# Game of Thrones: What's the big deal? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 11, 2013, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584 "2013-09-11T17:36:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2013, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/41 "2013-09-15T02:29:18Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > I was under the impression that the largest influence is the War of the Roses: Lancaster=Lannister and York=Stark. That might be (and the names seem pretty clear), but I was referring to the intense treachery and vindictiveness, which i hadn’t heard associated with the WotR. Martin, as I say, explicitly acknowledges the influence of the French succession in general and of Druon’s books (and the TV series – more than one – that appeared on French TV) in particular as influences on GoT ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2013, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/42 "2013-09-15T12:36:50Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > Does anyone else say George “RR” Martin like Mork from Ork? Just me? Okay. > > StG I hadn’t before, but now I will. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2013, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/43 "2013-09-15T20:04:36Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > Does anyone else say George “RR” Martin like Mork from Ork? Just me? Okay. > > StG Which is how? ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/44 "2013-09-16T03:00:38Z")
> [@bump](#): > > The books add so much more to the story that I think you’re doing yourself a disservice if you like the TV show by not reading the books. I completely disagre. It’s one of those rare cases where the show is better than the original material. I’d encourage watchers not to read the book beforehand and not to be spoiled. You can read them after having watched the corresponding season, I guess, in order more in-depth information. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/45 "2013-09-16T03:01:47Z")
> [@bibliophage](#): > > I’m a fan of both the books and the TV series, even though I find both very hard to follow if I’m not paying strict attention. The books have literally thousands of characters. As someone who has trouble remembering names, I find it hell to keep up. But the story is so fascinating that I can’t give it up. I make frequent use of the [Wki of Ice and Fire](http://awoiaf.westeros.org/) to remind me of who’s who and what’s what. You’re highly likely to spoil yourself if you read the wiki. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/46 "2013-09-16T04:48:21Z")
> [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](#): > > Which is how? I think by pronouncing the RR part like a seal’s bark: “Arrh! Arrh!” ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/47 "2013-09-16T14:10:14Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > I completely disagre. It’s one of those rare cases where the show is better than the original material. I’d encourage watchers not to read the book beforehand and not to be spoiled. You can read them after having watched the corresponding season, I guess, in order more in-depth information. I don’t know… knowing some of the back story let me ground a lot of what was going on in seasons 2 and 3 in those backstories. I think my tv-watching experience would have been much poorer without knowing what was going on behind the scenes. For example, Ser Loras Tyrell isn’t just this gay knight; he’s considered the most handsome and is also considered to be a martial bad-ass in the same league as Jaime Lannister. They don’t go into that either; he’s considered to be, if not the most fearsome fighter in the 7 kingdoms, one of the top 2-3. The TV show doesn’t really show that- he’s just this asshole Kingsguard guy who’s Cersei’s brother. There’s a lot of that kind of thing that’s vitally important in understanding why the characters do what they do; none of them are as black or white as in the TV show, and that’s part of the magic of the story in the book. The TV show either glosses over it or uses really ham-handed ways to try and show the viewer in 15 seconds what GRRM might have hinted at in bits and pieces over the course of 300 0 pages. ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/48 "2013-09-17T23:30:39Z")
> [@bump](#): > > For example, Ser Loras Tyrell isn’t just this gay knight; he’s considered the most handsome and is also considered to be a martial bad-ass in the same league as Jaime Lannister. They don’t go into that either; he’s considered to be, if not the most fearsome fighter in the 7 kingdoms, one of the top 2-3. The TV show doesn’t really show that- he’s just this asshole Kingsguard guy who’s Cersei’s brother. About Loras; it seems, at least in the first two seasons, every time we see Loras he’s getting beaten on instead of showing off his awesome skills. First the Mountain nearly kills him, then Brienne bests him. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/49 "2013-09-17T23:48:56Z")
We don’t _see_ Ser Loras fight much, but the show has two or three scenes where people talk about his skill at arms. And remember, Loras _wins_ the joust with the Mountain. He is then in trouble for a moment only because the Mountain attacks him, illegally, when he is unprepared. Brienne does beat him, but everyone is surprised at this, which is telling (for both of them). Likewise there are some references to his beauty. I really don’t think that the books are necessary background at all for these characterizations–if viewers are willing to watch very closely. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584/50 "2013-09-18T00:16:19Z")
And there are many references to Jaime’s prowess. Early on there is the exchange between him and Ned about tournaments, when it is clear that both are significant fighters whose measure against one another may be deadly earnest. (Ned’s own skill is elsewhere noted by Ser Barristan.) How about Jaime against Ned’s man Jory? What about the (offscreen, but strongly attested) fight where he is captured by Stark bannermen, at great cost? Against Brienne (who we know is superb), Jaime is fighting at immense disadvantage, but still has a trick or two. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/game-of-thrones-whats-the-big-deal/668584.md?page=2)