# Game of Thrones 7.03 "The Queen's Justice" 7/30/17 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 30, 2017, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453 "2017-07-30T18:18:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/161 "2017-08-01T02:52:26Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > And yes I’m certain that the rape Daenerys alluded to was her being given to Drogo. Remember Viserys said he would let every Dothraki and his horse have his way with her to get what he wanted. Yeah, it’s just weird to have her acknowledge that now when before she’s treated Drogo as the love of her life. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/162 "2017-08-01T03:00:39Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Yeah, it’s just weird to have her acknowledge that now when before she’s treated Drogo as the love of her life. People are complicated. Relationships are complicated. But there’s no question in my mind that if I go back to the first episode and look at her expression that she is suffering some degree of trauma throughout that event. Later, she grew to love Drogo, but I don’t think that would necessarily make her forget the experience of rape. ---
**Author:** ![Oswald\_Bastable](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oswald_bastable/32/214_2.png) [@Oswald\_Bastable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oswald_Bastable)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/163 "2017-08-01T03:50:08Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > What books? > > BTW, I was pleased that the archmaester didn’t expel Samwell for curing Jorah. He did tell Sam to copy a big pile of documents as punishment, but I wonder if the chore was also meant as a learning opportunity. Was there useful info in those scrolls? It’s possible the archmaester is secretly rewarding Sam with the task of copying the scrolls (he did request access to the locked part of the library in the first episode, and although he subsequently got in surreptitiously, the am doesn’t know that). Most likely, IMO, is that this is where he finds some hint of Jon’s true parentage. OB ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/164 "2017-08-01T05:19:24Z")
Edmure was being held at Casterly Rock. It’s possible that the Lannisters abandoned him there, thinking him worthless at this point. I’m thinking he’ll reappear soon and become important to the plot again. Perhaps he’ll team up with the Unsullied and lead them to Riverrun. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/165 "2017-08-01T06:12:44Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Senorbeef: it’s not just that time is being compressed. but that it is incoherent. Are we supposed to believe that Jon Snow has been waiting in Dragonstone for the weeks/months it would have taken for the other events in the episode to transpire? That Ser Jorah has actually been healing for weeks? His treatment began before the other events - he should already be at Dragonstone if we are to believe the timeline. As I wrote above, time in two different places doesn’t pass at the same rate, and it never did in the show. It’s not because two events are shown within the same episode that they happened more or less at the same time, or took more or less the same time to unfold. They just want to show all main characters/settings within each episode. It’s only when events in one place influence events in another that chronological order is respected. Usually, it isn’t important and it’s ignored. For some reason, most people only began to notice when Varys “teleported” at the end of last season, but if you watch again the previous seasons, you’ll notice that at least one month passed here (say, an army is marched from one side of Westeros to another) while at most some days passed there (say, one character escapes from some dangerous situation) all the time. Just having seen Dunkirk, it’s pretty much the same thing (one timeline lasts one week, one lasts one day, one lasts one hour, but they still are shown concurrently and they only converge at the end of the movie. Of course it’s better done and it’s announced from the get go in this movie, but the idea is the same). ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/166 "2017-08-01T06:24:45Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Possibly the smoking gun is a message he sent to Ramsay that makes it clear he knew Sansa was being mistreated but did nothing about it? (Didn’t he claim to be completely unaware of what Ramsay was like?) The show creators stated at some point (in an “inside this episode”?) that Littlefinger was really unaware of what Ramsay was like (not just pretending). Seemed completely out of character to me, but it seems it’s what we’re supposed to believe. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/167 "2017-08-01T07:58:03Z")
> [@carlb](#): > > Oh, and one other thing - did anyone else notice Littlefinger’s quick glance backward during the Winterfell walk-and-talk when the new Winterfell maester mentioned that Maester Luwin kept copies of every message received at Winterfell? My bet is that there’s something in there that will prove to be Littlefinger’s downfall. I can’t think of an out-and-out smoking gun at the moment, but it sure felt like foreshadowing that someone will find something that outs him for the scheming slimeball that he is. At first I thought maybe it was the message that Lysa sent to Cat in the first episode saying that Jon Arryn was murdered by the Lannisters which pretty much set in motion the whole series. Since that message was just a ruse by Lysa and Littlefinger, I can understand him not wanting it to see the light of day. But then I have no idea how that could be traced to him personally (unless Sansa has an inkling? I can’t remember what she knows about that situation, dunno). Either way, the message was delivered by rider (not a raven scroll which is what Luwin kept copies of, if that makes a difference) and Cat burned the paper seconds after reading it. But Luwin was in the room when she read it and knew what it said, so maybe he made a note of it to place in the message archives. That Littlefinger is looking to erase this particular message doesn’t seem terribly likely, but yeah maybe it’s enough of a narrative pretense for someone to catch him mucking around in the archives and the inevitable shenanigans that would cause. Just spitballing. I have no idea. Don’t ask me about my Luwin-was-in-cahoots-with-Littlefinger hypothesis that this spitballing led me to. ---
