# Gamergate
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [September 5, 2014, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596 "2014-09-05T17:43:47Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 27
### Author:  [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/521 "2014-09-21T18:19:14Z")
I haven’t played Lollipop Chainsaw but, watching some of the cut scenes, it strikes me as more of a _Planet Terror_/Cherry Darling tongue-in-cheek “Yes, this is intentionally ridiculous; that’s the point” thing than a Buffy the Vampire thing.
Within the context of its intentional absurdity, Juliet’s uniform makes more “sense” to me than, say, Jill Valentine killing zombies in a miniskirt for days on end (which we’re supposed to be taking straight-faced).
---
### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/522 "2014-09-21T19:50:04Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#):
>
> Are you not familiar with one of the first images used to promote Buffy? [It was this one](http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ogSV1vWwLlg/UR_AK8SCjHI/AAAAAAAAHug/I_5b32fRp5U/s640/buffy1.jpg)
Notice how there’s her face, there ? Above the boobies ?
I mean, yes, that’s a pretty bad shot (marketing :rolleyes:), but it’s still a photo of a person. Not just a _body_. Right ?
> [@](#):
>
> And on Firefly, our introduction to River is as a naked girl in a box. [Like so](http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/River-Box.jpg)
Reference/homage to another work (Ghost in the Shell IIRC). Doesn’t count ! My literary commentary, my rules ! 🙂 Joke aside, “River in the box” is more about evoking notions of “fetal, newborn =\> innocent, pure but vulnerable” than catering to prurient interest IMO.
> [@](#):
>
> I definitely won’t argue that Lollipop Chainsaw is a good representation of women in video games, but everything about it beyond Juliet’s sexy presentation is super innocent.
Isn’t that like saying that everything about Anders Breivik beyond his mass murder and repugnant screeds is super innocent ? 😛
[QUOTE=Jophiel]
Within the context of its intentional absurdity, Juliet’s uniform makes more “sense” to me than, say, Jill Valentine killing zombies in a miniskirt for days on end (which we’re supposed to be taking straight-faced).
[/QUOTE]
It does, I agree - but that intentional absurdity does not \*have \*to include upskirt booty shots or drawn out pans over The Goods, does it ?
Like, there are times where it’s quite clear they’re going for the surreal parallel of Juliet preoccupation about her looks and still looking totally hot in the middle of a zombie apocalypse… with her boyfriend’s severed head stuck to her belt…; and there are times where it’s pure “you should probably be fapping right about now”.
---
### Author:  [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/523 "2014-09-21T20:02:09Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#):
>
> I want to remind you that you have no direct information about “what went down.” It appears to be based entirely on secondhand accounts from people with axes to grind, with no quotes about what Quinn actually said. Do you really feel you have solid enough information to condemn Quinn as strongly as you have?
Second-hand information from a private conversation, which I wasn’t privy to? Or should I dig through Quinn’s entire twitter feed looking for it? I’ve seen it confirmed by so many different sources that I find it entirely believable.
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> Actually, from a capitalist standpoint that’s a gigantic untapped market - the essence of the consumer society is to make you want to buy shit you don’t need.
> Even the comic industry is tentatively starting to grok that - hence the appearance of gay characters, non-WASP non-stereotypes characters, Thor becoming female and even a handful of superheroines _gasp_ not being relegated 100% to being T&A vehicles any more.
>
> I totally can. Watch me :). I also blame the industry for not taking any risks from game design or artistic standpoints. Motherfucking suits killed the medium as they were saving it, man. Screw the Man.
This is a byproduct of me being jaded. I also don’t “blame” the industry for not taking risks. Because I’m stupid, and I _totally should blame them for both_. :smack:
> [@](#):
>
> I (and many gamers my age) don’t particularly like overly sexy/sexualized women in my games. The “chainmail bikini” effect earns an eyeroll, not a wolf whistle. Blatant fanservice turns me \*away \*from a game, not towards it. Does that have anything to do with me being, well, a \*grown-ass man \*?
Don’t expect me to understand how the marketing department thinks.
> [@](#):
>
> See, that would be exactly what I’m talking about, because I really have a love/disgust relationship with this game.
>
> On the one hand, yes, it’s pretty fun, it doesn’t take itself seriously, I totally grok the whole absurd valley girl against Heavy Metal Zombie Satan spin. And I actually enjoy Juliet Starling’s ditzy character and her relationship w/ her insane family and boyfriend’s head. It’s all good, mindless absurdist gruesome fun.
