# Gay and AIDS are not synonyms, dammit! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 2, 2002, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922 "2002-05-02T20:08:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2002, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/41 "2002-05-04T08:19:47Z")
Erk. The Ryan. When will VBB let us killfile Dopers? s.e., I don’t know how to read JillGat’s remark either. (a little ambiguous.) I think it’s interesting how societal attitudes regarding rape vary depending on the gender of the victim, though. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2002, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/42 "2002-05-04T14:08:48Z")
> [@](#): > > Erk. The Ryan. When will VBB let us killfile Dopers? Doesn’t it let you do so already? Click on his profile and choose “ignore”. ---
**Author:** ![JillGat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9fc29f/32.png) [@JillGat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JillGat)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2002, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/43 "2002-05-04T14:40:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JillGat \* > \*\*[[Once, I went home with someone who essentially tried to rape me, without a condom. (I’m a top, so I don’t like getting poked.) I had to physically force him off of me, and this took about twenty minutes. If I were not concerned with my well-being, would I have done so?]] > > Of course not. You obviously have very high standards when it comes to self-preservation. \*\* Okay, let me explain my sarcasm here (sorry, I don’t use smilies!). You brought home a guy who jumped you. Some might question whether that’s a risky thing to do (no matter your gender) - to get sexually involved with people who are little more than strangers - but that wasn’t even my point. You fought him off apparently not just because he was forcing himself on you, but because _the particular sexual practice he wanted to perform wasn’t the one you like._ And then you use this as an example of how conscious you are of protecting your health. I do think you’ve explained yourself well enough elsewhere, saying that you always use safe sex. But this just wasn’t the best example. Besides, being teased is part of the price you pay for posting here - especially if you share real personal stuff. - Jill [[It’s a different world. Really, it is, and unfortunately most people don’t understand it.]] Yeah, it’s now a world that mostly doesn’t remember even eight years ago when some of us were losing dozens of friends and loved ones - mostly gay men - to this disease. Don’t get mad at us for caring about you. ---
**Author:** ![JillGat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9fc29f/32.png) [@JillGat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JillGat)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2002, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/44 "2002-05-04T14:52:56Z")
I can’t pass up this opportunity to pass on another HIV-prevention tidbit, at the risk of making the OP and our other gay friends pound their heads on the wall (to a disco beat). Actually this point could be made to either gay or straight folks. Guys who are tops (insertive partners) are still very much at risk for getting HIV if they aren’t using condoms (with plenty of lube) and their partners are infected. I’ve now met a number of men with HIV who insisted that they were always tops. Especially now, with a huge syphilis outbreak going on in a number of gay communities, it is even easier to acquire both infections at the same time from anal or oral sex. ps - Anyone who thinks that “AIDS is a gay disease” should know that the best protection for women is to become lesbians. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7feea3/32.png) [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2002, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/45 "2002-05-06T23:01:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > How so? Well, if you say > [@](#): > > My beef is the incessant insertion of AIDS into any SDMB conversation that touches, however tangentially, on gay male sexuality. and then give as your primary example a thread in which the OP states that he is engaging in casual sex, then it makes me wonder why you didn’t give one of those threads that only tangentially touched on gay sexuality, instead of one that involved casual sex. > [@](#): > > **Scott Evil** A) said from thje first sentence that he practiced safe sex, and B) said that he had two steady fuck buddies. “Safe sex” is not the same thing as “risk free sex”, and I don’t see how having “two steady fuck buddies” is relevant. Are you saying that regularly having nonmonogamous sex is better than only occasionly doing so? > [@](#): > > Dude, you are once again way off-base in your reply to a thread. Have you ever considered using GPS while posting? \*\* Have you ever considered saving your rudeness for people that actually mean offense? ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2002, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/46 "2002-05-06T23:15:07Z")
Hmmm… _{checks OP}_ Yup. This isn’t a debate, **The Ryan** - it’s a rant. Now go away. Thank you. Esprix ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/47 "2002-05-07T01:15:42Z")
> [@](#): > > and then give as your primary example a thread in which the OP states that he is engaging in casual sex, then it makes me wonder why you didn’t give one of those threads that only tangentially touched on gay sexuality, instead of one that involved casual sex It wasn’t **about** casual sex! **SE** was talking about his emotional state and whether he should see his two regular fuck buddies. Regular, as in !casual. He was talking about his feelings, and posters kept dragging in AIDS. Rudeness? That was just snappy banter. Darlin’ , if I were rude, I would have said “fuck off” from the gitgo. This is the Pit, I’m ranting, and you are dismissed. ---