**Author:** ![Shakester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shakester/32/437_2.png) [@Shakester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shakester)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/168 "2017-08-01T07:58:08Z")
Edmure again… thinking about it, given the sudden extinction of House Frey and the Lannister need for allies, I could see them restoring Edmure to the lordship of Riverrun and maybe Warden of the Riverlands (or whatever the title is in that area). Based on a promise of supporting the Lannisters, of course. Either way, I expect to see Edmure again soon. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/169 "2017-08-01T08:42:26Z")
> [@Sauron](#): > > The biggest bonus for me, though, was finally figuring out who Euron reminded me of. In both looks and mannerisms, he’s the spitting image of Buford “Mad Dog” Tannen from _Back to the Future III_. > > [Euron](https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/thumbnails/image/2017/07/27/17/euron-greyjoy-dragonstone.jpg) > [Buford “Mad Dog” Tannen](https://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/bttf/images/f/fe/Buford.JPG/revision/latest?cb=20130223051856) Ha, at first I thought it was a coincidence how much new-look [Euron](http://oohlo.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/CrazyEuron.jpg) looks like [Bennett](https://pluckyoutoo.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/commando-bennett.jpg) from Commando. Then they both wound up [taking](https://pmcvariety.files.wordpress.com/2017/07/pilou-asbaek-game-of-thrones-euron-greyjoy.jpg) [hostages](http://cdn-primary-37606020.eu-west-1.elb.amazonaws.com/jpg/50/0/0/640/480/aspectfit/0/0/0/0/0/0/c/features/574425d5bf1bdcf50c7ed71f/commando-8.jpg) and now I think the show is just fucking with us on purpose. Let off some steam, Euron. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/170 "2017-08-01T14:47:16Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > As I wrote above, time in two different places doesn’t pass at the same rate, and it never did in the show. It’s not because two events are shown within the same episode that they happened more or less at the same time, or took more or less the same time to unfold. They just want to show all main characters/settings within each episode. It’s only when events in one place influence events in another that chronological order is respected. Usually, it isn’t important and it’s ignored. For some reason, most people only began to notice when Varys “teleported” at the end of last season, but if you watch again the previous seasons, you’ll notice that at least one month passed here (say, an army is marched from one side of Westeros to another) while at most some days passed there (say, one character escapes from some dangerous situation) all the time. I think the issue is that the stories are getting more intertwined and geographically compressed, so the time changes are more noticeable. In the first couple seasons you pretty much just had a story in the north, a story in the south, and a story in Essos (with other side stories sprinkled in). Now it’s really all one main story, just in different locations. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/171 "2017-08-01T14:58:25Z")
Regarding the look Littlefinger gives about the raven’s messages being kept. [The Ringer’s GoT savant](https://theringer.com/ask-the-maester-game-of-thrones-season-7-episode-3-ac427352dc3) speculates it’s proof that Littlefinger sent the assassin to kill Bran back in season 1, which would piss off enough to leave/deport/kill him. Also, I get more of a Liev Schreiber as Sabretooth look from Euron… ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/172 "2017-08-01T15:03:21Z")
On one of the YouTube reviews at the beginning of this season, one of the commentators was griping about time passage as many here are. His co-talker said, “Maybe a quick shot of a flipping calendar would make you feel better.” And the offended one answered, “How 'bout like on Fringe. They can super-impose King’s Landing June 12, 230 real quick at the beginning of each scene.” P.S. While typing this post, I realize I have no idea how Westros’s calendar actually works. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/173 "2017-08-01T15:05:42Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > Regarding the look Littlefinger gives about the raven’s messages being kept. > > [The Ringer’s GoT savant](https://theringer.com/ask-the-maester-game-of-thrones-season-7-episode-3-ac427352dc3) speculates it’s proof that Littlefinger sent the assassin to kill Bran back in season 1, which would piss off enough to leave/deport/kill him. > > Also, I get more of a Liev Schreiber as Sabretooth look from Euron… Meant to put in “Sansa” there. It would piss Sansa off. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/174 "2017-08-01T15:07:48Z")
I noticed that, although Cersei was declared to be of House Lannister when she was crowned Queen, the GOT opening credits still show the Baratheon stag on the King’s Landing model. Great scene with Varys and the Red Priestess on the cliffs: “I have to die in this strange country… just like you.” Also good to see Bronn again, on the march to Highgarden. He’s gotta be given some lines, though! Too good a character to keep him silent. Best line this episode: the Queen of Thorns, talking to Jaime about his late and not-terribly-lamented son Joffrey: “He really was a cunt, wasn’t he?” > [@stpauler](#): > > Is it just me or is Daenerys’s story arc starting to lean to her becoming power hungry and starting to become like her father? Her repeated insistence on Snow taking a knee seemed to be hammered home a little more than subtly… A bit, but she really was showing commendable restraint. She could have shown much more temper than she did and ordered him executed on the spot; her dad surely would’ve done something like that. Which reminds me, I was amazed that she acknowledged her dad was a bad dude and actually apologized for his Stark executions. I think she’s the first monarch in