> On the \*other \*hand, does the character gain anything from the skimpy cheerleader design, the constant upskirt/underboobage camera angles and so forth (and her default skin is really the least offensive of them, because some of the unlockable alternate costumes are just a giant pile of NOPE) ? Would her character lose any appeal if she wore, say, a pair of designer jeans and some pop-rock t-shirt ? Like a real high school popular person type ? So yes, she’s definitely objectified and overtly sexualized.
>
> Yes, yes, Mr Gunn & associates, I get it, ha ha, it’s satirical, it’s deliberate, it’s all a meta directorial joke, it’s a commentary on the absurdity and tastefulness of the cheerleader concept and American high school culture… BUT YOU’RE _STILL DOING IT_ YOURSELF, ASSHOLE. And a large part of your playerbase, not to mention your own fucking marketing department, is playing it deadly straight !
> There are parts of LC that made me physically, literally cringe. It’s that bad.
I don’t know, honestly. It comes back to the issue of “when is a character merely a sex symbol”. And that’s a fairly uncomfortable and very subjective discussion. Obviously, characters like Juliet, Lara Croft, and Bayonetta are meant to be attractive, at times almost ridiculously so. Does this make them bad characters? Does this make them exist solely for the sake of titillating the male audience? I mean, in the case of, say, the new Starfire it’s pretty easy to tell - you have a character with a fairly classic, universally-beloved interpretation being turned into a flirty, sexy, rather dull “adult” version. As much as The Amazing Atheist tries badly to defend that (the video where he complained about feminists not liking the New 52 incarnation of that character was the one that finally convinced me to unsubscribe - god, what a tool), the point is that these changes were not for the sake of the character - they were for the sake of sex appeal. But what about these characters? What about Ivy, or Mai Sharanui, or any number of other badass action girls clearly in charge of their own destiny who happen to be built like a lamppost with melons taped to the side? And it gets even more complicated when you look at, say, Bayonetta, and realize that for all intents and purposes this appears to be [a character designed with “exhibition as empowerment” as a major design element](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnkoLGiF1K8)- that is, her character intentionally and joyfully derives power from her sexuality and showing it off, like the women who do porn because they genuinely enjoy doing porn. I dunno.
---
### Author:  [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/524 "2014-09-21T20:34:39Z")
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> It does, I agree - but that intentional absurdity does not \*have \*to include upskirt booty shots or drawn out pans over The Goods, does it ?
No, but that doesn’t make them objectively “bad” or harmful either. I’m not going to work too hard to defend a game I haven’t played but the over-the-top sexuality was part of what made me compare it to _Planet Terror_. We didn’t need to see Cherry Darling dance either but I understand that it played a greater role in the director’s vision than just “fap fap fap”. Neither are the apex of their particular media or anything but I can see where both at least attempting to use the sex appeal of the protagonist as part of the entire package as opposed to just tacking it on because “boobs”.
I’m just speaking personally but, on the “stupid fanservice” scale, it bothers me less (such as it bothers me at all which is pretty little) than my previous example of Jill Valentine killing zombies in a miniskirt or Lara Croft jungle spelunking in a pair of khaki hotpants. Those games we’re supposed to be taking seriously and a serious protagonist would put some damn pants on in their situation. Lollipop Chainsaw isn’t working under the premise and the sexuality is part of the absurdity.
---
### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/525 "2014-09-21T20:41:30Z")
Yay, \*Bayonetta \*is something apart - it’s very odd really, that playing a game about a deliberately, over the top sex bomb with impossible legs, who poledances in cutscenes, paddles her enemies’ buttocks, seemingly cannot utter a sentence that doesn’t include innuendo and featuring _constant_ ass shots… doesn’t \*feel \*even a little bit skeevy to me.
I’m not sure I get it, or why. Maybe she’s so sexualized, she does a full revolution and goes back to positive representation :), I’unno either.
On the other hand, you can clearly see the “TITTAYS !” evolution of Ivy. Every game she gains a cup size while her bra sheds square inches. I mean, she was always a sultry character (whip it, whip it goood) but it’s visibly getting worse. [Same goes for Sophitia](http://a.imageshack.us/img840/5392/soulcalibur.jpg) - who’s supposed to be a gorram Vestal of Athena ! Chastity incarnate ! The job title where, if you have the temerity of even _getting raped_, Athena turns you into a snake person ! AGH !
