# Game of Thrones S3 - open spoilers **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 30, 2013, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362 "2013-03-30T16:23:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 21
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/401 "2013-05-06T20:03:13Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Did Melisandre know who Arya is? If so, I think she’d have taken her for Stannis. As far as them meeting back up, was that a future book spoiler? She also told her that she would kill those people on her wish list (Brown eyes, blue eyes, green eyes). Though I had few doubts that she would do so. I’m a bit affraid of what Martin’s is going to do with Arya. Everybody likes the character, but I fear she might end up as the senseless cold hearted murderer they’re trying to train her to be. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/402 "2013-05-06T20:21:36Z")
Well right now she’s a vengeful murderer carrying out not only assigned assassinations but also personal acts of retribution. She’s a cold-hearted killer already. Viz., the killing of Dareon. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/403 "2013-05-06T21:05:51Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > . Viz., the killing of Dareon. I had to look it up. Somehow, I completely missed/forgotten/misunderstood this event. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/404 "2013-05-06T21:37:56Z")
Someone told me that the opening credits this week had a hint location- the castle Theon is being held at (I’m a book reader, so I know where it is). Did anyone see it? I think it was just passed over in the credit sequence, but I didn’t see it. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/405 "2013-05-06T21:43:40Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Well right now she’s a vengeful murderer carrying out not only assigned assassinations but also personal acts of retribution. She’s a cold-hearted killer already. Viz., the killing of Dareon. Uh, that is not at all what she was doing. She is a Stark from Winterfell, she said so herself right after that killing, he was a deserter from the nightwatch. It wasn’t any more a personal act of retribution and it doesn’t make her any more of a cold hearted killer than Ned for executing that deserter at the beginning of the first book. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/406 "2013-05-06T22:03:56Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Uh, that is not at all what she was doing. She is a Stark from Winterfell, she said so herself right after that killing, he was a deserter from the nightwatch. It wasn’t any more a personal act of retribution and it doesn’t make her any more of a cold hearted killer than Ned for executing that deserter at the beginning of the first book. Ned was the Lord of Winterfell, the Warden of the North, and the recognized arbiter of the law in the region. Arya is none of those things. She’s not even an adult—even King Joffrey is subject to the rule of a Regent because he’s not of age. And she’s not even in a country where that law is applicable. She did it because she was personally offended by Dareon’s desertion, and she took his life into her own hands. It was cold, and it was unnecessary, and to top it off, it was in violation of the rules she was living under at the House of Black and White, where she was instructed not to act out in any way that Arya Stark would act. So she acted completely without any authority—she killed Dareon solely because she wanted to. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/407 "2013-05-06T22:17:28Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Ned was the Lord of Winterfell, the Warden of the North, and the recognized arbiter of the law in the region. Arya is none of those things. She’s not even an adult—even King Joffrey is subject to the rule of a Regent because he’s not of age. > > And she’s not even in a country where that law is applicable. She did it because she was personally offended by Dareon’s desertion, and she took his life into her own hands. > > It was cold, and it was unnecessary, and to top it off, it was in violation of the rules she was living under at the House of Black and White, where she was instructed not to act out in any way that Arya Stark would act. > > So she acted completely without any authority—she killed Dareon solely because she wanted to. I strongly disagree. She killed him because she is a Stark and she saw it as her duty, something that has been instilled into her her whole life. That death sentence stands no matter where the deserter goes and as far as she was concerned she was likely the last Stark around and most certainly the only one who would ever be able to carry it out. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/408 "2013-05-06T22:29:07Z")
Well, we’re going to have to disagree. It was not her business to carry that sentence out. To the extent that she told herself that it was her business, she was just rationalizing her own impulse to murder. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/409 "2013-05-06T23:16:07Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Ned was the Lord of Winterfell, the Warden of the North, and the recognized arbiter of the law in the region. Arya is none of those things. She’s not even an adult—even King Joffrey is subject to the rule of a Regent because he’s not of age. > > And she’s not even in a country where that law is applicable. She did it because she was personally offended by Dareon’s desertion, and she took his life into her own hands. > > It was cold, and it was unnecessary, and to top it off, it was in violation of the rules she was living under at the House of Black and White, where she was instructed not to act out in any way that Arya Stark would act. > > So she acted completely without any authority—she killed Dareon solely because she wanted to. You’re appealing to the rules of a murder cult to condemn her actions? If any of her kills are unambiguously murder it’s the merchant that she kills on the orders of the faceless men. She’s basically a bounty hunter killing a fugitive that’s guilty of a capital crime. The only fucked up part of it is that Dareon was probably innocent of the rape that sent him to the Wall. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/410 "2013-05-06T23:59:57Z")
