# Game of Thrones 8.04 "The Last of the Starks" 5/5/2019 \[Show discussion\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 5, 2019, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524 "2019-05-05T20:44:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/401 "2019-05-08T03:49:46Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > In the same way as what? (no snark, i’m just not sure what you are asking me) I wasn’t sure myself what I was asking, because I wasn’t sure if it was a first watching, probably the reason why the question was unclear. But basically, I’m asking if you could actually still enjoy the episodes after having spent so long binging. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/402 "2019-05-08T07:09:47Z")
From reddit: [FFS Sansa](https://i.redd.it/e78nx8t49ww21.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/403 "2019-05-08T07:27:22Z")
Also, unpopular opinion: I love Euron. He’s like an evil Tormund. I know they meant to kind of make him a Trump analog sometimes, what with ruling the Iron Island because of his big cock, but that’s not true. He’s what Trump wishes he could be, and what Trump thinks he is. Euron is brash and confident, but that’s all they share. Euron actually backs that up, by being good at his job, by having been out in the world and accomplished things, by having personally been a badass, by being smart and capable. And he asks Jaime, right there in the throne room, if his sister likes a finger in her butt. Love the actor, love the character. Steals the show whenever he’s in a scene. I know a lot of people hate him because he basically keeps getting used as a deus ex machina, he’s the guy actually executing a lot of things like always finding the enemy no matter where they are in the world and all that, but that’s not really the character’s fault, that’s just bad writing. In fact, in that way he sort of has the opposite problem as the rest of the characters. We’re told that various characters are capable generals who can device good battle plans and lead men - and then we see them devise stupid battle plans that look stupid and rarely quite work out. With Euron, we’re told he’s a capable naval commander, but he’s actually shown executing good plans and succeeding - too well, it requires the characters who oppose him to be dumb. It’s not implausible to have a character who is a legitimately great commander who outmatches his opponents through skill and expertise - history is full of such people, and canonically the ironborn has special skills on the sea. There’s nothing implausible about the character of Euron or what he accomplishes - it’s just that the way they actually write/film it is somewhat implausible and makes our “heroes” look dumb more than Euron look smart. But again, not a fundamental character design problem, more like a writing/production design problem. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 10:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/404 "2019-05-08T10:13:57Z")
> [@gupwalla](#): > > Almost his entire story is bound up in the far North and he’s no more likely than Tormund to ever be happy in the South. It’s not the South! ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/405 "2019-05-08T13:45:52Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Edit: For comparison, taking out the bottom 2 episodes, the ratings on this show range from 8.4 to 9.9. So if The Long Night is 8.4, it’s much closer to being one of the worst episodes than one of the best. I almost feel bad, because there were stories about how gruelling it was to film it. It’s too bad the writing just failed to make it compelling. They put in all the work to make something great, but it just wasn’t. Well, I disagree. It was great, and what a bunch of people in a self-selected survey think strikes me as being a pretty vague measurement. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/406 "2019-05-08T14:15:28Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > I wasn’t sure myself what I was asking, because I wasn’t sure if it was a first watching, probably the reason why the question was unclear. > > But basically, I’m asking if you could actually still enjoy the episodes after having spent so long binging. Sure, I could. The early seasons were really good, and the build up was done well, so I looked forward to watching the next episode, which is why I kept on watching through the weekend. Plus, I wanted to get them all in during my 7-day trial of HBO via Amazon which I just ended up keeping anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/407 "2019-05-08T14:18:22Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > No shit, man. You’ve really cracked the case on this one. :rolleyes: Sorry about this **SenorBeef**. It’s quite dickish and uncalled for. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/408 "2019-05-08T14:20:09Z")
Finally got to watch this episode. I liked it for the most part, even though I thought that it dragged in places. I thought that Kit Harington did a phenomenal job with his speech at the funeral pyre, and I teared up as they lit the pyres. However, I too thought it was odd that they went to the trouble of dragging them all back and creating neat even piles of dead bodies. First of all, that’s really hard work and they should be saving themselves for the Last Battle. Secondly, large pyres scattered throughout the battle field IMO would have made a much more compelling statement following a war that united enemies and had former slaves fighting alongside Kings. All for one and one for all and all that. Ah well. Re the dragon death: I was surprised to see Rhaegal go down. I immediately thought that Drogon should go around and attack from the rear, but soon realized that the ballistas were capable of being rotated 360 degrees. So my next immediate thought was that he should come straight