**Author:** ![Jester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jester/32/8223_2.png) [@Jester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jester)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/48 "2002-05-07T01:54:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Ryan \* > \*\* > Well, if you say > > and then give as your primary example a thread in which the OP states that he is engaging in casual sex, then it makes me wonder why you didn’t give one of those threads that only tangentially touched on gay sexuality, instead of one that involved casual sex.\*\* **TheRyan** , did you actually read the thread that was referenced, instead of just looking at the title? The only thing that it had to do with casual sex was the fact that **scott evil** is, in fact, having casual sex with the two guys. He didn’t ask about his safety. He didn’t ask whether casual sex was a good idea. He didn’t mention HIV or AIDS at all. But you still think that those warnings, which added nothing to the actual discussion, were warranted. So under your logic, any discussion that had anything to do with driving at all would be open to warnings. For example: Topic Line: Anyone want to carpool to the Dopefest next week? Response: “Oh my God! You’re driving?! Don’t crash!” Topic: I just bought a new car! Response: “have you thought about icy conditions !!!” Topic: Man, Ford Auto Center’s Service really sucks! Response: “Don’t forget to use your brake pedal!” And on, and on, and on. Now imagine that every single thread that mentioned driving had a bunch of “Good Samaratins” come in to warn everybody about it, and you might begin to see why it irks **gobear** and the rest of the homosexual male Dopers so much. Just because a discussion has something to do with a possibly dangerous practice does not mean that warnings about those dangers are welcome or necessary. > [@](#): > > \*\* > “Safe sex” is not the same thing as “risk free sex”, and I don’t see how having “two steady fuck buddies” is relevant. Are you saying that regularly having nonmonogamous sex is better than only occasionly doing so? > \*\* If you read his post again, you’ll see that having “two steady fuck buddies” is a far cry from having rampant nonmonogamous sex. **scott evil** is currently having sexual relations with two and only two men, both of whose HIV status is known, and both of whom are friends as well. He’s not just running around having sex with anything that moves. In fact, he’s currently only one less person away from a monogamous sex life. Got it? ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/49 "2002-05-07T15:46:52Z")
::: applauds **Jester** for stating the issue clearly and with minimal hostility ::: ---
**Author:** ![JillGat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9fc29f/32.png) [@JillGat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JillGat)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/50 "2002-05-07T15:53:22Z")
[[In fact, he’s currently only one less person away from a monogamous sex life.]] Other points well taken, but I still need to correct this. The above statement re. monogamy is only true if his buddies (or one, if he only had one) only have sex with him, too. I was gonna apologize about bringing the implication of AIDS up again, but it’s the title of the thread, so oh well! ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/51 "2002-05-07T16:45:36Z")
**Jill** , while your concern is admirable and always welcome, are you posting similar factual info in threads related to heterosexual sex? You probably are, but I don’t read every thread on the board. Esprix ---
**Author:** ![seawitch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@seawitch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/seawitch)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/52 "2002-05-07T17:03:38Z")
Wait, that was only supposed to be offensive to male homosexual dopers? Apparently I need to have a talk with my husband. Anyway, I think that if the warnings had been posted along the lines of “we care about you”, per **JillGat** ’s take, it would have been less offensive. I didn’t get a sense of caring - rather, one of knee-jerk alarmist crap. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/53 "2002-05-07T17:22:33Z")
I’m giving **Jill** the benefit of the doubt, **seawitch** , because she happens to be an HIV epidemiologist, IIRC. She is The Expert[sup]TM[/sup] in this particular baliwick. Esprix ---
**Author:** ![seawitch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@seawitch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/seawitch)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/54 "2002-05-07T17:41:13Z")
Understood. I was referring to the tone of the posts in the original thread, not to anything **Jill** posted. Sorry I wasn’t clearer. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/55 "2002-05-07T18:00:46Z")
Ah, my mistake. Esprix ---
**Author:** ![Wabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ba9def/32.png) [@Wabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wabbit)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/56 "2002-05-07T22:44:29Z")
Folks folks **folks!**. Everyone should worry about AIDS–doesn’t matter if your gay, straight, bi or into shagging monkeys. As has been pointed out, a virus doesn’t care what your orientation is as long as it gets to reproduce. Having said that, however, I have to say any time I see someone talking about casual sex as if it’s no big deal it’s going to send off warning bells. Now in this case I do think that the warnings were a little off base; **Scott** clearly stated that he practices safe sex which is good (and several of the other overtly gay posters here have also said they practice safe sex–this is a very good thing). However, you can safely assume that any time someone starts posting about how sexually active they are without making the point that they’re using protection (and remember condoms aren’t 100% effective either) I’m going to ask if they’ve considered the consequences. I don’t care if you’re gay or straight or even if I offend you; AIDS is not going to go away simply because we ignore it. Quite simply, it’s something we’ve got to consider every time we engage in intercourse. Anyway, I can understand why the homosexuals on this Board would be angry that the AIDS issue crops up every time they start to discuss sex; quite frankly I’m more disturbed by the MTV shows where they show heterosexual kids scrogging each other on Spring Break than I am by posts here for the simple reason that it’s less likely that they’re using protection. However, please realize that having multiple partners greatly increases your risk and that condoms aren’t fail safe. People reminding you of this doesn’t rate a flame, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/57 "2002-05-07T23:17:17Z")
