# Gay Man With A Caveat **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 1, 2002, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764 "2002-12-01T12:15:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![The\_Ace\_of\_Swords](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@The\_Ace\_of\_Swords](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ace_of_Swords)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2002, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/81 "2002-12-02T19:46:12Z")
**Iampunha** , please never use the phraseNaked Ann Coulter again. The mind reels. And I’m still a little queered by the usage: I’m sure not going to be comfortable calling y’all a bunch of “sexually deviant queers,” no matter how much some individual or the other might piss me off. Sounds too much like “defective homo” to me. I note that the debate is a little shaded, since “normal” words to categorize minorities are frequently “taken back” by the minority and canned. e.g. Colored-\>Person of Color-\>Black-\>African-American, handicapped-\>differently abled, Moron-\>Retard-\>Slow-\>Mentally challenged, etc. Many of these were “official” self-identifiers, only to be changed the next year, so yeah, we could agree on a word, but Act-Up could “sensitize” us to the insulting nature of it tomorrow. It’s all rather trendy and power through linguistic control – In times past, “queer” meant merely odd, strange, and “liberal,” meant flexible. Call me stubborn, I still don’t get the beef with “abnormal,” but… onto the wordplay: I think you really want to be able to say “X power!” Where X encompasses all the, for want of a better word, “abnormal” sexual flavors. (Hey, I like that – abnormal sexual flavors) So, let’s see: Hmm. **Nontraditional sexual power**? Well, I like it, but some people’d jump about all the gay traditions impugned. Ah, well. **Weakside hitter?** It’s abnormal but decent. But who plays volleyball? **Opposite field hitter power?** No, that won’t do. **Unusual sex power!** Ha! Sounds like a Japanese slogan. Product grants consumer **Unusual Sex Power!** Hei-Ya! Well, that’s the best I can do without a mandate… ---
**Author:** ![iampunha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/74df32/32.png) [@iampunha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iampunha)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2002, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/82 "2002-12-02T19:56:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Ace of Swords \* > **Iampunha** , please never use the phraseNaked Ann Coulter again. The mind reels. Good reel or bad reel?😃 ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2002, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/83 "2002-12-02T20:50:02Z")
I’d like to self-identify as queer, but I feel I should date a few men first. Homosexual, bisexual, or lesbian all sound too clinical. Gay seems to refer mostly to homosexual men these days. And most of the other terms suggested here, I don’t think I could say with a straight face. Er, let’s change that to “say without laughing.” Besides, queer is such a great word. It’s fun to say, and I like the additional connotation of unusual or uncommon. Doesn’t everyone want to think of themselves as unusual or uncommon? It sounds, I dunno, fun and intersting to me. I suppose it helps that I’ve never heard the word used as an insult in real life. I’ve never heard a homophobe get angry and call somone a queer. They usually go for something with more teeth in it. Clearly, the exact connotations of “queer” are going through a lot of flux right now, and everyone should keep that in mind. For those of us who like the term, we should keep in mind that a lot of people still don’t and we should be careful about using it in mixed company. And for those who still fell it’s an insult, just remember that there are a lot of people use the term entirely without bias or insult, and should give people the benefit of the doubt when they hear it used. Which, judging by this thread, is pretty much what people are already doing. No, don’t thank me for pointing out the obvious. Just doing my job. ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2002, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/84 "2002-12-02T21:18:37Z")
> [@](#): > > I’ve read many a thread in which my gay brothers and sisters have voiced being offended by certain terms (e.g., ‘lifestyle’; or the word gay used to mean ‘ **lame** ’). I hope you haven’t offended any crippled people with that careless remark. ---
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2002, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/85 "2002-12-02T21:53:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Miller \* > \*\*Clearly, the exact connotations of “queer” are going through a lot of flux right now, and everyone should keep that in mind. For those of us who like the term, we should keep in mind that a lot of people still don’t and we should be careful about using it in mixed company. And for those who still fell it’s an insult, just remember that there are a lot of people use the term entirely without bias or insult, and should give people the benefit of the doubt when they hear it used. > > Which, judging by this thread, is pretty much what people are already doing. No, don’t thank me for pointing out the obvious. Just doing my job. \*\* Sorry, but I’m going to have to thank you anyway. You’ve expressed very clearly and succinctly what I’ve been trying to say. Thanks much. Very well put. ---