down on one of them because they most certainly lack the ability to shoot straight up and none of the interior ships could shoot horizontally or risk taking out on of their own ships. But then, being a lifelong boater, I realized that I’d missed the obvious: waves. Have the dragon create waves at a safe distance, and wait for the waves to render them incapable of loading or firing straight. Create a nice tsunami from multiple sides to unbalance the fleet… and THEN go in for the kill. Brienne of Tarth. I hated that she and Jaime had sex, because I never believed he loved her in that way. There are many different kinds of real, powerful connections and not all of them lead to physical consummation. In fact, I think that him taking her virginity and then leaving her crying cheapened what had been a more powerful scene, and that was her knighting ceremony. I also think that given Brienne’s oath to protect the Stark girls, she’d feel a duty to chase him and try to kill him since she thinks he left to aide Cersei. (I, personally, believe the Kingslayer intends to become the Queenslayer, for the same reason.) As for the ending, my WAG: I foresee a future with a loose alliance of independent nation states. Tyrion and Sansa will remain married and rule Westeros. If Dany doesn’t murder Jon because he is more liked, he will rule the North. Dany will realize that Westeros isn’t her home and she and Grey Worm will return across the narrow sea to rule the people she liberated. Thurmond will be the leader of the Wildings and he and Jon will allow them to establish homesteads in the area near the former Wall. Bronn will rule Highgarden. Yara will rule the Ironborn. Edmure Tully will rule River Run and practice archery. Jaime will rule Castlery Rock with Brienne as his favorite knight. Gendry will rule Storms End. Robin will rule the Vale. Sam will return and claim his birthright, The Reach. Bran will sit under the tree and reminisce all day. Ghost will woo a gorgeous wolf mother and begin a whole new generation of dire wolves. The Hound and Arya will wander the country and keep order with Needle and a broadsword. And Hotpie will become the richest man in the kingdom when he starts what will become a nationwide chain of bakeries. Check your sword at the door. Peace, love, bread. And they’ll all meet once every 4 years for a big gathering where they will display their banners, joust, get drunk and remember the good old days! …And the last scene will be the clouds dissipating and a bud forming on the Weirwood tree. Summer is coming! ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/409 "2019-05-08T14:20:33Z")
I don’t know, howitzer crossbows, a dragon killed in a kind of lame way, Jamie and Brienne’s awkward sex scene, Cersei passing up a prime chance to win the war with her opponent, and her brother, sitting within easy range of arrows. I can see how it’s one of the lower rated episodes. I still love the show and it’s still very well done, but I agree the writing has slipped the past couple of seasons. But honestly, I don’t see how it could have been otherwise, unless they decided to stretch it out for six more seasons or so. Since they’ve made the decision to wrap it up, armies have to teleport, logistics must be ignored, unnecessary characters need to be culled, and smart characters need to look stupid instead of just mistaken or outfoxed. It’s the only way to fit the story into the allotted time. At least they will finish the story. Could you imagine if they pulled a GRRM and started going many years between seasons? With the last two seasons taking a decade or more in between releases? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/410 "2019-05-08T14:49:00Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > …it’s never shown that Lord Royce interacts with Daenerys at all, let alone to bend the knee… He also gave Tyrion the stinkeye and didn’t refer to him as “My lord” (didn’t say anything to him, actually) while calling Sansa “My lady” when the Hand of the Queen came to talk to her on the Winterfell battlements. > [@Colibri](#): > > …AFAIK there is no definite statement that there are still caches around the city after the Sept of Baelor explosion. However, it would be no surprise if it turned out there were, either caches still left over from Aerys or planted by Cersei for whatever reason. And Cersei has had plenty of time to make more. > > Considering the importance of wildfire to the storylines of both the Targaryens and Lannisters (including Jaime, Tyrion, and Cersei, for different reasons) I would be surprised if it doesn’t come into play in the final conflict between them. Agreed. > [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser](#): > > [https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NastyMarriedAmericanbobtail-mobile.mp4](https://thumbs.gfycat.com/NastyMarriedAmericanbobtail-mobile.mp4) Love it! > [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Personally, my evaluation of her as an innocent waned when her murder count reached double digits. Well, obviously there’s a difference between sexy-innocent and stabby-innocent. > [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > People are saying “Starbucks” because it’s funnier than “generic coffee cup” and has better meme potential. > > [Reddit - Dive into anything](https://i.redd.it/x77zo4mv9xcz.jpg) Heh. A nice gag marred only by the misspelling of Jon’s name. > [@PunditLisa](#): > > …But then, being a lifelong boater, I realized that I’d missed the obvious: waves. Have the dragon create waves at a safe distance, and wait for the waves to render them incapable of loading or firing straight. Create a nice tsunami from multiple sides to unbalance the fleet… and THEN go in for the kill… Love it!!! ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/411 "2019-05-08T14:53:54Z")
