# Game of Thrones 8.02 "A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms" 4/21/19 \[SHOW ONLY\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 21, 2019, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867 "2019-04-21T23:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/81 "2019-04-22T16:16:38Z")
Holy crap, that WOULD be surprising! Winterfell is just a feint and the Night King is actually on his way to King’s Landing. Man, I hope that’s what happens and, if it does, I’m mad I read it here. Well, if this IS true the crew at Winterfell can take out the Walkers (do they control wights?) while they themselves get decimated. I’m so wanting and not wanting this next episode. Did I mention how my heart was pounding during the last scenes of this episode even though I knew the fight wasn’t going to start yet? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/82 "2019-04-22T16:17:35Z")
> [@MeanJoe](#): > > I hope that all plot armor has been removed at this point and that the writers will have some surprises for us next week. I don’t think there’s plot armor for anyone as far as the entire season goes, but there are some characters that have unfinished business in Kings Landing, making it less likely that they will die at Winterfell rather than in the conflict with Cersei. They are protected not because they are sympathetic characters, but on “Chekov’s Gun” grounds. They are chess pieces in the Game of Thrones, not the battle with the Night King. **Characters who have no further utility than having a heroic and/or poignant death:** -Brienne. As the most noble, selfless, and heroic character, who has just had the happiest moment of her life, she’s pretty much dead meat sooner rather than later. -Pod. His main function has been as comic relief for Brienne. Maybe they’ll keep him around for his singing voice. -Jorah. Duh. -Grey Worm/Missandei. Talking about their future together pretty much guarantees that one (but not both) die. -Tormund. Might be kept around for comic relief, or as the Last of the Wildlings. -Edd. Duh. -Gilly/Little Sam. -Theon. Most appropriate for him to die fighting for Winterfell. **Characters who will survive the Battle of Winterfell but may die later.** -Jon -Danaerys -Bran. If he dies, the Night King wins. -Jaime. Needs a final confrontation with Cersei -Tyrion. Ditto. -Sansa. Needed for the continued conflict with Danaerys over Jon’s loyalties. -Arya. All that Faceless Man training is mainly useful against humans, not White Walkers. -Gendry. I don’t think they’ll throw away the Last Baratheon just yet. -Beric. He’s been resurrected too many times not to have some special purpose involving the Lord of Light. -The Hound. Expendable, but the zombie he needs to confront is The Mountain. -Varys. Expendable, but it doesn’t seem appropriate for him to die in Winterfell instead of Kings Landing. -Sam. He’s dumped most of his information, apparently, but he may have more that will be useful. -Davos. He’s expendable, but I think he’ll be kept around as the ultimate survivor. > [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > …he takes the Black again and spends the rest of his life alone while Dany sits on a lonely throne There wouldn’t be much reason to take the black again if the Wall is down and the Night King has been vanquished, would there? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/83 "2019-04-22T16:26:24Z")
There’s a problem with magical enemies. They can be defeated only by magic. Everything that’s happening in the show is fan-appreciation irrelevant to the plot. There will be battles because the fans like battle scenes. The good guys will be heroic until their deaths, saving the innocent and less powerful. Fire good! But for the plot, the only element that counts is magic. Bran is magic. The dragons are magic. Beric Dondarrion is magic. Melisandre is magic. Dany and Jon have Targareon magic in their genetics. Am I missing somebody? Probably. Maybe Sam can pull some magic lore out of stolen books, which also have been mentioned umpteen times. Ignore the misdirection and concentrate on the magicians. Why is Theon the only one going with Bran? Why did Beric show up as one of the crucial players? Doesn’t the Lord of Light need a new priest to raise the dead? If there’s a dragon-on-fight fight to the death, what happens to the third? When will Melisandre make her reappearance? Why can’t zombies cross water and what happens if they could? Magic has its own rules. We’ve been given hints. Now the show has to play those cards. Nothing else matters. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/84 "2019-04-22T16:27:18Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > -Brienne. As the most noble, selfless, and heroic character, who has just had the happiest moment of her life, she’s pretty much dead meat sooner rather than later. > > … > > -Tormund. Might be kept around for comic relief, or as the Last of the Wildlings. I dunno. I could see these two founding a new group of family-sized semi-Wildlings. The North will need repopulating, after all. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/85 "2019-04-22T16:35:40Z")