all of GOT to actually apologize for _anything_. > [@msmith537](#): > > Because it wasn’t really relevant to the conversation. Her point was the last KITN from years ago had sweared allegiance to her ancestors… Jon’s authority is tenuous enough without saddling him with the title of “kitten.” > [@SenorBeef](#): > > Davos doesn’t get his due as being the greatest hype man of Westeros. Oh, yeah! He was very effective in persuading the Iron Bank when Stannis needed cash, for instance. Gruff-and-honest is his shtick, and he does it well. > [@SuperNelson](#): > > Regardless of what the archmaester says, This doesn’t seem like Sam’s idea of punishment. If Sam’s copying scrolls, he’s not scooping soup and dumping poop. But the archmaester, who told Sam not to mess with Greyscale, has to do something like punishment, no matter how impressed he is. So he took Sam away from his important chambermaid duties, and threw him into a task which most people would consider punishment, but is probably Sam’s idea of a dream assignment. That’s what I thought too. He didn’t seem thrilled, but that was probably because of just how damn many books and scrolls there were. I liked that he was brave enough to shake Ser Jorah’s hand, BTW. > [@carlb](#): > > Oh, and one other thing - did anyone else notice Littlefinger’s quick glance backward during the Winterfell walk-and-talk when the new Winterfell maester mentioned that Maester Luwin kept copies of every message received at Winterfell? My bet is that there’s something in there that will prove to be Littlefinger’s downfall. I can’t think of an out-and-out smoking gun at the moment, but it sure felt like foreshadowing that someone will find something that outs him for the scheming slimeball that he is. Hmm. Interesting. I missed that. > [@alphaboi867](#): > > So last night I dreamed Daenerys sent Grey Worm to my living room to write a new constitution for Westeros… If you have the same dream again, be sure to tell him to include an independent judiciary. > [@Acsenray](#): > > Maybe Arya is the servant before whom Cersei was parading. I doubt that - Arya’s still headed to Winterfell, isn’t she? Which reminds me, Cersei’s incestuous indiscretion is even more incredibly stoopid than usual. She ought to know that openly confirming all the scandalous rumors about her and Jaime will undercut her own authority. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/175 "2017-08-01T15:14:01Z")
Why was Jon Snow wearing a giant fur coat at Dragonstone? Dude must have been swweating buckets ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/176 "2017-08-01T15:25:20Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Why was Jon Snow wearing a giant fur coat at Dragonstone? Dude must have been swweating buckets Winter is here ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/177 "2017-08-01T15:26:06Z")
Maybe it doesn’t matter what Luwin knew or didn’t know. Maybe Littlefinger will just become paranoid at the thought and slip up while trying to suppress it. > [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > Also, I get more of a Liev Schreiber as Sabretooth look from Euron… Me too, though not as Sabretooth as there never was a Deadpool-muting Wolverine Origins film for him to be in! > [@treis](#): > > Why was Jon Snow wearing a giant fur coat at Dragonstone? Dude must have been swweating buckets Targs don’t mind the heat? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/178 "2017-08-01T15:30:03Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I noticed that, although Cersei was declared to be of House Lannister when she was crowned Queen, the GOT opening credits still show the Baratheon stag on the King’s Landing model. That might be deliberate. Her children’s claim to the Throne was due to them being Robert’s “Children”. The Lannisters had no claim to the Throne, and I suspect it’s a sop to the traditionalists who weren’t blown up. As for the time shifts, yes in the earlier seasons they got away with it since they were basically three separate stories\*, the King’s Landing intrigues, Dany in Essos and the North with basically no interaction. If a character moved from one part to the other, it took several episodes. Now, they do so multiple times as episode; and its jarring. They need to account for it somehow. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/179 "2017-08-01T17:20:25Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > That might be deliberate. Her children’s claim to the Throne was due to them being Robert’s “Children”. The Lannisters had no claim to the Throne, and I suspect it’s a sop to the traditionalists who weren’t blown up. > > As for the time shifts, yes in the earlier seasons they got away with it since they were basically three separate stories\*, the King’s Landing intrigues, Dany in Essos and the North with basically no interaction. If a character moved from one part to the other, it took several episodes. Now, they do so multiple times as episode; and its jarring. They need to account for it somehow. I don’t think it’s the movement that is jarring. It’s the deus ex machina: How does a Lannister army make it all the way to Highgarden unnoticed? The Greyjoy fleet is totally destroyed, yet the Unsullied make it all the way to Casterly Rock unscathed? Then the same day the Unsullied land, Euron shows up with his fleet and destroys the Unsullied fleet in the bay? None of these things should have happened. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2017, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453/180 "2017-08-01T17:28:32Z")
Dany’s fleet is not totally destroyed. The characters specifically say that a portion of their fleet is destroyed. The unsullied were sent on different ships. Dany commands the naval power of Dorne and Highgarden too. Euron showing up to Casterly Rock isn’t that implausible - they wouldn’t have had that much of a head start on him - given that the Lannisters had anticipated the attack on Casterly Rock. Why is it implausible that they correctly predict the attack and march out their army and empty their larders, but not plausible that their naval fleet is also sent to attack the invading fleet after it dropped off the soldiers? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-7-03-the-queens-justice-7-30-17/792453.md?page=10)