# Game of Thrones 5.03 "High Sparrow" 4/26/15 \[Show Discussion\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 26, 2015, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583 "2015-04-26T17:06:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/61 "2015-04-27T20:37:38Z")
Littlefinger knows Arya is alive. He spotted her working for Tywin. ---
**Author:** ![Reepicheep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ed655f/32.png) [@Reepicheep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reepicheep)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/62 "2015-04-27T21:06:09Z")
So why is Littlefinger pointing out there are other living Stark heirs, what is in it for him? If there are other, known to the Bolton and other Stark bannermen, living Stark children that lessens Sansa’s value as the only gateway to legitimately holding the North. While Littlefinger may not love Sansa as he loved Cat he still protects her (partially because he has the hots for her and partially because she is Cat’s daughter), so he would not do something that would put her in danger that he didn’t believe she could get out of herself. He will not be around to actively protect her, since he will be back at the Vale. I don’t see why he pointed it out to the Boltons, even if he and Sansa know Arya is alive. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/63 "2015-04-27T21:24:33Z")
Arya’s fate is unknown. No one has specific reason to believe she’s dead. So Littlefinger isn’t breaking news. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/64 "2015-04-27T21:31:31Z")
Didn’t Brienne tell Sansa that Arya was alive? ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/65 "2015-04-27T22:21:27Z")
Perhaps Littlefinger did love Catelyn at some point in the past, but we now know that he’s been scheming for power since prior to King Robert’s visit to Winterfell in show 1.1. I think it’s more probable that he discovered that the princes and princess were products of incest and then indirectly supplied Arryn with the vital info after which Jon began his investigation. He then killed Jon knowing that the Lannisters would be the obvious suspects. He also had Lysa inform Catelyn that the Lannisters were behind Jon’s death (strategically after Ned had departed for King’s Landing). I can’t remember what initially made Ned look through the Baratheon family book to figure out the Lannister incest, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Littlefinger played a part in that. He knew that Lysa’s note would get Catelyn to King’s Landing to personally warn her husband. Remember that Littlefinger is the one who put the knife to Ned’s throat saying: “I told you not to trust me.” At this point, I think that Littlefinger was ready to pounce on Catelyn as a way to get power of the North, but since she rejected him he had to move on to the next plan. The point I’m getting to is that I don’t think that anyone, including Cat or Sansa, were any more than pawns in his ultimate goal. Perhaps Cat’s initial rejection of Littlefinger in their youth led to his becoming the power hungry person that we all know and love (to hate). ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/66 "2015-04-27T22:43:53Z")
> [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](#): > > He then killed Jon knowing that the Lannisters would be the obvious suspects. He also had Lysa inform Catelyn that the Lannisters were behind Jon’s death (strategically after Ned had departed for King’s Landing). This happened when Ned was in Winterfell. [https://youtu.be/-XUIlY4V0Fw?t=3m45s](https://youtu.be/-XUIlY4V0Fw?t=3m45s) ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/67 "2015-04-27T22:55:59Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Why would Jorah take him to Dany? He is under sentence of death if he returns to Mereen. He’s also under sentence of death if he returns to Westeros. He’s deeply in love with Daenerys, and is certain that he just needs to right angle to win her back over. The brother of the man who killed her father (and served on the small council that sent assassins after her) is a pretty good place to start, in his mind. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/68 "2015-04-27T23:03:47Z")
> [@JSexton](#): > > He’s also under sentence of death if he returns to Westeros. He’s deeply in love with Daenerys, and is certain that he just needs to right angle to win her back over. The brother of the man who killed her father (and served on the small council that sent assassins after her) is a pretty good place to start, in his mind. Jorah doesn’t have a death sentence in Westeros. He was pardoned. ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2015, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/69 "2015-04-27T23:57:03Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > This happened when Ned was in Winterfell. [https://youtu.be/-XUIlY4V0Fw?t=3m45s](https://youtu.be/-XUIlY4V0Fw?t=3m45s) Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_Prize](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sir\_Prize](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_Prize)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/70 "2015-04-28T00:09:23Z")
> [@JSexton](#): > > Margaery IS the queen, and has the king wrapped around her finger. If she gets rid of Cersei, then Tommen names her to small council. Her father is already on it. Ditch Qyburn, pay off Pycell, and name a toady as Hand (Any of her father’s bannermen will do), and she’s got total control. I never got the impression wants to run the kingdom. She wants what she imagines are the benefits of being queen but I don’t think that includes running the small council. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_Prize](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sir\_Prize](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_Prize)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/71 "2015-04-28T00:10:24Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Littlefinger was in love with Cat, Sansa was just a reminder of her. Revenge on the Boltons is probably high on his bucket list. Why is revenge on the Boltons on Littlefinger’s bucket list? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/72 "2015-04-28T00:23:33Z")