> [@troub](#): > > Final thought, again with the dialogue and again with hamfisted foreshadowing: what’s the deal with Tyrion’s brain. Oh my god, almost as many times as we heard that the “crypts are safe!” we heard that Tyrion’s “here for his brain” or because he’s a genius, he himself calling himself “clever” (“I made a mistake common to clever people…”). Why? That something bad’s going to happen in the crypts is obvious…what’s up with Tyrion? Is he being set up to save the day or make another huge blunder? When was the last time Tyrion did anything particularly smart? For the most part, he’s either ignored by Danaerys or he’s wrong. It’s a classic case of bad screenwriting; they’re telling, not showing. Tyrion’s alleged genius should be demonstrated by his outwitting people and solving problems, not by people SAYING he’s smart. Objectively, based on how people have actually played the Game of Thrones, he is not remotely the smartest person around; Cersei Lannister is, Danaerys is not far behind, and Sansa is going to give them all a run for their money. ---
**Author:** ![HammerJoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a6a055/32.png) [@HammerJoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HammerJoe)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/86 "2019-04-22T16:43:03Z")
Am I the only one that found curious that little short scene for one of our famous Tyrion Lines at the end of the war council? I found it intriguing that he stayed to talk to Bran and learn about his trip. The show didnt dwelve into this chat but makes me wonder if Tyrion learnt some useful information that he will use later? What do you folks make of it? ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/87 "2019-04-22T16:47:48Z")
> [@HammerJoe](#): > > Am I the only one that found curious that little short scene for one of our famous Tyrion Lines at the end of the war council? > > I found it intriguing that he stayed to talk to Bran and learn about his trip. > The show didnt dwelve into this chat but makes me wonder if Tyrion learnt some useful information that he will use later? > > What do you folks make of it? I know that Tyrion was getting Bran to tell his life story in front of a fire. When they cut back to Tyrion, he was talking to Jaime in front of a fire. It was jarring. But I can’t think of anything of value that Bran might’ve told Tyrion. Except for _Jon’s the rightful heir_, which I doubt he mentioned, so I guess that time had simply passed. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/88 "2019-04-22T16:50:11Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Beric Dondarrion is magic. Melisandre is magic. Just the fact that Melisandre hasn’t shown up yet makes it very likely that the Night King will survive the Battle of Winterfell but ultimately be defeated by Lord of Light magic. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/89 "2019-04-22T16:54:04Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Just the fact that Melisandre hasn’t shown up yet makes it very likely that the Night King will survive the Battle of Winterfell but ultimately be defeated by Lord of Light magic. I have my doubts only because the Lord of Light isn’t the nicest guy in the world\*, and there hasn’t been a whole lot of set-up for us. Even that Azor Ahai shit is mostly books and hasn’t been given enough lip service in the show for us to even remember it. \*I mean years of setting up who the champions of light are and…it comes down to a sort of deux ex?? I’d rather see something from left field like a disguised Arya knife him in the back or even Jon land his dragon on him to have a great final battle. ---
**Author:** ![Telperion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telperion/32/509_2.png) [@Telperion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telperion)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/90 "2019-04-22T17:02:12Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Plus this whole “who will rule” thing is nonsense. Totally. Even if Jon was heir apparent to the Iron Throne at one point, Daenerys would have become the rightful heir when he took the Black since that made it impossible for him to inherit. It’s exactly the same thing as with Aemon Targaryen, who was also barred from succession by joining the Night’s Watch. Whatever the Westerosi succession laws are, I would have to assume they probably don’t recognize take-backsies even if someone manages to get out of the Night’s Watch through a technicality. Although for that matter, the death of the heir apparent also passes succession to the next heir in line, which again would be Daenerys. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/91 "2019-04-22T17:02:43Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > I have my doubts only because the Lord of Light isn’t the nicest guy in the world\*, What show have you been watching?:dubious: Neither are Danaerys, Arya, Jaime, or The Hound. Most of the people on the side of the “good guys” have done something horrific at one point or another. > [@](#): > > and there hasn’t been a whole lot of set-up for us. Except for a couple of seasons worth with Stannis. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/92 "2019-04-22T17:22:54Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > What show have you been watching?:dubious: Neither are Danaerys, Arya, Jaime, or The Hound. Most of the people on the side of the “good guys” have done something horrific at one point or another. > > Except for a couple of seasons worth with Stannis. oooo? (Who?) Ahh yah. That git. Yeah how’d that work out. But yeah Meli should make a reappearance only because of Chekovs Gun. She’ll just declare whoever manages to kill NK as Azor Ahai. Very convienent that. ---
**Author:** ![Ashtura](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ashtura/32/2963_2.png) [@Ashtura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashtura)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/93 "2019-04-22T17:25:05Z")
What’s with the ‘Darth Sansa’ get-up? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/94 "2019-04-22T17:46:20Z")
