that I’ll bet any written books on dragon training are probably still at King’s Landing. > > Bingo; dragons have been extinct for a at least a century, and even before that they kept getting smaller and more deformed with each generation. The last one only grew to be the size of a dog. There was a scene in the first Jurassic Park movie, in which the characters were wondering why the velociraptors were behaving in an unexpected way. As I remember, the character played by Sam Neill explained that the young velociraptors grew up without the benefit of parents or older of their species (since they’d been cloned and were a long-extinct species), so they didn’t know how to behave. Similarly, Daenerys’ dragons are growing up without anyone to guide or teach them. The dragons of centuries ago probably had older dragons from whom to learn behavior. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/207 "2015-04-17T23:49:49Z")
I’m gonna go with the Targaryens who controlled dragons being wargs, it makes too much sense and animal control is something they’ve already firmly established in the show. ---
**Author:** ![Emiliana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@Emiliana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emiliana)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2015, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/208 "2015-04-18T18:59:06Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > It seems to me that Daenerys does have some instinctual or intuitive connection to the dragons. > > As the finale of season 1 showed, Daenerys seems to have expected that she would survive the funeral pyre unscathed, and that the intense heat would cause the dormant dragon eggs to hatch. We saw her in earlier episodes experimenting with the eggs and a fire, and not suffering burns from handling the hot eggs. I had forgotten that she had experimented previously with the eggs and fire. So the funeral pyre scene took me by surprise and I wondered how she could have possibly known to do what she did. Do we know if wargs can enter and control any animal? Or is Jon Snow, assuming he’s a warg, limited to wolves or perhaps his own wolf. Bran could clearly enter the minds of his wolf and Hodor, but he’s unusual in many ways, as of course is Hodor. Hodor. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2015, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/209 "2015-04-18T21:24:05Z")
Hodor? ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486/210 "2015-04-18T22:40:32Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Hodor? Hodor! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-01-the-wars-to-come-4-12-15-show-discussion/717486.md?page=10)