# Gays now excluded from Catholic priesthood -- WTnonF? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 1, 2005, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614 "2005-12-01T20:41:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![meara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@meara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/meara)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2005, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614/41 "2005-12-05T03:02:12Z")
This doesn’t seem too surprising to me. The leaders of the Catholic Church are fairly anti-homosexual. The masses they’re preaching to are increasingly less so. The last thing those leaders want is to give pulpits to celibate gays who might not toe the Vatican line when it comes to condemning homosexuality. ---
**Author:** ![irishgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8edcca/32.png) [@irishgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/irishgirl)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2005, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614/42 "2005-12-05T07:00:16Z")
I wish I could link to it (I can’t, it’s subscription only) but the Irish Times on Saturday had two brilliant opinion pieces. One, by Senator David Norris (our openly gay member of the Irish Senate) on his response as a gay man to the Church’s latest and another opinion piece, where a gay former priest and a gay priest who is not in active ministry gave their resposnses. Basically, the gist is that the Church will accept alcoholism, addiction and paedophilia amongst it’s clergy, but not being gay (even if they are celibate). ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2005, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614/43 "2005-12-05T08:56:53Z")
> [@meara](#): > > This doesn’t seem too surprising to me. The leaders of the Catholic Church are fairly anti-homosexual. The masses they’re preaching to are increasingly less so. The last thing those leaders want is to give pulpits to celibate gays who might not toe the Vatican line when it comes to condemning homosexuality. I can’t believe this idea didn’t even cross my mind… :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Barely\_Adequate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/58956e/32.png) [@Barely\_Adequate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barely_Adequate)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2005, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614/44 "2005-12-05T09:16:15Z")
> [@Sal Ammoniac](#): > > …is the Catholic hierarchy interested in remaking the church, turning it from a church people belong to ethnically, to a church populated only by true believers? A much smaller but more faithful church, in a word? Yes. The Pope has said this very thing on more than one occasion. He has spoken of a “down-sizing” of the Church, and concentrating pastoral efforts to only those who are truly faithful to Church doctrine. The day of the “cafeteria Catholic” is gone. -Richard ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2005, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614/45 "2005-12-07T20:25:07Z")
> [@Barely Adequate](#): > > Yes. The Pope has said this very thing on more than one occasion. He has spoken of a “down-sizing” of the Church, and concentrating pastoral efforts to only those who are truly faithful to Church doctrine. !!! Really?! Are you sure?! I mean, that’s a 180-degree reversal of 20 centuries of Church policy! “Catholic” means “universal”! ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2005, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614/46 "2005-12-08T01:33:15Z")
Yes, **BrainGlutton** , but part of the idea now is that it be universally _orthodox_. It’s about a perceived need to do some “strenghtening the core” before resuming growth. Remember, the Church is drying up in the Western nations while still growing elsewhere, but Benny-16 and his school see the rise of the “cafeteria catholic”, and its potential spread, as a major threat that the Church may lose its doctrinal coherence and centrality. They also have not failed to notice the fast rate of growth of Evangelicals, Fundamentalists and Pentecostals (they overlap but are not one and the same) in formerly solid Catholic turf like South America and Central Europe, and in the "mission lands"of Africa and Asia; these being denominations more to the “right”. And why indeed not incorporate gays into priesthood “because they have to be celibate anyway”? Well, no, the church by now are quite conscious that a vow of celibacy does not equal therapy to get over whatever you want to get over. And as the institution is not going to change basic policy on gays any time in our lifetimes, **meara** is quite right about their not wanting priest who won’t convey the policy to his fullest. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gays-now-excluded-from-catholic-priesthood-wtnonf/333614.md?page=2)