# Game of Thrones 6.09 "Battle of the Bastards" 6/19/16 \[Show discussion\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 19, 2016, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789 "2016-06-19T17:59:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/401 "2016-06-23T17:48:33Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > The arrows weren’t the worst part. One second he’s staring at a solid wall of horses charging towards him, then suddenly he’s standing unharmed while all the horses swerved around him. He should have been trampled immediately, or at least the first wave of riders should have tried to cut him down. But for the first few seconds it looked like he was being completely ignored - even though he was pretty much the only target at that moment. I’m fine with Jon under ‘divine protection’, but from the point of view of the Bolton cavalry, he was no longer the only target. They would have been very aware of the horses coming at them, while Jon presumably couldn’t hear them due to the much closer heavy cavalry coming at him. ---
**Author:** ![Nauplius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nauplius/32/51_2.png) [@Nauplius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nauplius)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/402 "2016-06-23T17:54:12Z")
Small plot hole I noticed the second time I watched this episode: Sansa never heard Ramsay say his hounds were starving. She had already left the parley by then. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/403 "2016-06-23T17:55:47Z")
Not really a plothole, just a nitpick. She could’ve easily asked “what did he say after I left?” later. ---
**Author:** ![troub](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troub/32/14802_2.png) [@troub](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/troub)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/404 "2016-06-23T17:58:59Z")
> [@wintertime](#): > > Wasn’t it at the Battle of Monongahela that an ill Washington had two horses shot under him and his coat was pierced by four musket shots, yet he wasn’t injured at all (while almost all the other officers were killed or severly wounded)? Yes, and if that had gone the way I suppose one would expect from such a disaster and he had died there…not only would you never have heard of him, but the rest of the story involving the American Revolution and everything else would be very, very different. I guess if you’re predisposed, you could say that was divine intervention. Or it could just be that lucky, crazy shit happens. It doesn’t make it any more implausible than things that _actually_ happen just because we suspect the guy is important to the plot. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/405 "2016-06-23T18:02:26Z")
> [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](#): > > To me, the notion that the Lord of Light could be literally holding his hand over Jon seems… wrong, somehow. Unearned, a too simple chosen-for-the-sake-of-being-chosen explanation. I mean, if Jon eventually does save the day (and Westeros), as many expect, or is at least instrumental in doing so, then the whole thing would be a literal ‘because God willed it’. There just doesn’t seem much of a point to the story that way. But that’s already been established. Jon’s already been brought back from the dead. Having him be under some kind of protection now is just an extension of that. (And it’s not certain that it was by the Lord of Light rather than some other supernatural power.) Dramatically, having him be killed again would be pretty lame (and even if he were, Melisandre says she would try to revive him again regardless of Jon’s wishes). So we know (as much as we can know anything in this show) that Jon won’t be killed, at least until he fulfills his destiny. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/406 "2016-06-23T18:06:18Z")
Looking Back at Arya, Shes a great shot with a bow, and had some additional training from the Brotherhood. Trained under a master swordsman, The Hound taught her some tricks, including the importance of armor and big fucking swords. The Faceless Men taught her the staff, Poison (at least that was my take, she was shown smelling different powders and mixing them during her blind phase) and they taught her how to fight while blind. She has certainly picked up a few skills, I am not sure shes a full blown murder genie but shes on the way. I also think her training with the FM might have been different than the usual training for another reason. There was a large bit of dialog about the origins of the FM and that they had never had a highborn member before. Given how crappy the last Arya story line went I am probably being to hopeful but I can see how there is some hidden reason for the FM to train up a highborn girl who is clearly not no-one. She would have certain advantages, like allies for instance. They could be turning her loose to stir up chaos prior to Dany and her crew heading over. Re-Sansa, I am actually kind of dreading the continuation of her storyline. If it turns out that Sansa didn’t tell Jon about the KotV because Sansa I am going to seriously rethink weather or not I want to keep watching this show. On the other hand if its because she played everyone else I will have to give them a pass for messing up the Arya line. Jon Snow, You STILL know nothing. Well other than swinging swords and that whole bit about stopping the white walkers. Dany once again reminds us that at least in her world she wants to make things better for everyone. #Danara Does anyone not think Cersie is about to murderate the hell out of Tommen/Margorie/the High Sparrow/Lots of not High Sparrows with wild fire that has the potential to burn down the entire city? Jamie, what the hell is he going to do when hes the last (other than Tyrion) Lanister? (I mean THE Lanisters, as opposed to the greater not in line of inheritance Lanisters) all his kids dead, the last by his Sisters own hand. (Kingslayer twin powers ACTIVATE) ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/407 "2016-06-23T18:14:23Z")
Spelling reminders: Cersei, Jaime, Lannister, Margaery. > [@wintertime](#): > > Wasn’t it at the Battle of Monongahela that an ill Washington had two horses shot under him and his coat was pierced by four musket shots, yet he wasn’t injured at all (while almost all the other officers were killed or severly wounded)?.. Yes. > **[Battle of the Monongahela](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Monongahela)** > > Daniel Liénard de Beaujeu † Jean-Daniel Dumas > Pontiac (Leader of Ottawa forces) > Shingas (Leader of Lenape forces) > The Battle of the Monongahela (also known as the Battle of Braddock's Field and the Battle of the Wilderness) took place on July 9, 1755, at the beginning of the French and Indian War at Braddock's Field in present-day Braddock, Pennsylvania, 10 miles (16 km) east of Pittsburgh. A British force under General Edward Braddock, moving to take Fort Duquesne, was defeated by a force of... And see item #7 here: [http://www.mountvernon.org/george-washington/french-indian-war/ten-facts-about-george-washington-and-the-french-indian-war/](http://www.mountvernon.org/george-washington/french-indian-war/ten-facts-about-george-washington-and-the-french-indian-war/) During the Revolutionary War, Washington also rode between the American and British lines at the 1777 Battle of Princeton, encouraging his troops to attack. An aide covered his eyes with his hat because he didn’t want to see Washington shot from the saddle. Both sides fired a musket volley. The aide lowered his hat, astonished to see Washington unhurt; the general then rallied his troops and drove the British from the field. ---