**Author:** ![Kantalooppi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a5b964/32.png) [@Kantalooppi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kantalooppi)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2002, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/86 "2002-12-02T22:14:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by mazirian \* > \*\*I though “allosexual” referred to people who think the French Resistance is sexy? \*\* I keep getting reminded of Lt. Gruber. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ace\_of\_Swords](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@The\_Ace\_of\_Swords](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ace_of_Swords)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2002, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/87 "2002-12-02T22:52:56Z")
“Allosexual?” Sounds like you like to have sex with carnivorous Dinosaurs. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2002, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/88 "2002-12-03T08:36:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by astro \* > \*\*I think you seriously mis-understand the situation. For this to be true a gay man would have to be a person who likes an occasional dramatic flair to things, but doesn’t spend his every waking hour using vivid verbs, simpering, singing show tunes (on key natch), cruising, primping and worried about being fresh and fabulous enough. For this fantasy of yours to be true gay men would sometimes just like to sit down and drink a cup of good coffee in peace and quiet and watch the leaves fall, or get the paper and maybe check out the bookstore or the new toys at Circuit City and live their lives without having to embrace every “taking back the word” fashion the kids come up with. You would want some smidgen of respect for your sensibilities as a mature person to whom words have historical weight and meaning, and are tired of having old, ugly words put on the end of sticks and waved around as banners of freedom by people that don’t appreciate how this affects people who had to spend a lifetime fighting these words. Since gay people are not human beings with memories and a sense of propriety about language, but walking, talking caricatures living in the moment this cannot be true. \*\* 😕 All I get out of this is that gay men have identities as individuals, apart from their sexuality. Great, but I still don’t know if you agree with the OP or not. For **what** to be true? ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2002, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/89 "2002-12-04T21:11:31Z")
Personally, I like the word queer. To me it seems almost playful. It implies unusualness (but to me that is a good thing)… .I wasn’t raised thinking of “queer” as an insult. In fact, most of the GLBTX people that I know use the word. It becomes hard to remember who likes a word and who is offended… for the most part I just don’t use any word… but I think it would be nice if people could just deal with a word when it isn’t being used in a malicious way. Maybe you don’t like “queer” but if someone isn’t using it as an insult… shrug it off. Why be offended? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2002, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/90 "2002-12-04T23:06:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MrVisible \* > \*\*I dunno… at first glance, it looks like allosexual refers to someone who wants to hump allosauruses. \*\* Funny, I thought they were into succulent desert plants. Or maybe they were trying to soothe burns on their naughty bits… I know when I was a kid, we innocently played a game called “smear the queer,” in which one boy got a football, and all the other boys tried to tackle him. Eventually, the “queer” would throw the ball in the air, and another boy would catch it and become the new “queer.” When I was a boy, I had no idea what “queer” meant, and I’m horrified now at the game. At the same time, though a breeder, I’m thoroughly used to the word “queer” being used now as a value-free descriptor, applying to all sorts of non-straight folks. Hell, I’ve considered myself queer on occasions, being something of an androgynous sissyboy. I didn’t really realize that, outside of obnoxious childhood games, the word was still used as an epithet. In fact, I hear the word “gay” used as an epithet more often. Nonetheless, **CajunMan** , I figure it’s just plain good manners not to use words around someone that they don’t like. I’m glad to know that the word bothers some folks (as in, thanks for telling me – not as in, yay! you’re bothered!), and I’ll henceforth be more careful in using it. No way no how, though, am I talking about Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, Transgendered, and Allies. Too damn long. And it leaves out us sissies. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2002, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764/91 "2002-12-05T22:56:20Z")
I, too, frequently use “queer” to refer to the LGBT community. In fact, at my workplace, the Resource Center also often refers to the “queer community.” In general discussion or correspondence, I actually say “LGBT,” among friends I’ll say “queer,” and among gay friends I’ll say “fag.” All of them are either matter-of-fact or kidding around. I’m sorry you feel this way, **Cajun** , and I hope you understand that if I slip and use it in your presence (which I will endeavour to remember not to do) that I meant it to be inclusive, not insulting. Esprix [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gay-man-with-a-caveat/139764.md?page=4)