# Gang robs man, he chases them & rams their car. One robber dies now he is charged with murder **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 9, 2013, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367 "2013-09-09T00:14:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![SirGalahad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/71c47a/32.png) [@SirGalahad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SirGalahad)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2013, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367/81 "2013-09-15T18:58:35Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > The law does not exist simply to make an example of someone. Vigilantism is bad for society as a whole. Whether its done with a gun, a bat or a car. I think violent home invasions are bad for society as a whole, as are pistol whippings of innocent homeowners. The injured party captures the criminal … the only real threat is to the authority of the police. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2013, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367/82 "2013-09-15T19:39:46Z")
> [@SirGalahad](#): > > I think violent home invasions are bad for society as a whole, as are pistol whippings of innocent homeowners. The injured party captures the criminal … the only real threat is to the authority of the police. No, it is a threat to the system that says you can’t punish someone until he or she has been adjudged guilty by society as a whole. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367/83 "2013-09-16T15:35:57Z")
> [@SirGalahad](#): > > But seriously, I think the results of each individual instance of rabid vigilantism should be judged on it’s own merits. That’s a great way to encourage people to do reckless stuff and inadvertently hurt others. It’s not workable because it judges vigilantism entirely on the outcomes. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367/84 "2013-09-16T16:46:03Z")
> [@SirGalahad](#): > > I think violent home invasions are bad for society as a whole, as are pistol whippings of innocent homeowners. The injured party captures the criminal … the only real threat is to the authority of the police. Detaining someone in a “citizen’s arrest” and holding them until the property authorities arrive is perfectly acceptable. Acting as Judge Judy and executioner under the Bronson Doctrine isn’t. Unless you live in Florida. ---
**Author:** ![dstarfire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dstarfire/32/5762_2.png) [@dstarfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dstarfire)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367/85 "2013-09-16T17:53:30Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Well sure. But I don’t think you know how it works. > > 1. You only have a certain number of challenges. > 2. It’s not up to the defense to determine how much of the robbery would be relevant. I would guess that if the defense tried to make it all about the robbery it will be shut down by the judge. > 3. Getting an affirmative defense such as insanity into a trial isn’t quite as easy as you think it is. > 4. He said “I was trying to kill them.” That’s pretty clear. IANAL, but I’d say a “heat of passion” defense would be the way to go. If it doesn’t work, it’s a VERY solid groundwork for proving it wasn’t premeditated. That contradicting mix of “I rammed them, I was trying to kill them.” and “stated he did not intentionally collide into the rear of V2.” Sounds very much like somebody suddenly realizing what they’ve done. Of course, to be fair, it also sounds like somebody suddenly realizing they could get in big trouble for what they’ve done and trying protect themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367/86 "2013-09-16T18:34:47Z")
> [@dstarfire](#): > > IANAL, but I’d say a “heat of passion” defense would be the way to go. So far as I know, this is rarely a complete defense to a charge of murder. It can only be used to try to persuade a court to reduce the sentence after conviction. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gang-robs-man-he-chases-them-rams-their-car-one-robber-dies-now-he-is-charged-with-murder/668367.md?page=4)