> [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > It struck me that they’re beating us too much with the crypts being the safest place for non-combatants. They must have said it three or four times last night. I came here to post that. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/95 "2019-04-22T17:47:44Z")
They also went into great detail about who is going into the crypts and who is staying out. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/96 "2019-04-22T18:05:36Z")
I like the idea of a quiet episode before the battle and there were some lovely moments like Brienne’s knighting. I would have liked more discussion of the battle plan beyond the use of Bran as a bait. It helps orient viewers in what can become a blur of random mayhem. Kurosawa’s Seven Samurai is a great example of this being done well. Of course often the battle won’t go to plan and that can also be interesting but only if you know what the plan was in the first place. The big moment when Jon reveals his secret to Dany was wasted. That should have been a highlight of another episode and it could have been so much more dramatic, with some nice suggestions made right here in the last episode’s thread. Anyway I am looking forward to the upcoming battles. In some ways, the show has lost its way in recent seasons with some stupid plotlines but the setpiece battles have generally been spectacular and I suspect the best is yet to come. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/97 "2019-04-22T18:06:01Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > But yeah Meli should make a reappearance only because of Chekovs Gun. She’s also said she will be back: To Jon Snow: > [@](#): > > “You’ve seen the Night King, Jon Snow. You know the Great War is still to come, you know the army of the dead will be upon us soon, and you know I can help you win that war.” To Varys: > [@](#): > > "I will return, dear spider. One last time. I have to die in this strange country, just like you.” Besides that Carice Van Houten has been confirmed to be in the cast this season. ---
**Author:** ![troub](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troub/32/14802_2.png) [@troub](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/troub)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/98 "2019-04-22T18:07:37Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > It’s a classic case of bad screenwriting; they’re telling, not showing. Tyrion’s alleged genius should be demonstrated by his outwitting people and solving problems, not by people SAYING he’s smart. Exactly, and kind of what I was getting at about bad dialogue – all of this saying things blatantly that should rather be shown. But then thinking about the apparently obvious _crypts, crypts, crypts_ “foreshadowing,” I started to wonder if it’s an attempt at that, too, rather than just trying to paint/repaint part of his characterization. As for the red priests and priestesses, I suspect the magic of king’s blood thing (that we were _also_ just reminded about) is going to come up again. After all these years I don’t remember what parts of the “Prince that was Promised” prophecy have been stated in the show and what came from somewhere else, so I have a few thoughts here that I probably won’t mention in this thread. But I’m expecting another blood magic sacrifice of someone with royal blood will be necessary to strike a final lethal blow… ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/99 "2019-04-22T18:20:21Z")
> [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > So the attackers will mainly be regular wights, pouring in through some access way that’s been overlooked. In Real Life, many castles had ‘sally ports’ so that knights could slip out through them and harry the other side during sieges, without opening the main gates for attackers to flood in. One of these will be found/used by the wight army. > > Actually, if it turns out to be true that the man who the Children turned into the Night King _was_ a Stark, he might know exactly where these exits are. Except the Night King pre-dates Winterfell. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2019, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867/100 "2019-04-22T18:34:52Z")
I’m reading some of the recaps on various sites. Several point out something I didn’t notice, that when Bran said to Jaime, “The things we do for love”, which is about what Jaime said when he pushed Bran out that window. Also when Jon told Dany about his parentage, her first response was that he had a claim on the throne. Not, “Ew, my boyfriend is actually my nephew.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-02-a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-4-21-19-show-only/832867.md?page=6)