# Gaydar? Does it exist? Has it changed over the years? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 26, 2025, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433 "2025-01-26T15:28:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/21 "2025-01-26T18:57:53Z")
Out of curiosity, are there any famous men that you were surprised to learn were straight? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/22 "2025-01-26T19:05:45Z")
Personally, I default to assuming everyone I meet is straight until I know otherwise. Same goes for famous men/women who I will almost certainly never meet. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/23 "2025-01-26T19:14:19Z")
Having been around/among the gay community in San Francisco (during the AIDS epidemic as it happened), I find that my ability to sense people’s homosexuality is pretty good. But closeted gay men are often quite adept at hiding their orientation. People who are out are usually – for me – unsurprising. Lesbians, these days, mostly just act like people. Men who are gay sometimes do, and sometimes don’t. Like wearing opposite gender clothing, it’s far easier for women to do without drawing attention to it. I was gobsmacked recently though. My local hay farmer friend, who looks and acts just a good ol’ boy hay farmer, also, I learned (from him) has another side, which is completely female. Goes by she/her, dresses in short skirts, low cleavage tops, heels, wears a quite believable wig … They (and I feel sort of that’s it’s a plural not a singular they), told me that it’s so much easier being a hay farmer as a man. Talking machinery and fertilizer down at the bar to the other guys in the business – who know nothing about their other life – he’s a man, and then at home (they’re married to a woman), she’s a lady. They are perfectly happy with this arrangement. Also a great hay guy. Never met anyone who was so into hay. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/24 "2025-01-26T19:16:26Z")
Minor quibble with the thread. I don’t think “gaydar” exists, and similar tropes - for that matter, I think it is in a _very_ minor sense, harmful to consider it as a thing because it does tie into othering. Though TO BE CLEAR, I don’t think anyone in this thread is using it in that way. It’s just a minor irritation of mine, and I figured I’d share. Back to my post. The reason I don’t think it’s a “thing” is that we’re a species dependent upon communication, so we are all raised by our cultures to understand and pick up on all sorts of cues, verbal and non. And _obviously_ some people are a lot better at it than others! What people call “gaydar” is IMHO picking up on such clues / mannerisms / gazes / speech / et al and interpreting “that dude isn’t interested in girls” or “that dude is into that other guy” or the gender reversed version. Since most often it isn’t a conscious evaluation, we call it a hunch, or gaydar, or what have you. It’s the aggregate rather than just one thing. And yeah, as it becomes more commonly accepted, and our cultural database ages, it IS going to be harder even for the skilled to find those tells. Again, just wanting to give us credit for being clever social animals with good communication skills (some of us!) and move _away_ from saying there’s some sort of objective “difference” we’re picking up. Sorry for preaching - a friend of mine who is gay has been getting hit _really_ hard by the killing of DEI and protections, especially after years of not-so-subtle harassment from their chosen field and worse from their own family. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/25 "2025-01-26T19:38:28Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I had a former supervisor who, some years after I worked there, I heard he was involved in a scandal when he came out. All of my former co-workers were shocked, not at the news that he was gay, but at the news that he was closeted. I had figured that, even if he wasn’t gay, he at the very least didn’t mind people thinking that he was, because he was flaming to a point that couldn’t have just been subconscious. “Wait; you’re _out_? When were you _in_?” ---
**Author:** ![P-man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/p-man/32/3606_2.png) [@P-man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P-man)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/26 "2025-01-26T19:44:51Z")
Maybe the fact that I’m incapable of reading signals of interest made some people think I wasn’t interested in women. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/27 "2025-01-26T19:46:16Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Personally, I default to assuming everyone I meet is straight until I know otherwise. Well that is my point? I think most of us do that whether we are aware of it or not. I’m seeing it as not to dissimilar to the default assumptions people make across our society that the default state is Christian, white, straight, and depending on the job or context, male. Until we know otherwise. “Gaydar” is the collection of not explicit signals that the “straight” default state assumption may not apply. And I think when it pings accurately, which I believe it does more often than by chance, it is at some of the time because the individual at some level is attempting to communicate such at least across a limited bandwidth. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/28 "2025-01-26T19:46:33Z")
> [@P-man](#): > > Maybe the fact that I’m incapable of reading signals of interest That’s the default condition of straight men. ---
**Author:** ![P-man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/p-man/32/3606_2.png) [@P-man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P-man)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/29 "2025-01-26T20:25:32Z")
Also terrified to ask anyone out without seeing them. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/30 "2025-01-26T20:48:57Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Also a great hay guy. Never met anyone who was so into hay. Are you sure he’s not a strawman? ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/31 "2025-01-26T20:54:30Z")
No, that would be a _grain farmer_ (straw is a byproduct of growing grain). Just hay. Anyway, would they be a straw man or a straw woman? ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/32 "2025-01-26T20:56:40Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Personally, I default to assuming everyone I meet is straight until I know otherwise. In the part of the US where I live, I default the other way. But mainly, I just figure none of that’s my business anyway. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/33 "2025-01-26T20:57:10Z")
A straw man is far more likely to bale than a straw woman. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/34 "2025-01-26T21:08:28Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > It wasn’t obvious to me that Charles Nelson Riley or Paul Lynde were gay, You’re not alone. I was completely clueless until someone filled me in in my twenties. I didn’t even realize Liberace was gay until then. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/35 "2025-01-26T21:10:48Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > You’re not alone. I was completely clueless until someone filled me in in my twenties. Indeed. When I was a kid, and even a younger teenager, in the 1970s, I knew essentially nothing about homosexuality; I thought that Lynde and Reilly were hilarious and silly, and had no idea that their public personas were embodiments of gay stereotypes. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/36 "2025-01-26T21:15:34Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > I didn’t even realize Liberace was gay until then. “Yeah, and I can’t believe Liberace was gay. I mean, women loved him! I didn’t see that one coming.” ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/37 "2025-01-26T21:16:04Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > What people call “gaydar” is IMHO picking up on such clues / mannerisms / gazes / speech / et al and interpreting “that dude isn’t interested in girls” or “that dude is into that other guy” or the gender reversed version. Obviously. Did you think people meant the term as _actual_ gay radar? ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/38 "2025-01-26T21:25:10Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > ETA that I wonder if in domains that attract many gay men there is some straightdar that happens? Probably; to the extent that any straight people there are attempting to pass, they are the ones you need the special equipment to spot. Pegging someone’s gaydar is failure to pass. Jewish people talk about Jewdar as well, but pretty much just to the extent that a Jewish person might not be spotlighting their religion or ethnicity. Or, you’re watching a TV show with a Jewish character, and get into a discussion over whether the actor playing the character is really a member of the tribe. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/39 "2025-01-26T21:25:17Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I think the Gaydar works when someone gives you a look. Hard to define but a look that they are “interested.” > > It’s subtle and not always picked up on but it is there. I agree. It’s all in the eye-contact and how long it lasts. As Cecil said in his column linked upthread: > Gaydar works by eye contact. Straight men don’t meet each other’s eyes for long. There is a certain amount of time that men will look at each other before the social taboos kick in and ya sorta force yourself to look away. Gay men break that taboo and look at each other for longer. ---
**Author:** ![Newtosite](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/newtosite/32/8623_2.png) [@Newtosite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Newtosite)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433/40 "2025-01-26T21:40:33Z")
I’m always been good at identifying lesbian celebrities before they came out. In real life, I think there’s something about their jawline that tells me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gaydar-does-it-exist-has-it-changed-over-the-years/1013433.md?page=3)