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### Author:  [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/526 "2014-09-21T21:22:47Z")
Oh do not even get me started on Sophitia. Just no. Ivy and Tira at least have the personality excuse; Soph is just gratuitious boobage for boobage’s sake in way that doesn’t even make sense with the character. _Especially_ given that her more brash sister is considerably more modest. Come the fuck on. Speaking of which: a ninja with J cups? _Really?_ If it weren’t for that I’d not complain about Taki, but ninjas don’t have tits like that. Especially in bright red jumpsuits with no support. At least they haven’t sexualized fucking Talim yet. I hope.
(That said, Lizardman x Astaroth and Nightmare x Astaroth are shockingly erotic. Torture porn ftw.)
---
### Author:  [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/527 "2014-09-21T23:00:34Z")
For those of who, like me, are unfamiliar with this online boogieman 4chan, here’s a [guide](http://www.vox.com/2014/9/2/6096815/4chan-explainer-questions).
---
### Author:  [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2014, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/528 "2014-09-21T23:13:46Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#):
>
> Second-hand information from a private conversation, which I wasn’t privy to? Or should I dig through Quinn’s entire twitter feed looking for it? I’ve seen it confirmed by so many different sources that I find it entirely believable.
Given the orchestrated campaign of lies here, I’m pretty skeptical of any claim about this situation unless I’m seeing primary sources. Are all the different sources you’re seeing for claims about her criticisms sourced back to TFYC and/or 4chan? If so, I think your trust in them is unwarranted.
---
### Author:  [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/529 "2014-09-22T03:59:01Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#):
>
> For those of who, like me, are unfamiliar with this online boogieman 4chan, here’s a [guide](http://www.vox.com/2014/9/2/6096815/4chan-explainer-questions).
That’s got to be the most disgustingly fair assessment of 4chan I’ve ever seen.
---
### Author:  [@bosbfdsfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bosbfdsfd)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/530 "2014-09-22T04:24:28Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#):
>
> I. DON’T. CARE. ABOUT. ZOE. QUINN.
Sure you do, there’s no reason to lie.
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#):
>
> No, this is about the fact that you, **bosbfdsfd** , have chosen to take your stand with a pack of rabid Internet shitheels who think that publishing credit card and bank account information, harassing friends and family, posting violent rape fantasies, and phoning in bomb threats is an appropriate response to a woman who _said things on the Internet that they don’t like_. And the fact that you dismiss this as simply “a campaign to embarrass and ridicule” her suggests to me that you think this is perfectly okay.
Again, be sure to quote my posts where I said any of the above was okay. Put it right here. ---------------\>
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#):
>
> Which tells me all I need to know about _you_.
But whatever you do, don’t address the substance of my arguments, or gamergate’s, because you, and Quinn, cannot, since it completely demolishes her credibility 🙂
---
### Author:  [@bosbfdsfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bosbfdsfd)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/531 "2014-09-22T04:35:14Z")
> [@BigT](#):
>
> So I won’t bother with any other points, then, even though I still disagree.
>
> No, /v/ did it because they hated Zoe Quinn and Zoe Quinn was who TFYC blamed for what happened to them. You admit it yourself that the whole idea was to spite Quinn.
>
> And the reason why /v/ hated Quinn was the misogynist dump by her boyfriend.
That “misogynist” dump that proved Quinn engaged in private and public conduct that directly contradicted her claims to being a feminist. So, after spending months lying to and attacking gamers, it turns out she’s of the classic “do as I say, not as I do” moral crusaders. People don’t like being called names and derided by hypocrites, funnily enough.
> [@BigT](#):
>
> They hated her before they heard of anything with TFYC, which means they didn’t hate her for what she did there.
>
> Furthermore, the agreed upon deal allowed them to create a character, one Vivian James, who pretty much everyone has decried as misogynist and sexist.
Who is this “everyone” you’re referring to? Can you go ahead and list their names here? --------------\>
> [@BigT](#):
>
> So even if some people who donated did it for good reasons, that doesn’t change the fact that TFYC got in bed with the misogynists from /v/.
They “got in bed” with charitable donors who spent over $20,000 to help a female-generated video game get made. Despite Sarkeesian’s and Quinn’s attempts to shut it down, because these particular feminists were doing something unheard of to third-wavers, expending effort and creating something worthwhile, instead of whining.