No, that’s not the only fucked up thing about it. She is a child without office without authority, without public trust deciding on her own to adjudged a stranger guilty of a capital crime and killing him with stealth, not with a finding of his guilt, not by sentencing him to his face and executing him in any manner at all that is usual in her society. It is not a rule in Westeros that any old person walking around can decide in her own mind that another person is deserving of execution and sneaking up behind him and slitting his throat. Even a bounty hunter or assassin carries out his duty under someone else’s instructions. Arya is a vengeful, cold killer. Right now she occasionally kills with a “hot” heart (vengeance) but she’s being taught to be cold-hearted. ---
**Author:** ![HazelNutCoffee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@HazelNutCoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HazelNutCoffee)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/411 "2013-05-07T00:10:06Z")
I don’t think Gendry will die. In the book they just use Edric’s blood, right? They don’t kill him, they just use leeches to collect his blood and curse the three kings still living. Melisandre wanted to do more with him (use his blood to waken the stone dragon, I think) but the Onion Knight helped him escape. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/412 "2013-05-07T00:12:26Z")
Here’s something I came across in the first book – Renly shows Ned a locket with a cameo painting of Margaery and is disappointed when Ned tells him that she doesn’t look like Lyanna. Did anything come of that? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/413 "2013-05-07T01:23:06Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Here’s something I came across in the first book – Renly shows Ned a locket with a cameo painting of Margaery and is disappointed when Ned tells him that she doesn’t look like Lyanna. Did anything come of that? Renly was plotting with Loras to get Robert to divorce/kill Cersei and marry Margaery. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/414 "2013-05-07T02:19:15Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > It was cold, and it was unnecessary, and to top it off, it was in violation of the rules she was living under at the House of Black and White, where she was instructed not to act out in any way that Arya Stark would act. In fact, that same evening she gets effectively punished by the Kindly Man for doing so, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/415 "2013-05-07T05:22:21Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Someone told me that the opening credits this week had a hint location- the castle Theon is being held at (I’m a book reader, so I know where it is). Did anyone see it? I think it was just passed over in the credit sequence, but I didn’t see it. Isn’t Theon in the basement of the Dreadfort, bolton’s place? If so, we just saw Jaime and Brienne there, which explains why it’s in the credits. ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/416 "2013-05-07T05:32:05Z")
> [@JSexton](#): > > Isn’t Theon in the basement of the Dreadfort, bolton’s place? If so, we just saw Jaime and Brienne there, which explains why it’s in the credits. Aren’t Roose/Jaime/Brienne in Harrenhal? ---
**Author:** ![Reverse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@Reverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reverse)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/417 "2013-05-07T14:22:25Z")
> [@magnusblitz](#): > > Aren’t Roose/Jaime/Brienne in Harrenhal? Yes, Roose Bolton is in command of Harrenhal, which is concidered to be in the south by the northerners (“We’re fighting for the north. Harrenhal is not of the north”, as the King himself said). The bastard of Bolton is torturing Theon somewhere in the north (during their outdoors camping trip, Theon would’ve noticed if they weren’t in the north), probably the Dreadfort. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/418 "2013-05-07T14:36:52Z")
> [@HazelNutCoffee](#): > > I assume Tywin died before he could get around to teaching Joffery a sharp lesson. It would have been interesting to see if Tywin could have found a way to **reign** him in at some point… Pun intended? > [@SecretaryofEvil](#): > > …AFFC only really needed about half as many Brienne POVs as it had… Heresy! Heresy, I say! ---
**Author:** ![SecretaryofEvil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SecretaryofEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecretaryofEvil)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/419 "2013-05-07T22:48:47Z")
A dude called **Elendil’s Heir** is apparently completely fine with this statement: > [@SecretaryofEvil](#): > > I’ve always found the LOTR series highly overrated. But calls me a heretic for claiming in the same post that Brieene’s trip to Crab Claw Point could have happened in one chapter instead of six. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2013, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362/420 "2013-05-08T03:33:29Z")
Lots of people don’t like LOTR, and I’ve made my peace with that. But you diss “Brieene” [sic] at your peril. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362.md?page=20) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-s3-open-spoilers/654362.md?page=22)