Hmmmm. Here’s a litmus test - did anyone ever ask the infamous **KayKay** if she was worried about AIDS? **scott** is a virtual newbie, but got it in one of his first threads, and seems to only have talked about it in this one thread. **Kaykay** , another newbie, seemed to _only_ talk about sex in _every_ one of her threads. (OK, maybe it’s not a fair comparison in that respect, but I’m still curious.) Esprix ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7feea3/32.png) [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2002, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/58 "2002-05-07T23:56:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jester \* > **TheRyan** , did you actually read the thread that was referenced, instead of just looking at the title? The only thing that it had to do with casual sex was the fact that **scott evil** is, in fact, having casual sex with the two guys. He didn’t ask about his safety. But he did ask “Or should I refrain from seeing them altogether?” > [@](#): > > He didn’t mention HIV or AIDS at all. But you still think that those warnings, which added nothing to the actual discussion, were warranted. What is wrong with you people? Why am I **constantly** being criticized for things I never said? It must be because I’m striaght :rolleyes:. I can’t recall ever saying that these responses were warranted. > [@](#): > > Now imagine that every single thread that mentioned driving had a bunch of “Good Samaratins” come in to warn everybody about it, and you might begin to see why it irks **gobear** and the rest of the homosexual male Dopers so much. But gobear has presented only one actual thread, and it is nowhere near as ridiculous as the examples for which he **doesn’t** give threads. If he’s so interested in showing anit-homosexual bias, why not link to the **most** ridiculous example, instead of the **least**? > [@](#): > > If you read his post again, you’ll see that having “two steady fuck buddies” is a far cry from having rampant nonmonogamous sex. **scott evil** is currently having sexual relations with two and only two men, both of whose HIV status is known, and both of whom are friends as well. I saw absolutely no mention in the OP that these were the only guys he was having sex with, nor any mention of their HIV status. In fact, he said “We’re also free to meet others”, which implies that they are in fact meeting others (and presumably having sex with them). > [@](#): > > In fact, he’s currently only one less person away from a monogamous sex life. And I’m only one sexual encounter more away from sleeping with Britney Speares :rolleyes:. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2002, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/59 "2002-05-08T01:36:25Z")
> [@](#): > > But gobear has presented only one actual thread, and it is nowhere near as ridiculous as the examples for which he doesn’t give threads. If he’s so interested in showing anit-homosexual bias, why not link to the most ridiculous example, instead of the least? Well, leaving aside the objection that dropping unsolicited safe sex “advice” into a thread about _emotional_ issues, in which the OP states in his _first sentence_ his practice of safer sex, is pretty ridiculous… your wish is my [command.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=109050) ---
**Author:** ![scott\_evil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/91b2a8/32.png) [@scott\_evil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scott_evil)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2002, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922/60 "2002-05-08T14:06:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Ryan \* > **I saw absolutely no mention in the OP that these were the only guys he was having sex with, nor any mention of their HIV status. In fact, he said “We’re also free to meet others”, which implies that they are in fact meeting others (and presumably having sex with them).** Sorry if I was unclear. What I meant was, we’re free to meet others with a view to pursue _romantic_ relations with them. If I meet a fantastic guy and think things might turn into something more serious, I’ll drop the fuckbuddies before getting intimate with the new guy. In any case, I’m about to have to make a decision or two regarding the whole situation, and someone new I met (oh, and don’t just assume that because I met someone new that we jumped into bed), which will probably lead to _yet another fucking thread_ where I ask for advice and be branded as some kind of assfucking disease-spreading whore. 😉 Really, these kinds of things don’t bother me. If they’re meant to, you’re wasting both your typing skills and semantics, **TheRyan**. **matt\_mcl** wrote: > [@](#): > > Well, leaving aside the objection that dropping unsolicited safe sex “advice” into a thread about emotional issues, in which the OP states in his first sentence his practice of safer sex, is pretty ridiculous… Thanks, buddy. 🙂 - s.e. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-and-aids-are-not-synonyms-dammit/106922.md?page=4)