Stephen King wants Tyrion to sit on the throne when all is done. [Stephen King has his own idea for how Game of Thrones should end - CNET](https://www.cnet.com/news/stephen-king-has-his-own-idea-for-how-game-of-thrones-should-end/?ftag=COS-05-10aaa0h&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_content=5cd2eb8ee506e700010796b0&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/412 "2019-05-08T15:15:50Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Surprised to see this episode is currently a 6.8 on IMDB. The previous low of the series is Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken at 8.1. This episode wasn’t great, but it certainly doesn’t deserve to be the lowest by far. > > But it doesn’t seem like the voting numbers are inflated, so it doesn’t suggest review bombing. The number of votes for each episode this season is 62k, 57k, 127k, 54k. Why, then, is this episode rated the worst episode of the show by far? Kinda strange. > > 8.03, the big climactic battle, is actually only 8.7 which is fairly low for a big battle episode. Other big battle episodes were rated much higher. Battle of the Bastards and Hardhome are 9.9. Spoils of War is 9.8. Blackwater was 9.7. Watchers on the Wall was 9.6. In comparison, for being the same sort of episode, 8.4 is pretty low. Maybe the audience isn’t as enamored with this season as the noisy fanboys seem to suggest. > > Edit: For comparison, taking out the bottom 2 episodes, the ratings on this show range from 8.4 to 9.9. So if The Long Night is 8.4, it’s much closer to being one of the worst episodes than one of the best. I almost feel bad, because there were stories about how gruelling it was to film it. It’s too bad the writing just failed to make it compelling. They put in all the work to make something great, but it just wasn’t. Isn’t it amazing that we went from “I can’t wait for the last season of Game of Thrones” to “The last season of Game of Thrones is here and they should make it much longer” to “Get it over with already, I can’t stand the disillusionment” in only four episodes? Has any show ever had a worse last season since Roseanne? ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/413 "2019-05-08T15:39:08Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Isn’t it amazing that we went from “I can’t wait for the last season of Game of Thrones” to “The last season of Game of Thrones is here and they should make it much longer” to “Get it over with already, I can’t stand the disillusionment” in only four episodes? Has any show ever had a worse last season since Roseanne? The show has been too long and too intense. There’s no good way to end it, so they’re just ripping the band aid off. ---
**Author:** ![Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b2d939/32.png) [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Go_Arachnid_Laser_1)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/414 "2019-05-08T15:51:03Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Isn’t it amazing that we went from “I can’t wait for the last season of Game of Thrones” to “The last season of Game of Thrones is here and they should make it much longer” to “Get it over with already, I can’t stand the disillusionment” in only four episodes? Has any show ever had a worse last season since Roseanne? Eeeeh… honestly, people should have realized already last season that there was no driver on this dumpster truck. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/415 "2019-05-08T16:06:51Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Heh. A nice gag marred only by the misspelling of Jon’s name. Actually, considering how often Starbuck’s misspells names, that adds to the joke. There’s another meme going around, that unfortunately I can’t find a link to, with “Danerys” misspelled five different ways and crossed out, ending with “Debbie.”🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/416 "2019-05-08T16:13:11Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Also, unpopular opinion: I love Euron. He’s like an evil Tormund. Who doesn’t like Euron? Him magically being where he needs to be doesn’t diminish his delicious evilness. I love Cersei as well for similar reasons. A good show needs good villains and good villains need to know what they are doing sometimes (and Cersei and Euron knew what they were doing by not helping in the Battle of Winterfell). ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/417 "2019-05-08T16:13:52Z")
> [@aurora\_maire](#): > > I think that Jaime needed to get out of there before he changed his mind, and said those things to Brienne to make her hate him and therefore easier for him to go. I don’t think he wants to save Cersei. He didn’t make the decision to go until Bronn told him Cersei wanted him dead and then heard that Cersei was winning. He thought she would die in the war but then realized that might not happen. So he has to make sure it does. He can’t be the good person Brienne believes he is until he settles that score. A friend of mine had a slightly different take on this. Jaime said those things to Brienne to keep her safe at Winterfell. If he had told her what he really had planned, she would have insisted on going with him. Maybe she will follow him to Kings Landing anyway, so he will die in the arms of the woman he loves. Of course, that would sort of be a happy ending so it probably won’t happen. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/418 "2019-05-08T16:30:27Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > I also think that given Brienne’s oath to protect the Stark girls, she’d feel a duty to chase him and try to kill him since she thinks he left to aide Cersei. (I, personally, believe the Kingslayer intends to become the Queenslayer, for the same reason.) I don’t think that’s how oaths of protection work. You’re like a bodyguard, you don’t go killing people because they might at some point be a threat. ---
