# Game of Thrones 6.08 "No One" 6/12/16 \[Show Discussion\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 12, 2016, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226 "2016-06-12T23:36:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/341 "2016-06-15T23:44:46Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Incidentally, isn’t Drogon kind of a childish name for a dragon? > It’s like have a pet turtle called Myrtle or a Cocker Spaniel called Nathaniel. > [@Lobohan](#): > > It is convenient, but he’s named for Khal Drogo. > [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > Seems a bit convenient that Dany was married to Drogo, who dies and then from his death she gets a dragon in which to name Drogon. Don’t forget her other two dragons are named for her brothers: Rhaegal and Viserion (after Rhaegar and Viserys). She is queen of many things, but coming up with original dragon names is not one of them. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/342 "2016-06-15T23:53:27Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > The Blackfish’s death probably wasn’t shown for reasons of expediency. He wasn’t a MAJOR character, so no need for a big death scene. It was also less important to show his death, (which was obvious as soon as he said he was going out fighting) and more important to show Jaime’s reaction to his death. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/343 "2016-06-16T00:04:56Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The only people who are immune to that on GoT are characters who the plot requires not to die just yet. (So far that group contains exclusively Arya.) Everyone else who receives an abdominal wound is usually dead within minutes, and at most hours. I don’t doubt she survived because of the needs of the plot. I simply take issue with the outright ignorance presented here about how being stabbed in the gut is always deadly. It’s not like getting stabbed in your liver. Roose got stabbed upwards, with a long knife, into his vital organs. Arya got stabbed in the meat above her intestines. In the real world, people get stabbed there and don’t open their intestines. Blades are slow enough that they squish out of the way. Now if the Waif pulled the blade up tearing a bunch of meat, or used a sword and sawed a bit out the outstroke, or was a boar and disemboweled Arya, sure. The disbelief that she’d be alive is based on ignorance and I’m just poking at that, I cited it above. It seems way more likely to me that the Hound would be dead with his thighbone sticking out of his leg. But no one is concerned about that. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/344 "2016-06-16T00:06:52Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Don’t forget her other two dragons are named for her brothers: Rhaegal and Viserion (after Rhaegar and Viserys). She is queen of many things, but coming up with original dragon names is not one of them. “Face-Melter! McBurny! Scaldalator! Come to mommy, dinner time!” ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/345 "2016-06-16T00:19:10Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > The disbelief that she’d be alive is based on ignorance and I’m just poking at that, I cited it above. No, it’s based on the fact that every other time we’ve seen such a wound in the show it’s been fatal. (And please, don’t tell me it’s because Roose got stabbed in the upper frabjabulator, which is always fatal, while Arya was stabbed in the lower ileodoudenum, which has a 15% survival rate.:)) It’s just another instance of crappy writing, of which there are many other examples. And as I’ve said before, when you have to spend so much time and effort explaining inconsistencies and stupidities, that itself is an indication that the writing is crap. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/346 "2016-06-16T00:37:00Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > And as I’ve said before, when you have to spend so much time and effort explaining inconsistencies and stupidities, that itself is an indication that the writing is crap. Nah, it’s mostly directing that’s the problem in this case. I doubt the script wrote that she would specifically be stabbed twice in the abdomen with a however-many-inches blade going in to the hilt. It probably just said something like “she’s attacked with a knife and wounded”. I’m so sick of the “bad writing!” cliche that gets constantly slung around here. Especially when it’s probably not even the writing that’s the cause for complaint. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/347 "2016-06-16T00:42:09Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > I don’t think the lowborn would have any recourse to the law if wronged by a noble, more likely they have to suck it up and if they take it upon themselves to dispense justice are executed or send to The Wall. Well in theory they can petition a higher ranking lord (all the way up to the King) for justice, which useless in practice unless the highborn person was already on their feudal superior’s shit list. ---
**Author:** ![Mekhazzio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b38774/32.png) [@Mekhazzio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mekhazzio)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/348 "2016-06-16T00:58:07Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > (And please, don’t tell me it’s because Roose got stabbed in the upper frabjabulator, which is always fatal, while Arya was stabbed in the lower ileodoudenum, which has a 15% survival rate.:)) Yeah guys, jeez, get out of here with your medical jargon and studies and crap. Cardiac muscle, skeletal muscle, whatever, the important thing is that it’s a stab. You can’t expect a viewer to know anything about the meat sack they’re living in. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/349 "2016-06-16T01:09:29Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Any other system was “pay to win” also, and probably less expensive for a noble anyway. In a trail by jury the noble would hire a lawyer and the poor person wouldn’t be able to afford one. He’d be screwed anyway. As far back as that, hired lawyers weren’t all that important. The key thing was that if there even was a concept of a jury trial, not everyone would be entitled to it. And the kind of people considered to be qualified to serve on a jury would be the kind that would be sympathetic to highborn people anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/350 "2016-06-16T01:54:22Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > No, it’s based on the fact that every other time we’ve seen such a wound in the show it’s been fatal. (And please, don’t tell me it’s because Roose got stabbed in the upper frabjabulator, which is always fatal, while Arya was stabbed in the lower ileodoudenum, which has a 15% survival rate.:)) It’s just another instance of crappy writing, of which there are many other examples. Take it up with reality, If your argument is that the show doesn’t comport with your decision that all stab wounds to the abdomen must be fatal, I’ll agree. If you are arguing that every stab wound is exactly the same in terms of mortality, I’m gonna feel compelled to point out that you’re being silly. > [@](#): > > And as I’ve said before, when you have to spend so much time and effort explaining inconsistencies and stupidities, that itself is an indication that the writing is crap. Again, you’re saying the writing is crap based on rules that you’re making up. That all belly wounds are fatal. That’s not accurate criticism. Was this the best episode? No. Was it as stupid as people who think that all abdomen wounds are insta-death think it is? No. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/351 "2016-06-16T02:58:33Z")
The show never established either explicitly or implicitly that abdominal stab wounds are always fatal. The ones that were fatal happened to be fatal wounds. The ones that weren’t happened not to be. Storytelling doesn’t accidentally establish in-world rules of nature. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/352 "2016-06-16T03:38:31Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > As far back as that, hired lawyers weren’t all that important. Don’t tell Cicero that. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/353 "2016-06-16T04:08:54Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Was it as stupid as people who think that all abdomen wounds are insta-death think it is? No. Straw man. Nobody said all abdominal wounds are fatal, and I didn’t even claim that driving a long blade in to the hilt twice, and then twisting it, would be instantly fatal (although even your alleged six-inch blade at that position and angle could have easily severed her spinal cord). But I did say that running and jumping the way she did a few hours (or even a few days) later was ridiculous. And I wouldn’t throw “stupid” around when you keep saying that intestines somehow dodge knife blades driven as fast as in that attack, and when the link you posted as authoritative is so full of caveats as to be useless: - it didn’t count knife wounds that were instantly fatal, or even those where the victim died before reaching the hospital. That alone disqualifies it as a basis for your argument. - it DID count accidental and self-inflicted wounds. Accidental stabbings are not likely to be vicious or deep, and it’s well-known that many suicide attempts are pathetic cries for attention rather than serious efforts to end life. Not that I hang around morgues, but I’ve never heard of anyone outside of Japan who seriously tried to take his life by stabbing himself in the abdomen. - it said that the sample size for butcher knives, the only knife in the study comparable to what the Waif used, was too small to be meaningful – a little over one per year. