# Game of Thrones, Baelor, 6/12/11 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 12, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243 "2011-06-12T20:19:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/201 "2011-06-14T23:08:02Z")
I love when Jorah caught the khopesh against his side. It’s really cool that his armor is why he won that fight. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/202 "2011-06-14T23:14:24Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > I love when Jorah caught the khopesh against his side. It’s really cool that his armor is why he won that fight. Specially after he had a scene in an earlier episode explaining that to someone else. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2011, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/203 "2011-06-14T23:40:33Z")
That plus we’ve already had a fight in which heavy armour proved to be a downfall. It’s kind of nice to see that it’s skill and knowledge of how an enemy will fight that carry the day, rather than a particular all-powerful style. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/204 "2011-06-15T01:15:26Z")
> [@Revenant\_Threshold](#): > > That plus we’ve already had a fight in which heavy armour proved to be a downfall. It’s kind of nice to see that it’s skill and knowledge of how an enemy will fight that carry the day, rather than a particular all-powerful style. Not only that, but think about how often in TV and movies that armor actually proves to be worth anything - pretty much never, IME. It was good to see it serve a purpose as something in a show, apart from a uniform. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Estilicon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Estilicon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Estilicon)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/205 "2011-06-15T02:33:07Z")
> [@Spoke](#): > > That whole scene seemed unrealistic to me. Why would they have Ned make a confession to a crowd of subjects? He could easily have stolen that moment to announce the queen’s incest and Joffrey’s illegitimacy to the assembled citizenry. Doesn’t make sense that the queen would have given him any such opening (even if he didn’t actually take it). It is not unrealistic. As an example see the death of [Jacques of Molay](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_de_Molay#Death), the last Templar Grand Master. " “The cardinals dallied with their duty until March 19, 1314, when, on a scaffold in front of Notre Dame, Jacques de Molay, Templar Grand Master, Geoffroi de Charney, Master of Normandy, Hugues de Peraud, Visitor of France, and Godefroi de Gonneville, Master of Aquitaine, were brought forth from the jail in which for nearly seven years they had lain, to receive the sentence agreed upon by the cardinals, in conjunction with the Archbishop of Sens and some other prelates whom they had called in. Considering the offences which the culprits had confessed and confirmed, the penance imposed was in accordance with rule—that of perpetual imprisonment. The affair was supposed to be concluded when, to the dismay of the prelates and wonderment of the assembled crowd, de Molay and Geoffroi de Charney arose. They had been guilty, they said, not of the crimes imputed to them, but of basely betraying their Order to save their own lives. It was pure and holy; the charges were fictitious and the confessions false. Hastily the cardinals delivered them to the Prevot of Paris, and retired to deliberate on this unexpected contingency, but they were saved all trouble. When the news was carried to Philippe he was furious. A short consultation with his council only was required. The canons pronounced that a relapsed heretic was to be burned without a hearing; the facts were notorious and no formal judgment by the papal commission need be waited for. That same day, by sunset, a pile was erected on a small island in the Seine, the Isle des Juifs, near the palace garden. There de Molay and de Charney were slowly burned to death, refusing all offers of pardon for retraction, and bearing their torment with a composure which won for them the reputation of martyrs among the people, who reverently collected their ashes as relics.” ---
**Author:** ![Estilicon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Estilicon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Estilicon)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/206 "2011-06-15T02:41:16Z")
Jorah Mormont is one of my favourites characters of the books and of the series. The actor who plays him is one of the best of the show. ---
**Author:** ![Annie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/858c86/32.png) [@Annie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/207 "2011-06-15T04:24:58Z")
> [@Estilicon](#): > > Jorah Mormont is one of my favourites characters of the books and of the series. The actor who plays him is one of the best of the show. And he’s really hawt in that armour. 😃 I just rewatched; when they were lining up Ned for the chop, Joffrey had the same maniacal glee on his face as that other little shit, Robyn Arryn, did when he was wanting the ‘bad man to fly!!’. So, Joff’s got the emotional maturity of an unweaned second grader. He looked like he’d just opened a PS3 on Xmas morning. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/208 "2011-06-15T04:34:43Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I watched the episode again last night and tried to hear what Cersei said to Joffrey right after he said “Bring me his head.” Does anyone know, or have closed captioning and can tell me? No CC here, but I listened closely and thought she said, “You must not do this.” ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/209 "2011-06-15T04:46:02Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > No CC here, but I listened closely and thought she said, “You must not do this.” Ac cording to my closed captioning, it was “My son, this is madness.” ---