> [@BigT](#):
>
> Any money given to spite Zoe Quinn was because of the boyfriend’s letter, and the boyfriend’s letter was misogynist. /v/ hated Quinn because they accepted the misogyny. There’s no way to get around the fact that TFYC got the money they did because of the misogynists at /v/.
There’s every way to get around it since the narrative doesn’t conform to your lies.
> [@BigT](#):
>
> Hang out at 4chan and even /v/ all you want. But if you join in the hate campaign against Quinn, you are joining a misogynist group. It started with misogyny and continues to promote misogyny. As long as that is so, there can be no legitimate gripes.
>
> Next time they want to attack someone, they should maybe not do it because they believe she is some sort of prostitute. When that is your foundation, everything else still misogyny.
Just a question, do you get a dollar every time you say “misogyny?”
---
### Author:  [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/532 "2014-09-22T04:36:39Z")
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> Yay, \*Bayonetta \*is something apart - it’s very odd really, that playing a game about a deliberately, over the top sex bomb with impossible legs, who poledances in cutscenes, paddles her enemies’ buttocks, seemingly cannot utter a sentence that doesn’t include innuendo and featuring _constant_ ass shots… doesn’t \*feel \*even a little bit skeevy to me.
> I’m not sure I get it, or why. Maybe she’s so sexualized, she does a full revolution and goes back to positive representation :), I’unno either.
>
> On the other hand, you can clearly see the “TITTAYS !” evolution of Ivy. Every game she gains a cup size while her bra sheds square inches. I mean, she was always a sultry character (whip it, whip it goood) but it’s visibly getting worse. [Same goes for Sophitia](http://a.imageshack.us/img840/5392/soulcalibur.jpg) - who’s supposed to be a gorram Vestal of Athena ! Chastity incarnate ! The job title where, if you have the temerity of even _getting raped_, Athena turns you into a snake person ! AGH !
Bayonetta is a really, really tricky thing. On one hand, it’s obviously pandering to a sorta male-gazey audience. That’s not necessarily okay. But the thing that makes her better in my eyes is that **in-universe** , that is, ignoring the fact that the camera is there and us players are watching it, she’s not doing it for anyone. She’s a woman that likes sex, and likes to look sexy and dress up. But she’s doing it for herself.
She’s not doing it for anyone and shows absolutely no sexual interest in any of the men in the cast of the game itself. In fact, she regularly goes out of her way to demean them. Now, yes, from a meta perspective this is basically just playing to Kamiya’s obvious sub fetish, but if you separate the art from knowledge about other things Kamiya has made it’s a unique take on female sexuality and not one I think we should wholly discount because of meta reasons.
That said, part of the problem is that she’s not a very good **character** , she barely has any motivation. But it’s a Platinum game, **every** Platinum game has paper-thin plot and characterization, so accepting the game for what it is I think Bayonetta has some very good points, even if there are also obvious issues with the game (especially the marketing of the first game in Japan).
---
### Author:  [@bosbfdsfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bosbfdsfd)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/533 "2014-09-22T04:39:31Z")
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> That’s a circular argument.
>
> And that’s a false equivalence. Heavy consumers of TV, male or female and everything in between, have a vast spectre of TV to choose from. Heavy consumer of VGs, particularly multiplayer ones, \*cannot \*get away from the toxic aspects of “gamer culture”. BOYS ONLY, NO GURLS ALLOWED !
That’s strange. I wasn’t aware there was some kind of electric prod sold with every video game that detects whether the user has a uterus or not, then proceeds to shock them so they’re not able to play those games.
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> If there was a “video gaming Oprah” (don’t ask me what that’d look like) _there wouldn’t be a problem in the first place_, would there ?
>
> Also, when she said, in full avuncular condescension mode, “Do boys like to have objectified women in their games ? Of course ! They’re boys, and that’s fine !”, I was rolling my eyes so hard I think I saw my throat. Fuck her.
Yeah, how dare she state facts that reflect reality and extant market conditions. What an idiot 🙂
---
### Author:  [@bosbfdsfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bosbfdsfd)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/534 "2014-09-22T04:43:05Z")
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> Soo… “Why no, **Kobal** , I don’t see anything wrong with this picture, I think you’re reaching with this objectification stuff of yours” ? It doesn’t really matter if it’s meant to be (or rather, if it _can be_, because Suda51 is kind of a basement dweller in general) taken as deconstruction - and I’m not even sure that particular PoV on the game is really meant to be, or if it’s just my brain trying to find ways to play this game without feeling dirty. It’s still pretty uncomfortable to watch.