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/354 "2016-06-16T04:20:26Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Nah, it’s mostly directing that’s the problem in this case. I doubt the script wrote that she would specifically be stabbed twice in the abdomen with a however-many-inches blade going in to the hilt. It probably just said something like “she’s attacked with a knife and wounded”. > > I’m so sick of the “bad writing!” cliche that gets constantly slung around here. Especially when it’s probably not even the writing that’s the cause for complaint. The showrunners are on the set, they’re involved in the editing booth, they’ve got final approval on anything. Is it maybe bad directing/bad producing/bad editing/bad overall supervision at fault instead of writing? Maybe. Okay, what did you win? It was clearly a failure of storytelling. > [@Lobohan](#): > > She is specifically shown getting a very survivable wound. What? No, she’s certainly not. She’s shown getting a deep 7"+ stab in the gut with a knife twist. If they wanted to specifically show her getting a surivable wound, they could’ve allowed her to escape after some superficial slashes, or they could’ve shown the knife bouncing off a coin purse, or anything at all meant to show that the wound isn’t as bad as getting stabbed deeply in the abdomen. She’s specifically shown to have a very terrible wound that we expect to kill her, shown bleeding profusely, shown walking around a town where no one cared, and gave every indication that she’s dying **because that’s the impression they wanted to give** in order to create a cliffhanger. Having them say “Arya couldn’t possibly survive a situation this bad, with a wound this bad, right? Tune in next week” is right out of a terrible, cliched show from the 50s. But that’s certainly the effect they meant to convey when they ended up a cliffhanger like that. They did nothing at all to give the impression that the wound was survivable. The funny thing is here is that you people defending the show to the death are actually doing the nitpicking, not the people criticizing it. Because you’re focused entirely on whether or the stab wound was lethal. You think if you can somehow convince people of that point, somehow you’ve successfully defended the show. But you’re ignoring what a huge fucking mess all of it was. Even if they had taken care to show that her wounds were superficial and not that bad, it would’ve still been a shit show. The whole “I’ll lure her to my trap where my secret super powers will help me win!” plotline could’ve come right out of a karate kid movie. The painfully stupid Waif=Terminator scenes made for the most uninteresting, cliche-ridden chase scene. They should’ve had two guys crossing the street with a pane of glass as part of it. It relies on a ton of happy perfect coincidences to work. Arya has to swim away stealthily in the canal shit water, not get an infection, not have used poison even though we know the faceless men use it, not have the waif follow her blood trail, not notice the commotion and group of people staring at this girl bleeding to death, the one sort-of-friend she has in Braavos is the world’s best surgeon, that have person find her hiding away in a closet because she made some noise while unconcious and bleeding to death, and then the Waif doesn’t show up to kill that woman we know is marked for death until Arya has had a chance to have plenty of drugged-up sleep (because if she arrives anytime until then, Arya has her throat slit in her sleep), then the Waif has to make a big commotion so that Arya wakes up at the perfect moment to make her escape. Because we’ve established in the show that by their characterization, the faceless men are the world’s most ineffective, least stealthy assassins, which is how they got their terrifying reputation. And even if you think her wound was survivable, there are people in the real world who have minor abdominal surgeries performed with precision by trained surgeons, and yet they’re off their feet for weeks. But apparently a few hours (or even days) of sleep after being sewn up and Arya can fucking parkour across town like Jason Bourne while the Terminatrix makes sure to follow her at Movie Bad Guy pace. Because, you know, after she let her escape the first time, and after the faceless men will fucking kill the assassin for failing to kill a target, she wants to make sure she maximizes her chance to let her escape again The whole faceless men plot was inconsistent and muddled and boring and simultaneously too drawn out and not fleshed out enough and this was the resolution we got to it, like a little turd cherry on top of a shit sundae. But you think if you can say “oh but people survive abdominal wounds sometimes so all your criticisms are invalid you nitpickers!!!” and that somehow defends the complete failure of storytelling from top to bottom you’re being ridiculous. It is such a complete departure from the quality storytelling we’ve previously expected from this show that I’m utterly baffled that anyone could think it wasn’t unusual at all. I can only assume you’re unable to appreciate how good the show usually is, that you don’t notice when it suddenly becomes complete shit. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/355 "2016-06-16T04:46:25Z")