**Author:** ![drastic\_quench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e36b37/32.png) [@drastic\_quench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drastic_quench)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/210 "2011-06-15T04:56:52Z")
> [@Estilicon](#): > > Jorah Mormont is one of my favourites characters of the books and of the series. The actor who plays him is one of the best of the show. Agreed. He’s like that planet’s Most Interesting Man in the World. “I don’t always cut mens’ heads open, but when I do - I wear armor. Stay armored, my friends.” ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/211 "2011-06-15T05:09:13Z")
Can I just say, once again, that HBO has hit it out ofthe ballpark with this adaptation. Just seeing the emotional reaction from the unspoiled to Ned’s death (and kudos to us book readers that we managed to keep that spoiler) shows that they did it just right. I think I felt that more seeing it on screen than I did reading it in the book (and Sean Bean desreves a lot of credit for that. I hope he’s remembered at Emmy time). The show does feel slightly rushed compared to the books, but that’s always the way with cinematic adaptations. You can’t slavishly transpose every line and pause onto the screen. It’s been very well cast, though, faithful in every way that matters and really succeeeded in making things look the way the reader pictures things. The relative lack of grousing from fanboys and fangirls is a testament to what a great job they’ve done. I’ve read that GRRM has been really pleased with it to, and it may just be the kick in the ass the old man needed to start cranking these things out again. Maybe he’ll actually finish them before he dies. David Gerrold’s Chtorr books, on the other hand, I’ve abandoned all hope for. ---
**Author:** ![Pazu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pazu/32/15522_2.png) [@Pazu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pazu)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/212 "2011-06-15T05:38:52Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I also noticed a definite Christ-at-Golgotha vibe to Ned in his last scene - facing an angry crowd, calm if somewhat stunned as he awaits his fate, with a closeup on his bearded face. I interpreted it as a final, bitter consolation–that he no longer saw Arya at the base of Baelor’s statue, and realized that she wouldn’t have to see what was going to happen. ---
**Author:** ![TheBoltEater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@TheBoltEater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheBoltEater)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/213 "2011-06-15T05:51:28Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Indeed. Contrary to some of the nay-sayers, sparing Ned’s life would have destroyed the heart of the story, in much the same way that Hamlet would have been a different story if everyone had made up at the end. Clearly you need to see [Hamlet 2](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1104733/). ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/214 "2011-06-15T06:02:52Z")
I was put in mind of the Jesus imagery too. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/215 "2011-06-15T12:59:21Z")
> [@Pazu](#): > > I interpreted it as a final, bitter consolation–that he no longer saw Arya at the base of Baelor’s statue, and realized that she wouldn’t have to see what was going to happen. That’s how I interpreted it. He was scanning the crowd for her. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/216 "2011-06-15T13:02:01Z")
Or, less comfortingly, thought she’d abandoned him in his final moments. ---
**Author:** ![Time\_Stranger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5fc32e/32.png) [@Time\_Stranger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Time_Stranger)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/217 "2011-06-15T13:07:41Z")
If Ned specifically told Yoren to get Arya, he wouldn’t have a reason to think Arya had abandoned him. He didn’t want her there watching, he wanted her to be safe. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/218 "2011-06-15T13:18:57Z")
> [@Time\_Stranger](#): > > If Ned specifically told Yoren to get Arya, he wouldn’t have a reason to think Arya had abandoned him. He didn’t want her there watching, he wanted her to be safe. Yes, he quite clearly indicated to Yoren to take care of her. When she’d gone it meant Yoren had, so it was at least a little comfort. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/219 "2011-06-15T13:57:20Z")
You’re probably right, but he couldn’t be sure Yoren had done what he’d asked. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243/220 "2011-06-15T14:13:08Z")
I think it was enough for him to understand that she was no longer getting a clear view of what was happening to him from the a perch on the statue. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-baelor-6-12-11/585243.md?page=12)