# Gaudere, I believe you are in error. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 19, 2004, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897 "2004-05-19T02:53:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/1 "2004-05-19T02:53:46Z")
In [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=256709) , you admonish me for my use of the term “Saddamites” to describe those who supported the continuance of Saddam Hussein’s murderous, terror-supporting regime. I certainly did not intend to violate the rules of the forum and I believe that I did not do so. I contend that your admonition was in error. You said, “it was just two weeks ago where you apologized for not respecting this forum. And yet you call your fellow posters ‘Saddamites’?” Yes to both counts. I respect the forum, but that does not obligate me – indeed, it compels me – to recognize how you intend the forum to work and to react accordingly. There’s no question that you intend for Great Debates to be something of a rough-and-tumble environment; there’s a thread on the first page as I write this which asserts in the title that “Republicans” as a group believe that torture is good. Compared to that, referring to the whackier and more militant of those persons who supported the continuance of Saddam’s regime as “Saddamites” is downright kind. I assert that I was well within your established guidelines when I used that term. It should be noted that I would welcome an overall tightening of posting standards in GD and I would happily comply with any new rules laid down. Indeed, I believe that a radical overhaul of what is allowed and what is not would materially improve the quality of debate. Run a survey of members to see who is scared to post in GD not because of the standards of proof but because of the level of derision which is allowed in the forum and I think you’ll find that I’m not without basis in that assertion. But until and unless that change is made, I believe that my post was well within the bounds you have currently set. You also said, “I allow ‘Bushies’ and ‘Bushites’: to describe people who can be reasonably said to support Bush (and would likely agree to that themselves), who last I checked was NOT regarded by all as a murdering dictator.” That is true in all respects. But. But the persons who use such terms (and I’m thinking “Bushco” right now, as you might be) certainly _believe_ that about President Bush and _intend_ such terms to be terms of derision. I’m not ready to accept that my term of derision is prohibited and theirs is allowed because you believe that mine is rooted in factual correctness and theirs is factually in error – that would go against the very stated purpose of this message board. If I am in error on this, I would of course accept an official ruling by the administration of this message board that people who are stupid are held to a lower standard than people who are not. But it would sadden me. Further, you state that “Saddamite” is “basically the same” as calling someone a Nazi or followed Nazis. This is factually incorrect. Calling a person who supported the continuance of Saddam Hussein’s regime and who continues, over and over again, to cast every new revelation, whether true or not, as “proof” that overthrowing his regime was somehow evil a “Saddamite” is ‘basically the same’ as calling a person who supported the continuance of Hitler’s regime a Nazi. And I daresay that if someone on this boards asserted that Hitler’s regime should have been allowed to continue and should not have been opposed militarily then calling them a Nazi, or at the very least a Hitlerite, would be allowed. Finally, you notice that “Saddamite is a homophone for ‘sodomite’.” Well, yeah. That’s true. In fact, it’s a one-sentence quip to why I’ll likely vote for President Bush come November – the whacko anti-Sodomites in the Republican Party disgust me modestly less than the whacko pro-Saddamites in the Democratic Party. Homophones have never previously been banned in Great Debates. Nonetheless, simply out of personal affection for you and wishing to move on, I’ll certainly agree to use “Saddamists” or similar terms which avoid homophones. Respectfully, I believe your ruling to have been in error and ask you to reconsider. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/2 "2004-05-19T03:06:46Z")
God…what tripe. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/3 "2004-05-19T03:06:48Z")
Oooh, does this mean that we can dig through all of the terrorist, repressive regimes that the US has propped up/installed/supported/allied with for the past 50 years and call you a supporter of them? Goody goody! ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/4 "2004-05-19T03:09:49Z")
> [@manhattan](#): > > In [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=256709) , you admonish me for my use of the term “Saddamites” to describe those who supported the continuance of Saddam Hussein’s murderous, terror-supporting regime. Such as who fer instances? > [@manhattan](#): > > There’s no question that you intend for Great Debates to be something of a rough-and-tumble environment; there’s a thread on the first page as I write this which asserts in the title that “Republicans” as a group believe that torture is good. Which is a remarkably abominable and shitty OP. More a taunt than even a rant, let alone a debate. the charitable view is that by some stretch of the imagination, at best, it would be suitable for The Pit. > [@manhattan](#): > > Calling a person who supported the continuance of Saddam Hussein’s regime Who the hell are you talking about here? Have Uday and Qusay joined the Dope from the dead? Whowanted Husseins regime extended? This smells like a bit like herring, a bit like straw, and a lot like crap. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/5 "2004-05-19T03:10:48Z")
