# Genders for the Sun and the Moon **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 15, 2013, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319 "2013-01-15T19:31:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/61 "2013-01-17T04:07:57Z")
> [@smaje1](#): > > Also, I had been under the impression that General Questions was not as snarky as other, more opinion-based forums on the board. Aside from Comments on Cecil’s Columns/Staff Reports, General Questions is the forum that is most directly related to or patterned after Cecil’s own Straight Dope columns. > [@](#): > > Got a factual question for the Teeming Millions (and possibly Cecil) to consider? Post it here. And as I pointed out in the [MPSIMS thread you opened complaining about how this one went](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=679195), Cecil himself has been known to indulge in the snark at times, and perhaps the forum takes its tone from Cecil’s own example at least a little bit. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/62 "2013-01-17T05:12:35Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > To continue the female moon thing, I heard a ha-ha joke about moon phases a long time ago (I really did want a way to remember): > > “When the crescent moon looks like a ‘D’ that means it’s decreasing. But, since the moon is a woman, she’s lying, so it means the moon is increasing.” > > I don’t know if I have that right. I still don’t know which direction the lighting on the moon will go day by day when it looks like a ‘D.’ > [@Floater](#): > > This only works on the northern hemisphere. It’s the other way round south of the equator. In the Northern hemisphere - a [waxing moon](https://www.google.com/search?q=waxing+moon&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=w4X3UM73CIq5iwLmv4GICA&biw=1280&bih=633&sei=xoX3UPaNHqTliQK6kIGwAg) looks like a D, with the blacked-out side on the left. A [waning moon](https://www.google.com/search?q=waning+moon&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=aIf3UJWQJcm0igK3moG4Cw&biw=1280&bih=633&sei=bYf3UP-GGMb8igKZtoHgDA) has the blacked-out side to the right. To remember it, think of Loudon Wainwright - it wanes on the right. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/63 "2013-01-17T10:26:48Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > In the Northern hemisphere - a [waxing moon](https://www.google.com/search?q=waxing+moon&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=w4X3UM73CIq5iwLmv4GICA&biw=1280&bih=633&sei=xoX3UPaNHqTliQK6kIGwAg) looks like a D, with the blacked-out side on the left. A [waning moon](https://www.google.com/search?q=waning+moon&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=aIf3UJWQJcm0igK3moG4Cw&biw=1280&bih=633&sei=bYf3UP-GGMb8igKZtoHgDA) has the blacked-out side to the right. To remember it, think of Loudon Wainwright - it wanes on the right. And I was taught as a child that when the moon looks like a comma it’s coming. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/64 "2013-01-17T13:06:19Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > It should be noted also that in Tolkien’s _Silmarillion_, the Sun is carried by a female “angel” and the moon by a male one. Neither sun nor moon themselves have gender, though…one is a flower and one is a fruit. Technically, wouldn’t a fruit be considered female? It’s a flower that’s been pollinated and now is bearing seed. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/65 "2013-01-17T18:15:02Z")
Well, in Spanish they can be _frutas_ (f) or _frutos_ (m)… _La pera es una fruta, es el fruto del peral_ (A pear is a fruit, it’s the fruit a peartree gives) _Fruto_ is sort of more technical and it may include non-edible fruits, but other than that they’re synonymous. ---
**Author:** ![Wakinyan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wakinyan/32/352_2.png) [@Wakinyan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wakinyan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/66 "2013-01-19T14:51:55Z")
> [@smaje1](#): > > Does anyone have citeable information about whether the Sun and the Moon are considered either masculine or feminine? > > I’ve always been led to believe that the Moon is a “she,” but I’m not so sure about the Sun. And I’d like to have a cite to back it up. > > Thanks! I had reason to look into this myself recently, because I took for granted that the Sun more or less universally was considered masculine and then I thought, is it really so? In his book _Hermes_, Harris says that that the Sun is masculine and the Moon is feminine is universal, but it was written a very long time ago and now we know that that isn’t true. Even a glance at this subject shows that gender associated with the Sun and Moon differs among cultures. According to _Standard Dictionary of Folklore, Mythology and Legend_, “Though the Moon is often feminine and the Moon deity a goddess, often the Moon god is male and the Moon is a man…” But generally speaking, the Father god or creator is often a sky god and associated with the Sun, which makes the Sun masculine; the Moon is often associated with fertility and menstruation and so associated with femininity (see for instance _Patterns in Comparative Religion_, by Eliade). This is quite clear