**Author:** ![Pedro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@Pedro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pedro)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/408 "2016-06-23T18:15:15Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I will have to re-watch, but I thought Ramsay’s forces got to John before Davos’ did. In any event, a man on foot should not have survived a massive frontal assault by knights on horses. Mounted charges were devastating to foot soldiers. Jon’s cavalry overtook him and the clash happened in front of him. As to why he wasn’t trampled or injured in that moment, sure it was a very dangerous situation but it doesn’t raise to the level of miracle. Presumably his own forces tried to avoid running him over, successfully. > [@Colibri](#): > > But actually, it was lucky for Jon that his horse was shot out from under him where it was. If he hadn’t fallen where he did, the Bolton forces would have overwhelmed him before his own cavalry reached him. This is true. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/409 "2016-06-23T19:55:50Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Spelling reminders: Cersei, Jaime, Lannister, Margaery. Thank you. I was so lost and had no idea who or what anyone was talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/410 "2016-06-23T20:02:25Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Spelling reminders: Cersei, Jaime, Lannister, Margaery. Everyone knows who is being talked about. Spelling reminders are tedious. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/411 "2016-06-23T20:07:00Z")
How tedious are reminders that spelling reminders are tedious? Edit: Since his note was just part of another post, it stuck out less than me than posting just to chastise people for making spelling notes. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/412 "2016-06-23T20:09:52Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > How tedious are reminders that spelling reminders are tedious? I’ll be happy to stop posting them when people stop posting spelling reminders.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/413 "2016-06-23T20:55:09Z")
If people would learn how to spell such reminders wouldn’t be needed. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/414 "2016-06-23T21:12:11Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > If people would learn how to spell such reminders wouldn’t be needed. 😛 Good luck with that. At any rate, this is about the TV show, not the books. Theoretically no one should know how any of the names are spelled, only how they sound. Phonetic spellings should be fine. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/half_man_half_wit/32/21766_2.png) [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Half_Man_Half_Wit)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/415 "2016-06-23T21:12:47Z")
Every spelling stickler is free to help themselves to either (or both!) of these: [ul] [li]In real medieval settings (and I’m here cunningly setting the medieval-accuracy sticklers against the spelling sticklers), there often were no completely settled rules of spelling, and words and names varied between different documents. Thus, spelling differences in these threads really only enhance the realism and immersion of the show![/li][li]It is unlikely that Westeros employs the same alphabet as we do. Hence, all the names, places, etc. are really transliterations into our alphabet; however, transliteration conventions often change, and thus, different posters simply use different conventions in translating from the original Westerosi script.[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/416 "2016-06-23T21:26:20Z")
> [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](#): > > Every spelling stickler is free to help themselves to either (or both!) of these: > > [ul] > [li]In real medieval settings (and I’m here cunningly setting the medieval-accuracy sticklers against the spelling sticklers), there often were no completely settled rules of spelling, and words and names varied between different documents. Thus, spelling differences in these threads really only enhance the realism and immersion of the show![/li][li]It is unlikely that Westeros employs the same alphabet as we do. Hence, all the names, places, etc. are really transliterations into our alphabet; however, transliteration conventions often change, and thus, different posters simply use different conventions in translating from the original Westerosi script.[/li][/ul] Excellent points! ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/417 "2016-06-23T21:29:15Z")
> [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](#): > > [li]It is unlikely that Westeros employs the same alphabet as we do. Hence, all the names, places, etc. are really transliterations into our alphabet; however, transliteration conventions often change, and thus, different posters simply use different conventions in translating from the original Westerosi script.[/li] Counterpoint: [http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/gameofthrones/images/8/88/601\_Mhysa\_is\_a\_master.png/revision/latest?cb=20160501234839](http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/gameofthrones/images/8/88/601_Mhysa_is_a_master.png/revision/latest?cb=20160501234839) ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/418 "2016-06-23T21:33:41Z")
> [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](#): > > It is unlikely that Westeros employs the same alphabet as we do. We’ve seen several raven messages, and they use the same alphabet as us. ---
**Author:** ![Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/half_man_half_wit/32/21766_2.png) [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Half_Man_Half_Wit)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/419 "2016-06-23T21:40:26Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > Counterpoint: > [http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/gameofthrones/images/8/88/601\_Mhysa\_is\_a\_master.png/revision/latest?cb=20160501234839](http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/gameofthrones/images/8/88/601_Mhysa_is_a_master.png/revision/latest?cb=20160501234839) > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > We’ve seen several raven messages, and they use the same alphabet as us. The show doesn’t show us the world as it is, or as we would see it (no show or movie ever does, even realism is just a dramatic convention of what we’ve decided to consider ‘realistic’), but how it appears to its inhabitants, which includes being able to read and understand messages, both spoken and written. Or do you think they speak English in Westeros, too? (Then why do they suddenly speak German over here?) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2016, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789/420 "2016-06-23T21:45:12Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > We’ve seen several raven messages, and they use the same alphabet as us. Is this a whoosh? Of course it’s written in English, in the Roman alphabet, so we can read it. Are you saying that the Common Tongue of Westeros is exactly the same as modern English (not even Middle English)? Graffiti in Mereen is also often written in English in Roman characters, even though it is supposedly in Low Valyrian. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-6-09-battle-of-the-bastards-6-19-16-show-discussion/757789.md?page=22)