> [@TonySinclair](#): > > - it said that the sample size for butcher knives, the only knife in the study comparable to what the Waif used, was too small to be meaningful – a little over one per year. And I might add, the sample size for victims who were deeply stabbed and then swam around in shit and then staggered across town and then were treated only by an actress who had no formal training or even antibiotics, was even smaller. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/356 "2016-06-16T05:06:02Z")
I found research that shows Fonzie would have survived that jump 83% of the time. Sharks generally just push people out of the way when they swim through the water. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/357 "2016-06-16T05:22:49Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I found research that shows Fonzie would have survived that jump 83% of the time. Sharks generally just push people out of the way when they swim through the water. Best comment yet. Arya’s chase scene could very well be the moment that Game of Thrones jumped the shark. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/358 "2016-06-16T05:39:06Z")
> [@TonySinclair](#): > > Straw man. Nobody said all abdominal wounds are fatal, Colibri said: > [@](#): > > From where she was stabbed, the Waif would have gotten Arya’s bowels. And the people on the show are so sure such wounds are fatal they mercy kill anyone who receives them. You also added this utter horseshit you pulled from your own bowels: > [@](#): > > I would say her chances of not having her intestines and/or major arteries pierced from that stabbing are less than 2%; her chances of not contracting infection from the canal are less than 1%; and her chances of being able to sprint and leap like she did after the stabbing are precisely zero. Half Man Half Wit said: > [@](#): > > And as for the quality of the writing, I don’t care how one tries to fanwank it—if you show one character drop dead in seconds from an abdominal stabbing (Roose Bolton), and then just a couple of episodes later, another character receives virtually the same injuries and essentially walks it off with a couple of stitches and a bandage, displaying artistic feats and running around (what seems like) just a day later, then you’re just being inconsistent with what’s been shown on the show (and of course, real-world statistics have no applicability for a fictional universe—you can decide that abdominal wounds are a trifle, or they’re always fatal, but you can’t do both). And such inconsistencies simply are bad writing. Ender said: > [@](#): > > 1. Beyond just dumb luck, the writers purposely placed Arya in a position where NO ONE should have survived. A gut wound, infected with feces, massive internal bleeding…and then she falls down about 1700 stairs when she’s not fully healed? No one survives any of that. Colibri again: > [@](#): > > The only people who are immune to that on GoT are characters who the plot requires not to die just yet. (So far that group contains exclusively Arya.) Everyone else who receives an abdominal wound is usually dead within minutes, and at most hours. Colibri again: > [@](#): > > No, it’s based on the fact that every other time we’ve seen such a wound in the show it’s been fatal. (And please, don’t tell me it’s because Roose got stabbed in the upper frabjabulator, which is always fatal, while Arya was stabbed in the lower ileodoudenum, which has a 15% survival rate.) It’s just another instance of crappy writing, of which there are many other examples. In other words, people have some really ignorant views of how abdominal wounds work. > [@](#): > > and I didn’t even claim that driving a long blade in to the hilt twice, and then twisting it, would be instantly fatal (although even your alleged six-inch blade at that position and angle could have easily severed her spinal cord). That’s profoundly unlikely. > [@](#): > > But I did say that running and jumping the way she did a few hours (or even a few days) later was ridiculous. It is certainly days later. The milk of the poppy that Lady Crane used for Arya’s drink wasn’t empty after the first dose. She was getting a new bottle when we see her again, \*that’s the show’s way of telling us time passed. \* > [@](#): > > And I wouldn’t throw “stupid” around when you keep saying that intestines somehow dodge knife blades driven as fast as in that attack, and when the link you posted as authoritative is so full of caveats as to be useless: I said people were thinking the writing was stupid because they don’t understand what’s behind the abdominal wall. Not that the people were stupid. Read it again. > [@](#): > > - it didn’t count knife wounds that were instantly fatal, or even those where the victim died before reaching the hospital. That alone disqualifies it as a basis for your argument. > > - it DID count accidental and self-inflicted wounds. Accidental stabbings are not likely to be vicious or deep, and it’s well-known that many suicide attempts are pathetic cries for attention rather than serious efforts to end life. Not that I hang around morgues, but I’ve never heard of anyone outside of Japan who seriously tried to take his life by stabbing himself in the abdomen. > > - it said that the sample size for butcher knives, the only knife in the study comparable to what the Waif used, was too small to be meaningful – a little over one per year. I am open to other cites. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/359 "2016-06-16T06:26:29Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > The showrunners are on the set, they’re involved in the editing booth, they’ve got final approval on anything. Is it maybe bad directing/bad producing/bad editing/bad overall supervision at fault instead of writing? Maybe. Okay, what did you win? It was clearly a failure of storytelling. In that people are upset, yes. Although, much of that upset is based on silly preconceptions those people have. That only magic could save someone with a two lower abdomen stab wounds, or that Arya was somehow laying a complex trap. Or that she should have skulked around and drawn more attention to herself, instead of walking up normally to the captain. > [@](#): > > What? No, she’s certainly not. She’s shown getting a deep 7"+ stab in the gut with a knife twist. If they wanted to specifically show her getting a surivable wound, they could’ve allowed her to escape after some superficial slashes, or they could’ve shown the knife bouncing off a coin purse, or anything at all meant to show that the wound isn’t as bad as getting stabbed deeply in the abdomen. I’ve already discussed that to death (heh). > [@](#): > > She’s specifically shown to have a very terrible wound that we expect to kill her, shown bleeding profusely, shown walking around a town where no one cared, and gave every indication that she’s dying **because that’s the impression they wanted to give** in order to create a cliffhanger. Having them say “Arya couldn’t possibly survive a situation this bad, with a wound this bad, right? Tune in next week” is right out of a terrible, cliched show from the 50s. But that’s certainly the effect they meant to convey when they ended up a cliffhanger like that. They did nothing at all to give the impression that the wound was survivable. But they did, in fact, depict a survivable wound. > [@](#): > > The funny thing is here is that you people defending the show to the death are actually doing the nitpicking, not the people criticizing it. Because you’re focused entirely on whether or the stab wound was lethal. You think if you can somehow convince people of that point, somehow you’ve successfully defended the show. People think it was hours from the stabbing to Lady Crane’s death, that’s the result of not watching the show and seeing her get a fresh bottle of pain killer. It’s not nitpicking to point out that that’s goofy. > [@](#): > > But you’re ignoring what a huge fucking mess all of it was. Even if they had taken care to show that her wounds were superficial and not that bad, it would’ve still been a shit show. The whole “I’ll lure her to my trap where my secret super powers will help me win!” plotline could’ve come right out of a karate kid movie. The painfully stupid Waif=Terminator scenes made for the most uninteresting, cliche-ridden chase scene. They should’ve had two guys crossing the street with a pane of glass as part of it. Her plan wasn’t to lead the Waif to the kill room. The plan was to escape Bravos and get home. She ran to where the sword was because it was the best shot she had to kill the Waif once she was found. > [@](#): > > It relies on a ton of happy perfect coincidences to work. Arya has to swim away stealthily in the canal shit water, not get an infection, not have used poison even though we know the faceless men use it, not have the waif follow her blood trail, not notice the commotion and group of people staring at this girl bleeding to death, the one sort-of-friend she has in Braavos is the world’s best surgeon, that have person find her hiding away in a closet because she made some noise while unconcious and bleeding to death, and then the Waif doesn’t show up to kill that woman we know is marked for death until Arya has had a chance to have plenty of drugged-up sleep (because if she arrives anytime until then, Arya has her throat slit in her sleep), then the Waif has to make a big commotion so that Arya wakes up at the perfect moment to make her escape. Because we’ve established in the show that by their characterization, the faceless men are the world’s most ineffective, least stealthy assassins, which is how they got their terrifying reputation. It wasn’t a plan. Her plan was to get off Bravos by buying a room on a ship. She got stabbed, managed to escape. Got nursed back to health, was found, managed barely to escape to where she had her sword stashed. The only cunning plan she had, was to stash her sword in a place that could go dark. > [@](#): > > And even if you think her wound was survivable It factually was. > [@](#): > > , there are people in the real world who have minor abdominal surgeries performed with precision by trained surgeons, and yet they’re off their feet