in Greek mythology for instance (Selene, Artemis and Hekate are all “Moon goddesses”; Zeus a sky god and Apollo a Sun god as well as Helios and so forth). In Roman mythology there is Sol and Luna, male and female, respectively. In Egyptian mythology, however, the male gods Thot and Khensu were a Moon gods, but other male gods, like Horus and Ra, were a Sun gods. In England there is on the one hand “The Man in the Moon”, but on the other the Moon is referred to as “she”. The Germanic/Celtic Sunna (Sun) is a goddess, and in the _Poetic Edda_ the Sun a “she” and the Moon a “he”, but to the best of my knowledge there were no particular gods associated with Sun and Moon, and no particular Sun or Moon cult either during the Viking Age. Also, according to\* The Dictionary of Phrase and Fable\* (Brewer) the Moon “is masculine in all the Teutonic languages”. In alchemy the Sun always seems to be masculine and Moon feminine; see for instance _Psychology and Alchemy_ (Jung) where there are, if nothing else, numerous alchemical images with Sun-King on the one hand, and Moon-Queen on the other; I have not seen the opposite, but I am not an expert on the matter. Some North American cultures considered the Sun masculine (Navaho, Zuñi, for instance), others as feminine (Yuchi, Eskimo, for instance). Whether the Moon is male or female does not only differ among different cultures, but it is not even consistent within some cultures; for instance, the Jicarilla regards the Moon as “female (in connection with the with the menstrual cycle), but in ceremonial race Moon is represented as a male” (_Standard Dictionary_…). On the other hand it is much more common that personifications of the Sun is a male figure all over North America. In Australia there are personifications of the Sun which are female, on the other hand. In the larger cultures of Central and South America the Sun was, it seems, almost exclusively masculine. While in Japan Amaterasu of course is the Sun goddess and Tsukiyomi is the Moon god. One could go on like this for a long time, but this is sufficient to show that Harris was wrong and that it simply differs among cultures whether Sun and Moon is masculine or feminine. I have mentioned a few books along the way, books I have in English in my library, since you asked for “citable information”; but if there is one source I would recommend regarding this subject it’d be _Patterns in Comparative Religion_, chapters “The Sun and Sun-Worship” and “The Moon and its Mystique” – especially the latter is a fascinating read. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/67 "2013-01-19T16:24:32Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > In the Northern hemisphere - a [waxing moon](https://www.google.com/search?q=waxing+moon&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=w4X3UM73CIq5iwLmv4GICA&biw=1280&bih=633&sei=xoX3UPaNHqTliQK6kIGwAg) looks like a D, with the blacked-out side on the left. A [waning moon](https://www.google.com/search?q=waning+moon&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=aIf3UJWQJcm0igK3moG4Cw&biw=1280&bih=633&sei=bYf3UP-GGMb8igKZtoHgDA) has the blacked-out side to the right. To remember it, think of Loudon Wainwright - it wanes on the right. > [@Floater](#): > > And I was taught as a child that when the moon looks like a comma it’s coming. Thanks to both. ---
**Author:** ![HardlySanguine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HardlySanguine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HardlySanguine)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2013, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/68 "2013-01-20T13:21:17Z")
> [@smaje1](#): > > Wow, I was expecting straighter answers from General Questions. 😕 It sounded more like you were expecting Bi answers. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2013, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/69 "2013-01-20T15:32:53Z")
Since “ship” has been mentioned as a “she,” bikers often refer to their bicycles as a “she.” ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2013, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/70 "2013-01-22T13:27:27Z")
The sun is a “she.” You can tell because of its gigantic vagina. ---
**Author:** ![Indian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c0e974/32.png) [@Indian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indian)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/71 "2013-01-22T15:24:46Z")
OP, In Hindu scriptures, both are are Gods of masculine gender. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/72 "2013-01-22T17:46:28Z")
In Sanskrit, all the planets are masculine. That includes both _Sūrya_ (sun) and _Candra_ (moon), and even _Śukra_ (Venus). In Arabic, _shams_ (sun) is feminine, while _qamar_ (moon) is masculine. Tolkien put a footnote to a Hobbit song in _The Lord of the Rings_, “The Man in the Moon Stayed Up Too Late,” in which the sun is called “She,” saying: “Elves (and Hobbits) refer to the Sun as _She_.” ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319/73 "2013-01-23T08:14:19Z")
In Watership Down, I believe both the sun (Frith, their god) and moon (Inlé) are male. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genders-for-the-sun-and-the-moon/647319.md?page=3)