# Gay Main Characters in SF **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 14, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001 "2013-06-14T17:21:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Infovore](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infovore/32/420_2.png) [@Infovore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Infovore)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2013, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/101 "2013-06-17T04:22:15Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > Oh, dear. Shades of McCaffrey’s dragonriders of Pern, where she insisted that green and blue dragonriders are always and only homosexuals – greens _always_ passive partners (with one woman green rider exception). And bronze dragonriders are always and only male heterosexuals. I don’t recall what prescribed roles she had for brown dragonriders. > > Also, I’m pretty sure none of the green or blue dragonriders were ever “main” characters. Although there’s been a lot more of those books since her son took over writing, so maybe by now there has been one. Well, in Lichtenberg’s defense, in the book where she called a real homosexual a “pervert,” it was clearly stated that the reason he was a pervert wasn’t that he was gay but that he purchased Gens for the purpose. Aside from that, she established (heh, sorry, Sime~Gen pun) that channels were physically incapable of being gay. I have much vaguer memories of this, but I seem to recall that even Jean Lorrah, her co-writer and longtime friend, tried to get her to loosen up on this but she stuck by her statement. Other Simes and Gens can be and are gay, but for channels it isn’t possible. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2013, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/102 "2013-06-17T11:53:32Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > Oh, dear. Shades of McCaffrey’s dragonriders of Pern, where she insisted that green and blue dragonriders are always and only homosexuals – greens _always_ passive partners (with one woman green rider exception). And bronze dragonriders are always and only male heterosexuals. I don’t recall what prescribed roles she had for brown dragonriders. Funny, such things were never explicitly mentioned in the books. Probably because, given the times, being explicit would have most likely prevented their publication or at least their widespread distribution. The hints are there if you’re looking for them, clearly the author was aware of the implications of how dragon mating habits would work for the human riders, but it’s pretty subtle. Brown riders would be bisexual - when a brown mated with a green dragon, well, there you go. They weren’t exclusively homosexual because F’nor was portrayed as having women lovers, including a gold rider (it’s a major plot point when at one point, a “mere” brown dragon confronted a gold dragon during a mating flight gone wrong in defense of another gold, because F’nor and Brekke were lovers). There is also the implication that gold riders are only heterosexual women as well. Actually, the dragons are really problematic in how their sex drives overwhelm not only their own riders but potentially other humans under a mating flight. In the first book F’lar’s and Lessa’s first mating flight between their dragons winds up in Lessa’s first sexual experience being either rape or damn close to it. On the other hand, having read the series, I also get the idea that the weyrs are the ONLY place on Pern it’s acceptable for a man to be homosexual. Dragons on Search might be selecting young homosexual men to be candidates as riders, potentially saving them from some nasty fate. Then again, the same people most up in arms about the whole situation might well diss MacCaffrey for depicting a quasi-medieval society as homophobic, even thought historically that’s nothing unusual. Pern has a significant death toll every Pass and not much in the way of medical science so maximizing human fertility is often a survival issue for the society. > [@](#): > > Also, I’m pretty sure none of the green or blue dragonriders were ever “main” characters. Although there’s been a lot more of those books since her son took over writing, so maybe by now there has been one. There has been at least one secondary character that was a blue rider, including some quite heroic actions. Also, more women as green as well as gold riders, as well as some hint that blue riders might well be mating with women green riders meaning blue riders are exclusive homosexuals, either. Which leaves the greens. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2013, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/103 "2013-06-17T11:58:08Z")
Oh, and Mirrim was a green rider that was a main character at times, but she was also a woman and thus not the typical green rider. ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2013, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/104 "2013-06-17T12:20:16Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Funny, such things were never explicitly mentioned in the books. Probably because, given the times, being explicit would have most likely prevented their publication or at least their widespread distribution. The hints are there if you’re looking for them, clearly the author was aware of the implications of how dragon mating habits would work for the human riders, but it’s pretty subtle. I seem to recall it all came out in a Pern… BBS? MUD? Some sort of online multiuser RPG back in the days when the web was mostly text-based. It was rather unenlightened, even for that time. I’d imagine that the Unfortunate Implications have aged even more poorly by today’s standards. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2013, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/105 "2013-06-17T15:16:47Z")
They don’t get any gayer than C-3PO. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2013, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/106 "2013-06-17T15:46:02Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > Sorry he didn’t fit whatever stereotype you have for gay men. Yes, my stereotypes for gay men, like showing affection or love for another man, or saying your gay. None of which Dumbledore does. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2013, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/107 "2013-06-17T23:20:09Z")
Since we’re including bisexual people, I’ll throw Dr. Frank N. Furter, from The Rocky Horror Picture Show, into the mix. ---
**Author:** ![Renifer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/71c47a/32.png) [@Renifer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renifer)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2013, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/108 "2013-06-18T03:48:58Z")
Ozymandias from _Watchmen_ is heavily implied to be gay in the graphic novel. The movie avoided any mention of his sexuality. If _The Iliad_ counts as speculative fiction, Achilles. There’s also the myth of Apollo pursuing Hyacinthus. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2013, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/109 "2013-06-18T04:10:23Z")
> [@Renifer](#): > > Ozymandias from _Watchmen_ is heavily implied to be gay in the graphic novel. The movie avoided any mention of his sexuality. Well, there’s the way he’s hanging out with David Bowie, Mick Jagger, and the Village People outside Studio 54 – plus the file marked _“Boys”_ on his computer. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2013, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-main-characters-in-sf/661001/110 "2013-06-19T00:36:28Z")
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