> [@Sir\_Prize](#): > > Why is revenge on the Boltons on Littlefinger’s bucket list? They killed the only person he ever loved. I’m not sure that revenge on the Boltons is on his bucket list, but that would be the reason. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/73 "2015-04-28T02:05:20Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Is Gendry ever going to rejoin the plot? Last we saw, he was getting in a row boat pointed at King’s Landing… I’m sure he’ll show up again eventually. (I have no spoiler knowledge.) Who else is missing in action? Bran and Rickon, and their associates, obviously. We’ll see them again, obviously. Edmure Tully, presumably still hostage to Walder Frey. Blackfish Tully, uncle of Cat, Edmure, etc. Missing since the Red Wedding, but I fully expect him to show up sooner or later. Benjen Stark, Ned’s younger brother, Ranger of the Night’s Watch, unseen since season one. My theory is that he holds the secret of Jon Snow’s parentage, so I expect him to reappear when the plot requires him. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/74 "2015-04-28T02:15:40Z")
> [@SecretaryofEvil](#): > > It was, of course, a complete coincidence that Jorah just happened to be in a brothel that prominently featured a Daenerys lookalike. > > The whore mongering was cracking me up this episode. I laughed out loud at the Daenerys cosplaying prostitute’s sassy comeback of “because I’m magic.” The High Septon’s blasphemous antics were a nice touch,… I thought Whore-Daenerys was hilarious, especially the assless dress. I loved how bored Olyvar was with the whole show too. 😃 Does Loras realize he’s in charge of King’s Landings most prominent brothel yet, or does he still think he’s just a squire who moonlights. > [@LawMonkey](#): > > As always, part of the fun of these threads is seeing the creative misspellings of every character’s name. I just select “Add to dictionary” the first time I type and let auto-correct take care of the rest. > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Why would Jorah take him to Dany? He is under sentence of death if he returns to Mereen. He think’s Daenerys will be so pleased at his delivering Tyrion to her she’ll forgave his treason. > [@Sir\_Prize](#): > > I never got the impression wants to run the kingdom. She wants what she imagines are the benefits of being queen but I don’t think that includes running the small council. In House Tyrell the men are just for show and breeding purposes; the women run everything from behind the scenes. Maergery is just applying what everything her grandmother taught her, and it seems like Tommen is going to be particularly easy for her to manipulate. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![nate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nate/32/13085_2.png) [@nate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nate)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/75 "2015-04-28T02:30:17Z")
So why would Jorah kidnap Tyrion to bring him to Daneruas? What would she want with him? And he was going there anyway, no? ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/76 "2015-04-28T03:36:15Z")
Others have explained upthread why Jorah wants Tyrion. What I want to know is, how would Jorah of recognised Tyrion? They have never met on the show, Jorah was already in exile with the Dothraki at the start of season 1, and I get the impression he has already been there for some years. So if they did ever meet it was many years ago and Tyrion now has a beard. Yes he is a dwarf but they are not that uncommon. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/77 "2015-04-28T04:03:29Z")
The Lannisters and Mormonts are two of the most important families in Westeros, so it’s quite likely that they attended the same kinds of social and official events. They likely both spent much of their lives in Kings Landing. Tyrion himself is quite famous. There’s no need for the show to explain exactly how and when Jorah learned to recognize Tyrion. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/78 "2015-04-28T04:40:05Z")
Jorah could recognize Varys - he worked for him, although it’s unclear he ever met him - and then pieced together who the dwarf must be. He also may have listened - for all Varys cautioned him, Tyrion basically told that whore who he was. “Oh, I was just recently one of the richest men in the world… I always pay my debts” - FFS, I cringed at that. Why was it, by the way, that Tyrion couldn’t be with that whore? Was it heartbreak over Shae? A general inability to trust prostitutes after he got close to, and got burned by, two of them? Because that girl was a slave? Because his dick stopped working after the 400 gallons of alcohol he consumed on this trip? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/79 "2015-04-28T04:49:53Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > …One other thing I noticed was that Littlefinger referred to Sansa as “the eldest surviving Stark child” or something like that. “Eldest”, not “only”. Which may or may not mean anything, although it seems like most of the outside world should think that all the other Stark kids are dead… I wouldn’t read too much into it, but by saying “eldest” he keeps his options open if another confirmed Stark kid turns up; it might damage his credibility later if he had flatly said that no other Stark kids remained alive. Primogeniture, beauty and marriageability still make Sansa the most valuable of the bunch. > [@JSexton](#): > > To Jorah, there is only one queen, legally, morally, and romantically. However, Tyrion does not know that. So the ambiguity is for him, not us. He thinks Jorah means to return him to Cersei for a reward. Just what I thought, too. > [@Quimby](#): > > Littlefinger knows Arya is alive. He spotted her working for Tywin. I think that was left purposefully ambiguous. He saw Arya, certainly - but did he realize who she was, exactly? Maybe, maybe not. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2015, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583/80 "2015-04-28T05:07:33Z")
Also notable, the non-nudity of Margaery stood out to me, especially after the gratuitous non-nudity of Danerys a couple episodes ago. The show threw in random nudity a few scenes later in the brothel seen, but it seems gunshy about nudity from its regulars at this point. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-5-03-high-sparrow-4-26-15-show-discussion/718583.md?page=5)