I’ll start. **Manhatten** is a no good plum sucking Castroite. He personally supports the systematic repression and squalid conditions brough about by his pro-Communist regime. And I hear he cried blood when Che died. So remember, folks, don’t vote for Castro lovers this fall. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/6 "2004-05-19T03:15:52Z")
“Saddamites,” eh? I’ll give you points for being reasonably clever in your nomenclature, assuming it’s actually your invention. And I’ll concede that Gaudere’s concern about the pun on “sodomites” is misplaced, despite the quasi-hate-speech aspects of the anti-gay slur on which it is based. That said, lighten the heck up. You’ve been a complete dick in a number of threads very recently, including one or two official rebukes, if memory serves. Deep breaths, **manny**. Your GD post was ill-considered, and your OP here is entirely too indignant for somebody who was clearly acting jerk-ish, if not necessarily being a jerk. Also, I would humbly suggest that equating opposition to “Operation Iraqi Freedom” is equivalent to _support_ for Saddam Hussein is retarded in the extreme. Of course, if you were to actually provide a cite to a group of actual Baathists on the SDMB, maybe you’d have a point. But you can’t do that, so stop with the retardation, already. And in closing to that, shut the hell up unless you have something worth saying, **Reeder**. Then shut the hell up anyway, because I assure you that you _don’t_ have anything worthwhile to say. ---
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/7 "2004-05-19T03:16:20Z")
what? Mods are pitting other MODS now? WHAT is this world coming to???!!! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/8 "2004-05-19T03:17:22Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > God…what tripe. It’s ten times better than any OP you’ve ever posted. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/9 "2004-05-19T03:17:48Z")
He’s not a mod, sweetie. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/10 "2004-05-19T03:18:08Z")
pretty funny. pretty funny. **minty** I just get to likin’ you more and more w/ every post. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/11 "2004-05-19T03:19:33Z")
Oh, I’d also like to state that **Manhattan** has utterly failed (I assume by choice) to adderss any of the replies to his “points” in the original GD thread, suggesting that his argument is based entirely on calling people who disagree with him “Saddamites,” grumbling, and going to bed. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/12 "2004-05-19T03:19:53Z")
> [@minty green](#): > > “Saddamites,” eh? I’ll give you points for being reasonably clever in your nomenclature, assuming it’s actually your invention. Probably not. Google returns 4,290 hits for it, and all appear to be using it in a similar context. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/13 "2004-05-19T03:21:04Z")
> [@Lord Ashtar](#): > > It’s ten times better than any OP you’ve ever posted. It’s not an OP it’s a _whine_. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/14 "2004-05-19T03:22:17Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > It’s not an OP it’s a _whine_. fair eough. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/15 "2004-05-19T03:25:33Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > It’s not an OP it’s a _whine_. And this is different from your threads…how? ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/16 "2004-05-19T03:25:46Z")
Aw shucks, **SimonX** , I think you’re a swell guy too. But I don’t think either one of is a sod-/Saddamite, so I guess we’ll just leave it at that. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/17 "2004-05-19T03:25:49Z")
would you like some cheese with that whine? I know, but its STILL better than any joke by Reeder (Reed, you know I’m kidding…) 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/18 "2004-05-19T03:32:20Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > I’ll start. **Manhatten** is a no good plum sucking Castroite. He personally supports the systematic repression and squalid conditions brough about by his pro-Communist regime. And I hear he cried blood when Che died. > > So remember, folks, don’t vote for Castro lovers this fall. What are you talking about? Castroite? That is a bit rough. The US government does not support Casto, though the US government has been the ultimate Saddimite. So it would it not be in error to call Manhatten a Castroite? Perhaps a Pinochetite, Suhartoite, Mobutuite, Sharonite, Duvalierite or Somozaite. ---
**Author:** ![litost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@litost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/litost)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/19 "2004-05-19T03:33:07Z")
The most egregious error in this OP is the “against Iraq war = pro-Saddam” logical fallacy. I am suprised to see a Doper with a long history and good standing commit such an error. In fact, it is downright pathetic and shameful. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2004, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897/20 "2004-05-19T03:37:09Z")
> [@litost](#): > > The most egregious error in this OP is the “against Iraq war = pro-Saddam” logical fallacy. I am suprised to see a Doper with a long history and good standing commit such an error. In fact, it is downright pathetic and shameful. If it’s true that we indeed have no Baathis here then it’s very, very sad to say that your estimation of the once mighty, feared and revered **manny** is correct. Hubris before humiliation and all that, what? I think even Ms. Coulter has outgrown that one. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaudere-i-believe-you-are-in-error/245897.md?page=2)