# General anesthetic prior to death sentence? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 30, 2014, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403 "2014-04-30T22:59:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![AaronX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7bcc69/32.png) [@AaronX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AaronX)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2014, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/41 "2014-05-03T02:47:40Z")
Aren’t army medics trained to hit veins? ---
**Author:** ![Tripler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripler/32/21807_2.png) [@Tripler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tripler)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/42 "2014-05-04T02:36:17Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > No, there isn’t, because such people have medical ethics also. Ohhhh, got it. :smack: > [@pravnik](#): > > That actually appears to be what happened in Oklahoma - a phlebotomist inserted the IV under a doctor’s observation. A nurse probably wouldn’t actually insert the IV for the same reason that a doctor wouldn’t. > > [DOC Releases Timeline Of Clayton Lockett’s Execution](http://www.news9.com/story/25405591/doc-releases-timeline-of-clayton-locketts-execution) Interesting read. I guess I didn’t realize that halting or the “calling off” of an execution already underway needs Governors’ approval. > [@AaronX](#): > > Aren’t army medics trained to hit veins? Yeah, they are. I’ve ran with a bunch of them that carried IV bags on their hips. These are the guys, with the right training, that could be hired onto Prison Guard Staffs to perform the insert under a doctor’s watch. But **Fear Itself** is right–they probably have licensing issues with ethics required. I guess I’m also confused why we can’t find the once-available compounds in the US, or some other known compound. I mean, propofol, IIRC was what killed Michael Jackson. We can’t just use _that_ (or some other known compound)? Tripler Not trying to be smug, but just common sensical. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/43 "2014-05-04T04:07:14Z")
As posted earlier, wouldn’t you be running the risk that drug companies would stop providing those anaesthetics to death states? Thereby making it more difficult for general surgical uses to find sources for the drug ? ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/44 "2014-05-05T15:20:32Z")
Why wouldn’t they simply tie down the patient’s arm and slit his wrist. A topical anesthetic to dull the pain. Or is it blood pouring into a bucket is somehow cruel and unusual but injections with weird drugs isn’t? Or give them a sedative then shoot them at point-blank range. The guy in _No Country for Old Men_ had an effective method. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/45 "2014-05-05T17:32:44Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Wait, would an anesthetic actually even do anything? As I understand it, most modern general anesthetics _don’t_ actually prevent you from feeling pain: What they do is prevent you from _remembering_ the pain afterwards. But if someone’s getting executed, it’s pretty much a given that they’re not going to remember the pain, isn’t it? Quick question to any who know. If you felt the pain, wouldn’t that affect your vital signs and all of that? I mean, the body’s response to pain generally involve changes in heart beat, blood pressure, a release of various hormones, etc. If the anaesthetic effect was incomplete, wouldn’t that show up on the machine that goes ping? I suspect the answer is a bit more complicated than that, but as a general idea would that hold true? ---
**Author:** ![Pjen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Pjen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pjen)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/46 "2014-05-05T18:17:40Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Quick question to any who know. If you felt the pain, wouldn’t that affect your vital signs and all of that? I mean, the body’s response to pain generally involve changes in heart beat, blood pressure, a release of various hormones, etc. If the anaesthetic effect was incomplete, wouldn’t that show up on the machine that goes ping? I suspect the answer is a bit more complicated than that, but as a general idea would that hold true? I am very rusty, but when I was taught this in order to assist an anaesthetist there are three parts to a General Anaesthetic. There is Sedation- reduction of normal reaction to fear and discomfort, hypnosis, the induction of a sleep like brain state so that awareness is reduced, and Analgesia to reduce the reaction to pain or to stop pain signals being sent. The problems is that too much of one or all drugs involved can result in loss of normal levels of BP, temp, resps etc, so an anaesthetist is balancing all three things- sedation, hypnosis and analgesia. In many cases it is safest to use drugs that block memory of the trauma more effectively rather than increase the levels of sedation, hypnosis or analgesia as this allows better stats during the operation. The result is that the patient would show reaction to pain and discomfort- increased resps, BP etc, increaded cortisol, and actually experience some pain, but that this memory would be blocked by the new component. It is thought that some post-op psychological trauma is due to an unremembered PTSD like reaction. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2014, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/47 "2014-05-06T02:51:23Z")
Why not a face mask and nitrous oxide? Criminal falls asleep then stays asleep when the oxygen is cut off. I’ve had nitrous before dental surgery and the only negative part was the feeling that 45 minutes had completely disappeared from my life, but the doctor did make an effort to keep me alive. Both N2O and O2 are available OTC; the nitrous used for whipped cream comes in little tanks like CO2 cartridges and doesn’t have the SO2 the hot rodder version has–fast cars can smell like farts. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2014, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/48 "2014-05-06T17:42:35Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Why not a face mask and nitrous oxide? Criminal falls asleep then stays asleep when the oxygen is cut off. I’ve had nitrous before dental surgery and the only negative part was the feeling that 45 minutes had completely disappeared from my life, but the doctor did make an effort to keep me alive. Both N2O and O2 are available OTC; the nitrous used for whipped cream comes in little tanks like CO2 cartridges and doesn’t have the SO2 the hot rodder version has–fast cars can smell like farts. or helium. Anything that displaces oxygen in the lungs will result in the person passing out and dieing. N2O would probably be more pleasant as the person would drift off instead of pass out. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2014, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403/49 "2014-05-06T18:47:05Z")
As regards doctors’ ethics, whilst it is preferable they not be co-opted into death squads, _someone’s_ gonna do it and I’d rather it not be someone jabbing blindly, in the same manner as a number of headsmen on big occasions, such as at Monmouth’s topping. And I’m fairly certain — from a misspent youth reading 19th century fiction including Conan Doyle’s medical short stories ( he was a _sick puppy_ in many ways ) — earlier doctors not only administered the _coup de grace_ to those badly injured on the battlefield like napoleonic pioneers tapping horses with their sacrificial axes, but to babies immediately after birth in some instances. And I’m grateful. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-anesthetic-prior-to-death-sentence/687403.md?page=2)