And who was it that was forcing you to watch it?
---
### Author:  [@bosbfdsfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bosbfdsfd)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/535 "2014-09-22T04:44:46Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#):
>
> 1. The content of the letter–advising people not to harass or threaten people–is wholly 100% uncontroversial except to emotionally stunted sociopaths like yourself.
Not when it’s done as a diversionary tactic, and explicitly leaves out games journalists and games developers. Sorry 🙂
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### Author:  [@bosbfdsfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bosbfdsfd)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/536 "2014-09-22T04:47:54Z")
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> Actually, from a capitalist standpoint that’s a gigantic untapped market
No it’s a nonexistent one. Sorry.
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> I (and many gamers my age) don’t particularly like overly sexy/sexualized women in my games.
That’s nice. Too bad you’re numerically insignificant in the game-buying arena.
---
### Author:  [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/537 "2014-09-22T06:16:00Z")
> [@bosbfdsfd](#):
>
> That’s strange. I wasn’t aware there was some kind of electric prod sold with every video game that detects whether the user has a uterus or not, then proceeds to shock them so they’re not able to play those games.
Christ aren’t you just a wonderful little clueless misogynist. Fun fact: when you make a game entirely around the sensibilities of one gender, it has less of a pull to the other gender. When you, in addition to this, provide elements that are explicitly alienating to women, you get what we have right now.
> [@](#):
>
> Yeah, how dare she state facts that reflect reality and extant market conditions. What an idiot 🙂
:smack:
You do realize that saying “well it’s accurate” to a strawman completely undermines your argument, right? _That’s not her position!_
---
### Author:  [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/538 "2014-09-22T06:32:28Z")
> [@bosbfdsfd](#):
>
> That’s nice. Too bad you’re numerically insignificant in the game-buying arena.
Really? Because I think the majority of game buyers are people like \*\*Kobal2 \*\*and me - grownups with careers and lives and interests outside of gaming. It is you, in fact, who is an insignificant minority, an as soon as the game manufacturers realize this, you’re history.
---
### Author:  [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/540 "2014-09-22T13:41:53Z")
> [@bosbfdsfd](#):
>
> No it’s a nonexistent one. Sorry.
Are you really being this argumentative? Do you not know what the ESA says about gaming’s demographics. It’s a total split down the middle. Men and women are equal players. Men likely spend more, but pretending that women don’t play games at all would be A) foolish for publishers and B) absolutely moronic for anyone else to claim.
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### Author:  [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2014, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gamergate/697596/541 "2014-09-22T14:36:39Z")
> [@blindboyard](#):
>
> Latest happenings:
> **Dork** : [Open letter to the gaming community | by Andreas Zecher | Medium](https://medium.com/@andreaszecher/open-letter-to-the-gaming-community-df4511032e8a)
> Of course the people who actually signed it include those not on the secret mailing list, like a board game company and mass-murderer Anders Breivik, but it’s as credible as anything else put out by your SJW crowd.
I can’t believe this has gone unaddressed for a page, beucause I think it speaks to **blindy’s** ability to separate truth from fiction. [Anders Behring Breivik](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anders_Behring_Breivik) is a sick fuck of a racist mass murderer. [Anders Lystad Brevik](https://twitter.com/Norwigi) (note the different middle name and spelling of the last name) is a game designer and (as far as I’m aware) hasn’t killed anybody. But the narrative that a mass murderer would sign a letter to Zoe Quinn supporting her is too good to fact check. (Nevermind that it is neither to ZQ, nor does it support her specifically, as LHOD pointed out.) C’mon, **blindy**. Are you so divorced from reality that that didn’t tickle your spider sense even a little? I read the accusation, thought “that doesn’t seem right,” and within 2 minutes of Googleing could say with confidence that they were not the same person. Maybe there are some legitimate complaints about the relationship between the gaming industry and the media that cover it, but the GG story is so full of either negligent reports (like calling a board game designer a mass murderer) or lies that if **blindy** told me the sky were blue, I’d have to go outside and look for myself before I believed him.
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