for weeks. A stab wound that doesn’t hit your bowels or a major artery, is a two inch slit through your body wall. It will hurt, but being high on opium can dull the pain a bit. If the wound didn’t compromise her bowels, it’s comparable to laparoscopic surgery. I’ve watched my wife do a bunch of spays, and dogs are playing six hours after surgery, and that wound is roughly what Arya got. > [@](#): > > But apparently a few hours (or even days) of sleep after being sewn up and Arya can fucking parkour across town like Jason Bourne while the Terminatrix makes sure to follow her at Movie Bad Guy pace. She loses her several times. That’s typical of a chase scene. > [@](#): > > Because, you know, after she let her escape the first time, and after the faceless men will fucking kill the assassin for failing to kill a target, she wants to make sure she maximizes her chance to let her escape again I think that’s based on a faulty recollection. Arya jumps out the window, and the Waif comes out the door and does the terminator lookaround, presumably to find out where she went. On the next cut, the Waif is chasing Arya so fast, she knocks a guy into a wall. Arya slides down under the cart, Waif jumps over it. Arya escapes into bathhouse. Waif realizes she doesn’t know where she went, and stops. Arya gets into the market, the Waif is on the wall and runs after her, stopping for a moment to leer at her. They both run at full speed, Arya does the fruit roll-up down the stairs. The Waif sees her, and seems to spend a moment in perfect happiness, then Arya limps away, and the Waif follows her slowly. She’s obviously not afraid Arya will get away at this point. She’s relishing it. > [@](#): > > The whole faceless men plot was inconsistent and muddled and boring and simultaneously too drawn out and not fleshed out enough and this was the resolution we got to it, like a little turd cherry on top of a shit sundae. Sure, whatever you say. > [@](#): > > But you think if you can say “oh but people survive abdominal wounds sometimes so all your criticisms are invalid you nitpickers!!!” and that somehow defends the complete failure of storytelling from top to bottom you’re being ridiculous. It is such a complete departure from the quality storytelling we’ve previously expected from this show that I’m utterly baffled that anyone could think it wasn’t unusual at all. I can only assume you’re unable to appreciate how good the show usually is, that you don’t notice when it suddenly becomes complete shit. I think it wasn’t super strong, but it wasn’t stupid. Because of the reasons I’ve gone into. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226/360 "2016-06-16T07:39:34Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > It is certainly days later. The milk of the poppy that Lady Crane used for Arya’s drink wasn’t empty after the first dose. She was getting a new bottle when we see her again, \*that’s the show’s way of telling us time passed. \* Where on earth do you get the idea that this was a new bottle? The “new bottle” you are talking about sure seems to have the same amount missing as the “old bottle” would have. (yes I rewatched the scenes) There is nothing at all to indicate this is a new bottle and plenty to indicate that she just stores the potentially lethal stuff way up on a shelf so that the Waif can kill her by making her fall loud enough to wake Arya. (it does look like she has different curtains though so maybe the remodel was to tell us how much time had passed.) If there was an attempt to tell us how much time had passed beyond a single night it failed and failed badly, if there was an attempt to make it believable that Arya could have lived there would have been a Maester involved, There wasn’t, if there was an attempt to make it look like Arya was luring the Waif into her trap it would not have involved massive abdominal trauma the night before a big running jumping, tumbling, wound opening, stitch tearing, bandage ripping festival of fun. When Arya killed Meryn Trant she stalked him, she learned his weakness and found a way to exploit it then pulled a ruthless surprise attack on him, a man who easily more than doubles her size. This was only believable in light of the stalking, the set up, and the surprise. (that and his lack of weapons) had she just walked up to him and said “Hi I am Arya Stark, you killed my dancing master, prepare to die” and he was armed she almost certainly would have either died or been seriously wounded because like the Hound said “Your dancing master is dead because Meryn Trant had armor and a big fucking sword” Now when the Hound kills the shit out of a half dozen people hes not sneaky, Hes huge, hes got a big fucking sword, and he cuts people in half then eats all the chicken. This is believable in show because he is established as a gigantic badass. The Arya story line is more like the Hound, after falling off a cliff and breaking his leg, got up and killed Breanne because plot stuff. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-08-no-one-6-12-16-show-discussion/757226.md?page=19)