**Author:** ![BeagleJesus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5daacb/32.png) [@BeagleJesus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeagleJesus)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/419 "2019-05-08T17:00:52Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > Brienne of Tarth. I hated that she and Jaime had sex, because I never believed he loved her in that way. There are many different kinds of real, powerful connections and not all of them lead to physical consummation. In fact, I think that him taking her virginity and then leaving her crying cheapened what had been a more powerful scene, and that was her knighting ceremony. Brienne is one of the few characters that had a shot at happily ever after. She became a knight (finally), she has noble purpose, she has a dope ass squire and a place where she belongs that she can call home for the rest of her life. The only thing she was missing was a pretty man to call her own and she had that for a very brief time. Brienne doesn’t give up and she doesn’t stop fighting for what she thinks is right. If she let Jamie walk away without trying everything in her power to get him to stay (including crying and begging) then I don’t think that would fit well with the character we have come to know and love. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524/420 "2019-05-08T17:05:14Z")
I’m impressed not so much by how well they removed the not-Starbucks\* cup and left what appears to be a textured table surface in its wake, but that they did so without seeming to “reset” the episode. That is, when I went to take a look on HBO GO, the episode still resumed at the same point I left it, around 17:45–but when I rewound a few seconds, the cup was gone. I would not have thought that possible on a technical level. > [@PunditLisa](#): > > Brienne of Tarth. I hated that she and Jaime had sex, because I never believed he loved her in that way. There are many different kinds of real, powerful connections and not all of them lead to physical consummation. In fact, I think that him taking her virginity and then leaving her crying cheapened what had been a more powerful scene, and that was her knighting ceremony. I cosign this almost 100% (I’ve never liked the trope of “taking” someone’s virginity, assuming the sex was consensual). > [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > I don’t think that’s how oaths of protection work. You’re like a bodyguard, you don’t go killing people because they might at some point be a threat. Agreed, although this is precisely what some smart people worry may happen in the future with AIs who take their duty too seriously–and literally. > [@SenorBeef](#): > > Surprised to see this episode is currently a 6.8 on IMDB. The previous low of the series is Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken at 8.1. This episode wasn’t great, but it certainly doesn’t deserve to be the lowest by far. > > But it doesn’t seem like the voting numbers are inflated, so it doesn’t suggest review bombing. The number of votes for each episode this season is 62k, 57k, 127k, 54k. Why, then, is this episode rated the worst episode of the show by far? Kinda strange. I agree that it’s strange. As I said in my first post in this thread, my initial reaction to the episode was that it was a return to form after the middle hour of “The Long Night” was so bad. My son’s list of grievances persuaded me downward somewhat, but even he thought it was better than the previous one (3/10 vs. 2/10, he said). > [@DrCube](#): > > I still love the show and it’s still very well done, but I agree the writing has slipped the past couple of seasons. But honestly, I don’t see how it could have been otherwise, unless they decided to stretch it out for six more seasons or so. Since they’ve made the decision to wrap it up, armies have to teleport, logistics must be ignored, unnecessary characters need to be culled, and smart characters need to look stupid instead of just mistaken or outfoxed. It’s the only way to fit the story into the allotted time. > > At least they will finish the story. Could you imagine if they pulled a GRRM and started going many years between seasons? With the last two seasons taking a decade or more in between releases? But those aren’t the only two choices. They could have made more episodes/seasons without a long gap between them. On one of my podcasts, they pointed out that in earlier seasons, they drew things out so slowly that an episode featured an entire plotline that involved going to the Iron Bank and getting turned down for a loan. That is completely inconceivable now. Had they known then exactly how long a runway they had, I have to assume they would have picked up the pace slightly at that time, to allow them to slow down a bit over the past couple seasons. > [@SenorBeef](#): > > Also, the conspiracy theory that Game of Thrones, with budgets in the 100m+ range, a prestige, network-defining series deliberately snuck a starbucks coffee in the shot as product placement is ridiculous. It’s a production fuckup. It’s hard to believe, but believing it’s a production fuckup is 100x more plausible than that it was crazy product placement. Come on. I’m 99% sure you’re right. A few months ago, I would have been 100% sure. But I was fairly shocked by their cross-promotion with Bud Light for the Super Bowl. I would have bet my eyeteeth that HBO would not drag the prestige of their flagship show, and its meticulously crafted alt-medieval suspension of disbelief, into such a lowbrow anachronism–but they did. \*More than anything, the lid just looks wrong for Starbucks–unless they use a different shape of lid for talls, which my wife and I never order. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-8-04-the-last-of-the-starks-5-5-2019-show-discussion/833524.md?page=22)